[Deck] Solidarity

[konjink]

Why don't you side a Hydroblast instead of repeal (I'm assuming you're using the same SB as your last report)? Is it because there aren't many goblins in your meta?

[Mictlantecuhtli]

They've finally started organising monthly Legacy tourneys around where i live after years of only Standard and Limited at our local shop! So my first tourney will be in a couple of weeks time and i will likely be playing Solidarity. I'm currently testing a conventional mono blue build with 1 Cryptic Command maindeck.

The sideboard below is probably ok for an unknown meta (you know, at least unknown for the first tourney), but comments will be appreciated.

1 Stroke of Genius
1 Meditate
1 Turnabout
1 Rebuild
1 Mystical Tutor
2 Hydroblast
2 Twincast
2 Wipe Away
2 Echoing Truth
2 Disrupt

Also, since i haven't played much lately, i have no experience whatsoever against Merfolk. In cjva's report, it sounds like it's an extremely difficult matchup. I was wondering, what's everyone's experience/sideboard plan against Merfolk?

[cjva]

Every matchup that present a fast clock and back it up with some sort of disruption is rather hard. The best with this deck is that you can play around many of the things.

My main problem with merfolk is the cursecatchers. Makes every spell you play 1 mana more expensive, more or less.

Im not a fan of hydroblast, but that might be becouse there aint that many goblins in my meta anymore.

When it comes down to the discussion about Bahamuth's list with green splash, Van Phanels list and the original list i whould say that the Van Phanel list is the way to go.

[Bahamuth]

I'd start out with Van Phanel's list too. I'd still play a Brain Freeze sideboard, but that's up to you. Also, consider cutting a Cryptic Command for a Remand, since learning how Remand is used best is pretty important.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Thanks for your replies.

@ cjva: I will surely do some testing against Merfolk over MWS before the toruney but your pointers are very welcome, especially since the deck is relatively new (at least in its current configuration), and given that the Magic community around here is primarily focused on Standard, i wouldn't be surprised to run into mono U or UW merfolk decks.

I'm including Hydroblast in the sideboard just out of discipline i guess, as i really haven't got a clue as to which decks people will be playing. Hopefully i'll be able to modify this sideboard according to the meta after the first tourney.

@ Bahamut: I'm certainly running 4 Remand and just 1 Command for two reasons. One is that i have never felt that 4 Remands are too many. And i only own one Command anyway.

Edit: As for the Brain Freeze in the SB, i have run it for a long time. I don't necessarily think it is wasted SB space but i don't use it often (it has actually won me games when i've needed it though - so i'll chew on it).

Cheers

[GoldenCid]

Didn't you read the opening post in the first place?




Same works for Colossus, Progenitus etc.

Yeah. But i don't understand the sequence of events taht allows you to win the game.

You play your lethal "brain freeze". Gaea's falls into yard and triggers its ability...in this point you respond with another freeze / remand?? Then the stroke of genious must be played before the second gaea's trigger??

[Elfrago]

Yeah. But i don't understand the sequence of events taht allows you to win the game.

You play your lethal "brain freeze". Gaea's falls into yard and triggers its ability...in this point you respond with another freeze / remand?? Then the stroke of genious must be played before the second gaea's trigger??

At that point you have to play something that makes your opponent draw (Stroke, Words of Wisdom...). Since Gaea's is still on stack your opponent library is still empty, and you know what happens when someone tries to draw from an empty library...

Colossus is different, since it won't give you priority before his ability resolves.
So your opponent will end with only colossus in his library and you will have to make him draw 2 cards to win on the spot. Oh, btw, nobody plays Colossus in Legacy.

[Van Phanel]

Why don't you side a Hydroblast instead of repeal (I'm assuming you're using the same SB as your last report)? Is it because there aren't many goblins in your meta?

Because they do entirely different things. Repeal works as an additional bounce against CB and as a flexible slot against agressive decks. Hydroblast only does the latter.


@ Mictlantecuhtli:

Merfolk is ugly but winnable matchup. They don't play Brainstorm so they rarely draw more than 1 FoW and by turn 4-5, you should be able to win through that. You obviously can't win against their goddraw, but Solidarity can rarely win against the goddraw of any blue deck. The most important thing is playing right into Cursecatchers early on so you don't lose to them and Daze. Be careful with fetchlands just like in any matchup against Stifle and you should have a chance. The matchup gets worse if they play Spellstutter Sprite or even Vendilion Clique though.

[Julian23]

After all I'm still missing some advice in van Phanels primer on keeping / mulliganing hands. Goldfishing provided me with some insight on this but I was hoping some of the more experienced players could share their knowledge on this topic.

- (When) Do you keep 1-land-hands?
- Do you keep hands without Tide,Untapeffect and Meditate? If so, do you at least want Impulse / Cunning Wish?
- Would you always mulligan for e.g. at least one FoW (on the draw) against stuff like TPS and only keep really good hands without FoW?
- any "rule of thumb" you follow in general?

[Funky-kun]

I'll try to contribute.

- (When) Do you keep 1-land-hands?

Usually when I have 2 or more 1-cost cantrips. There are exceptions to the rule of course. A hand with double FOW and only one land might be keepable agaings combo. Also, don't risk hands with only one fetch when playing against stifle-packing decks on the draw.

- Do you keep hands without Tide,Untapeffect and Meditate? If so, do you at least want Impulse / Cunning Wish?

As always, depends on the decks you play agains. When opposing a deck slower than 4-5 turn kill average (say, slower than Gobbos and Zoo) such hands are perfectly fine. If the hand does not have any of the "holy trinity", it can consist of cantrips only (OK), protection and cantrips (OK) and protection only (not very OK xD).

- Would you always mulligan for e.g. at least one FoW (on the draw) against stuff like TPS and only keep really good hands without FoW?

I haven't got a definite question against this after the hundreds of matches against SI I have tested. Hands with possible turn 3 kill seem OK to keep if they have a cantrip, so you can have a chance of finding protection if needed. If you try to mull into FOW, you get easily destroyed by discard. It is a blind guess. Sometimes you can be a lucksack and can goldfish turn2 xD.

- any "rule of thumb" you follow in general?

The "land rule".

[cjva]

After all I'm still missing some advice in van Phanels primer on keeping / mulliganing hands. Goldfishing provided me with some insight on this but I was hoping some of the more experienced players could share their knowledge on this topic.

- (When) Do you keep 1-land-hands?
- Do you keep hands without Tide,Untapeffect and Meditate? If so, do you at least want Impulse / Cunning Wish?
- Would you always mulligan for e.g. at least one FoW (on the draw) against stuff like TPS and only keep really good hands without FoW?
- any "rule of thumb" you follow in general?

I can give my reasoning as well.

1 Land hand. - Never! I tend to get owned by 1-land hands even when i have opt, opt, brainstorm and maybee some other random cantrip on it. Small exception if i have FoW or FoW x2 against fast combo like belcher or storm and i have reason to belive that they have a good start.

I sometimes keep hands without parts of the combo. That is when i know i play against a slow deck, and dont need to stress a win. These hands often consists of many cantrips.

I whouldnt mull for FoW against fast combo if i havent got a tell when they draw their hand. More often then not they cant win before turn 3 anyways. When you drop your second land you can start time-walking with remands and if its postboard i tend to have disrupt in the deck as well, gaining some more time against them.

I have three rules of thumb.

1: You need to drop land, every single turn. (up to turn 4-5) Its crucial, its your way to win.
2: Think creative. Improve your game. Find new ways of using/miss using the stack.
3: Dont win until you need to. Unless your blue opponent are taped out and has given you a window.

[ScatmanX]

I recently became aware of a deck called Red Tide, aka Solidarity with a red splash. I searched the deck, and found a list:

Mainboard:

4 Meditate
4 High Tide
4 Impulse
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Reset
3 Remand
3 Turnabout
3 Brain Freeze
3 Cunning Wish
2 Stroke of Genius
2 Think Twice
2 Opt
10 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
2 Volcanic Island

Sideboard:
4 Disrupt
2 Twincast
1 Urza's Rage
1 Sudden Shock
1 Starstorm
1 Stroke of Genius
1 Rebuild
1 Wipe Away
1 Echoing Truth
1 Turnabout
1 Thirst for Knowledge

Does 1 Urza's Rage, 1 Sudden Shock and 1 Starstorm really improve the deck? Is it viable? Toying around with splashes, this seemed to me the weakest (green has Krosn Grip, white has Chant, and black has discard, Glimpse the Unthinkable and Lim-dul's vault).

Thoughts?

[Van Phanel]

@ScatmanX:

Playing the Red Tide doesn't make sense at the moment. At all. That list was made by David Gearhart at a time when UBW Fish was running rampant and lots of maindeck Meddling Mages were played.


@Julian:

a) 1-landers: It depends. I tend to be very liberal when it comes to keeping one-landers, but some rules still apply. Everytime I see a one-land hand, I do a risk versus reward calculation (estimated only of course). The number of one-mana cantrips, Impulses and combopieces and the matchup play a role here, but there is no rule of thumb.

I'll draw some hands with MWS and give my reasoning and add this to the opening post when I have time.


b) Again I keep pretty much any hand that looks somehow keepable. Again depending on matchup and exact contents of the hand. Pretty much any hand with Brainstorm + Fetch + at least two lands is a keep for me, FoW helps and so on. Only if the hand gets very clunky with lots of Cunning Wish, Turnabout, Flash of Insight, I tend to mulligan.


c) Not at all. If I have FoW, I'm glad but again if the hand has a Twincast or even Disrupt or only cantrips I'm usually just fine. The trick is that those decks tend to not go off before turn 3 and very rarely on turn two with protection and even if you have a single FoW, you usually don't win. Cantripping into disruption by turn three is usually rather easy whereas mullganing into a perfect hand gets more risky with every mulligan.


d) My rule of thumb is. "When in doubt, keep." Thanks to all the cantrips, Solidarity is very good in changing a mediocre hand into an amazing one in a very short time.

[Wargoos]

Well thats an old list I guess, back from the time when the 6er guy used to play soli.
Nowadays you would cut that rage and starstorm for the awesome banefire. Pretty good winoption I guess.

€dit: Goddamit! Ninja'd by Phanel.

[Van Phanel]

Well thats an old list I guess, back from the time when the 6er guy used to play soli.
Nowadays you would cut that rage and starstorm for the awesome banefire. Pretty good winoption I guess.

€dit: Goddamit! Ninja'd by Phanel.

Also Banefire is sorcery...

Fail.

[DragoFireheart]

Has anyone considered trying to implement SDTs and Etherium Sculptors?

With 2 tops out and a sculptor, you can deck them in the same turn with a brainfreeze.

[Zinch]

I will play helm of awakening before etherium sculptor: it's unnafected by creature hate and reduces the cost of all your spells, not only the artifact ones
But even then, those cards don't have a place in Solidarity: thay don't solve any problem Solidarity has and are not instants.

[Jak]

Has anyone considered trying to implement SDTs and Etherium Sculptors?

With 2 tops out and a sculptor, you can deck them in the same turn with a brainfreeze.

No.

[Zinch]

Thinking about our worst match up, I've found one forbidden card: Submerge
Has anyone tried it in the sideboard? It's outside of counterbalance range, it gives you 2 turns to find an answer to it or to sculpt your hand (and everyone knows who wins in the lategame)... and is free!
What do you think?

[Jak]

Thinking about our worst match up, I've found one forbidden card: Submerge
Has anyone tried it in the sideboard? It's outside of counterbalance range, it gives you 2 turns to find an answer to it or to sculpt your hand (and everyone knows who wins in the lategame)... and is free!
What do you think?

It doesn't do anything to Counterbalance though. Wipe Away bounces it so you can actually go off.