Relic Orb Prison

[clavio]

Here is the list I went 4-2 at the Vestal $1500 tournament:

15 Island
4 Rishadan Port
2 Academy Ruins
1 Dust Bowl
3 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale

4 Force of Will
4 Winter Orb
4 Relic Barrier
3 Tangle Wire
4 Propaganda
2 Echoing Truth
4 Mana Leak
2 Counterspell
4 Impulse
2 Call the Skybreaker
3 Relic of Progenitus

SB:
4 Washout
4 Hurkyl's Recall
3 Trinisphere
4 Chill

-----

So basically a Winter Orb Prison deck. Relic barrier taps Winter Orb to make the effect asymmetrical. Propaganda and Tabernacle are obviously huge with Worb in play. Tangle Wire Is also pretty devastating.

I know Relic Barrier seems janky as hell, but Icy Manipulator just costs way too much under orb. However, I would be willing to listen to other alternatives to relic barrier.

Ports tighten the lock. Academy ruins are really good here, either recuring tangle wire or bringing back a winter orb that gets destroyed.

I really like call the skybreaker as a wincon right now.

One suggestion that I got was to run Petrified field. Wasteland is sometimes a problem since the lands in this deck are so important to it's gameplan.

As far as the sideboard goes, Washout comes in against merfolk/goblins/elves. Chill is important because Burn decks can still play most of their spells under the orb lock. Hurkyl's recall because I always seem to face affinity. Trinisphere comes in against combo I guess. It's really good with Winter Orb but I dont have enough room for it main deck. Storm combo isnt really too much of a concern in my meta (even though it ended up winning the whole thing....)


So yesterday when I was playing the deck I beat goblins 2-0. I didnt even draw that well, goblins is just a really good matchup. Then I lost to Merfolk 1-2. Merfolk should be a good matchup, but I almost never saw tabernacle. He was also an expert player. Then I got completely railed by ITF. I dont think Winter Orb ever stuck. Then I beat counter slivers 2-0. Another Pretty good matchup, they dont play that many lands so things like propaganda is pretty rough on them. Beat some counterbalance deck (not really up on deck names these days...) with progenitus 2-1. I made some pretty sick top decks in that matchup, stabilizing at 3 one game and stabilizing at 8 when he had progenitus in another. Last matchup I faced a thresh type deck with a black splash for confidant and red for magus of the moon. I went 2-0 even though he boarded in about 1000 cards game 2.

Dustbowl was pretty useless.

So basically I want to make this deck beat up on aggro and control.

[Paradigm Shift]

You might want to try to fit manlands + Standstill in. When you have WOrb, Barrier, and Standstill, it means that you get to attack on your turns, and when your opponent finally breaks your Standstill, he will be tapped down on his next turn while you are untapped with a grip of cards.

[Jason]

This is a very cool list; I'm just wondering, with only 22 lands that tap for mana and only Impulse to smooth the draws, how frequently does this deck mulligan? How well does this deck run if you are stuck on only 2 - 4 lands?

[gobblor]

I have a question. Winter orbs most recent printing doesn't says the "Whle this card remains untapped" part. Did they change the ruling back to the original text of the card?

[morgan_coke]

If you want an alternative to Relic Barrier, you can run Blinkmoth Well in its place, but then you're much more vulnerable to LD/Wasteland.

Gobblor, the oldest versions of Orb don't say "when untapped" because back in the days of things like "Mono Artifact", all artifacts were turned off when they were tapped. It was part of the game rules then.

[Jeff Kruchkow]

you def need an alt win con besides call. losing to an extirpate is a bad place to be.

[gobblor]

Are the Relics of Progen x3 really necessary?
For alt win cons you could maybe replace some lands with factories.

[Jeff Kruchkow]

Are the Relics of Progen x3 really necessary?
For alt win cons you could maybe replace some lands with factories.

I think a creature would be better than factory. The fact is that with just factory, you will have a horrendous B/x matchup if they board extirpate since they can just chill and use waste to kill your threats backed up by extirpate.

[clavio]

I guess Ill reply to all of you in one post


Manlands seems like a great idea even if I cant fit standstill in the deck. I might try standstill in the relic of progenitus slot.

This deck mulligans a bit, but its not terrible. 3 lands is generally fine, but you have to look out for hands that a single wasteland will wreck. Ive done ok with some pretty sketchy hands. The curve of the deck is pretty low, the only things that cost more than 3 are fow (whatever) and the wincon which I dont cast until I lock them out.

As far as blinkmoth well, I tried it but it has issues. You have to tap 3 lands in order to use its effect. Since Im using 22 lands with the low curve (see above) it sometimes doesn't even net me any mana.

As far as alt wincon, meh. Nobody runs extirpate main deck. In theory I should be able to cast cts before it goes into the graveyard. Academy ruins is a backup win condition. I could run a 1/1 split with morphling, but morphling sucks compared to cts and I cant find anything else thats even close.

As far as relic of progenitus, it can slow down tarmogoyf. Sometimes goyf gets really big really fast and can punch through enough damage before I can lock the game down. Relic slows him down quite a bit. Also its randomly badass against ichorid. Not sure how necessary it is, but it cantrips in matchups where its useless and comes up big when its useful.

[einhorn303]

In addition to being additional wincons, Mishra's Factory's might also help the deck out by drawing attention away from your other lands and becoming Wasteland targets.

Is Krosan Grip during the upkeep phase off the draw very bothersome? That seems to be the most widely played Disenchant-effect these days.

I could also see Aether Vial being problematic, getting around counters and the Winter Orb lock. Though I guess that's what Propaganda is for.

[clavio]

Yes, Krosan Grip is a pain in the ass. It's not a total beating or anything, but it's annoying. It also costs 3 which is quite a bit under orb. Academy ruins tries to help there.

Aether Vial is kind of bad and I try to fow it when it comes down turn 1. If goblins lands aether vial it is possible for them to do some damage if they get their ducks in a row.

Since Im going to be playing a few less islands counterspell doesnt seem as viable. Im thinking about the new 1cc counter in ZEN. Thoughts?

[hi-val]

You could run Tezzeret as a win condition. He can grab random utility beater, a lock piece or just ramp up to go March of the Machines on the opponent.

[clavio]

Ive tried it. Tezzeret is generally too slow to do anything other than be a wincon and I think he is inferrior to cts.

[gobblor]

Yes, Krosan Grip is a pain in the ass. It's not a total beating or anything, but it's annoying. It also costs 3 which is quite a bit under orb. Academy ruins tries to help there.

Aether Vial is kind of bad and I try to fow it when it comes down turn 1. If goblins lands aether vial it is possible for them to do some damage if they get their ducks in a row.

Since Im going to be playing a few less islands counterspell doesnt seem as viable. Im thinking about the new 1cc counter in ZEN. Thoughts?

I think the new spell counter in Zendikar would be a fine replacement if you feel you will not be able to cast counterspell all the time. I like it because if you have orb in hand and they can pay the 2 mana, then you drop orb on your turn you have them set back 2 lands under orb.

[DragoFireheart]

Wouldn't elf decks be stupidly hard to fight? I mean, the half of the little bastards make mana, and some of the new list have No/Pro.

[clavio]

Yeah elves are pretty bad. I pretty much have to counter priest of titania and other elves that make more than one mana. Tabernacle is still really good against them. Game 2 I bring in washout which is really good against them. I actually used to play cursed totem in the sideboard.

[clavio]

Brought this deck to a tournament. I need a wincon that costs less than seven. Esperzoa seems pretty neat, esp since it can gate a tangle wire when it has a small number of counters. It doesnt really have any protection though.

I tested Mishra's factory. It's terrible. This should have been obvious since decks bring in winter orb against decks that play factory.

I lost one match because I got totally land fucked. I guess it happens.

right now my sideboard is:

4 pithing needle
4 chill
4 washout (seems weak)
3 trinisphere

[FluffyPinkBunnies]

Have you tried Submerge in the SB yet? Im not sure on replacing Wash Out for it, but either way it may be something to look into.

[Jason]

Brought this deck to a tournament. I need a wincon that costs less than seven. Esperzoa seems pretty neat, esp since it can gate a tangle wire when it has a small number of counters. It doesnt really have any protection though.

Sphinx of Jwar Isle? It costs 6, so that might be too close to 7 where Call the Skybreaker is equally valid. Its mana cost makes it fundamentally cost the same as Morphling and has the same relevancy. Problem is, it dies to mass removal or counter magic and doesn't come back.

[clavio]

I think anything more than four is probably too much.

Submerge will only bounce one elf, but its worth free. It doesnt do anything against merfolk.