Eternal Dragon gets you that Basic Plains under Blood Moon. I've had CounterTop board that bull shit in against me before, as well as Vial Goblins.
Edit. I've stolen games against Merfolk and Zoo before by just casting a topdecked Dragon. Sometimes against those decks, you have to sacrifice card advantage to stay alive. Topdecking Dragon is one of the few things that are helpful in turning the game around when you and your opponent are having topdeck wars.
ICBE - We're totally the coolest Anti-Thesis ever.
"The Citrus-God just had a Citrus-Supernova... in your mouth."
i just did the same thing against zoo with e dragon the other night against my team-mate. it just happens.
however with that said i think activating a manland every turn to perform the same function (minus the ability to fix ur mana to basic plains.) is so much worse. i agree that there is a certain point at which landstill should just win the game with whatever, but i do not think that whatever is this 4/4 for 5cc manland every turn. i'd take gargoyle castle above it (and i wouldnt play that in landstill currently.)
I'm introducing myself into this deck. I have a list that i like but i don't really know if it is viable.
Could you help me with some suggestion besides shocks x duals??
/ Lands
3 [TE] Wasteland
1 [FUT] Tolaria West
4 [AQ] Mishra's Factory (4)
2 [UL] Faerie Conclave
1 [TSP] Academy Ruins
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 [R] Tundra
2 [DIS] Hallowed Fountain
1 [RAV] Watery Grave
2 [7E] Island (2)
2 [MR] Plains (1)
// Spells
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [6E] Counterspell
2 [FD] Crucible of Worlds
4 [4E] Swords to Plowshares
2 [ALA] Elspeth, Knight-Errant
2 [FD] Engineered Explosives
3 [JU] Cunning Wish
2 [6E] Wrath of God
4 [MM] Brainstorm
4 [OD] Standstill
2 [SC] Decree of Justice
2 [TE] Humility
1 [5E] Nevinyrral's Disk
// Sideboard
SB: 2 [A] Disenchant
SB: 2 [PLC] Extirpate
SB: 4 [ARB] Meddling Mage
SB: 1 [ZEN] Ravenous Trap
SB: 1 [MI] Enlightened Tutor
SB: 2 [ALA] Relic of Progenitus
SB: 1 [CFX] Path to Exile
SB: 2 [6E] Circle of Protection: Red
Thx you all!
I would try to fit Spell snares in and a more diversified draw. Probably something like this:
-1 Counterspell
-1 Standstill
-1 Brainstorm
-1 Crucible
-1 Cunning Wish
+2 Top
+3 Spell snare
P-M
Ok time to fess up guys. Its about banning. I played a number of games and if im wrong tell me but I think senseis top and elspeth are a little "too" good even for legacy. I play a card thats not them and i might lose. If I play them im at like 90% im going to win. Entomb has never had anything on these 2. If entomb warrants it I think these probley do as well. Not counterbalance, not force of will, not even moat are as good as these two cards. Maybe im wrong but I bet bottom dollar most landstill games that dont go to time just "win". Tell me if im wrong and explain.
#1.) No, just no.Originally Posted by sengirvmpr
#2.) This is certainly the wrong place for this discussion. If you want to mistakenly whine about some card's power level, kindly do it somewhere else.
Hi All,
The Landstill thread is bloated beyond belief. The mods/admins are reviewing which threads need a re-boot and this is one of the ones we've identified.
Does anyone have an interest in writing a new OP for U/w Landstill? It needn't be long, but should cover the basic shell, common cards, debateable cards, proven lists, maybe a quickie match-up guide. Doesn't need to be any longer than 1000 words, though it can be as long as you'd like.
If you're interested, please PM me and tell me why you're the best person for the gig.
Thanks,
Staff
Actually these cards are far from overpowered...
Top isn't overpowered, mainly because it is a mana-sink... There are going to be times that you wish you could check your top, but your opponent has threats that you must answer... It simply gives the deck more options, and in a format where the diversity of threats is as high as in Legacy's, you need options in a control deck. It is pretty much exactly what we need to keep up.
And I don't understand all these people bitching/orgasming over elspeth.
The card is good, yes, but it can only 'deal' with one creature by producing blockers, and while a 4/4 flier is pretty good, it takes 2 turns just to make one. It also cannot deal with multiple creatures, and burn hurts it too (although to be fair, that's just less burn that's getting thrown at the face)...
Elspeth is kind of win-more (in a way), as you have to play it when they only have 0-1 threats on board (i.e. you're already in great shape board-wise)...
Elspeth is very good with humility though, but with that, humility, wrath, and decree vying for spots in the deck, which do you choose? It seems everyone here thinks 8-10 4cc spells is acceptable.
But then again, it is a win-condition that also kind of doubles as disruption, so that's why everyone plays it.
No, but these cards are fast.
Elspeth is fucking awesome. It's not as good as Decree, but it's definitely more mana efficient than DoJ.And I don't understand all these people bitching/orgasming over elspeth.
Your job as a control deck is to keep creatures off the board anyway. And it's good that burn is being aimed towards it; it keeps you from losing, and they will spend at least two burn spells on it. Definitely worth it. And if they don't, you're probably winning. And you can also cycle DoJ to make blockers while another soldier token flies over. Elspeth is a very compatible card in Landstill. And is a lot better than Humility because it wins.The card is good, yes, but it can only 'deal' with one creature by producing blockers, and while a 4/4 flier is pretty good, it takes 2 turns just to make one. It also cannot deal with multiple creatures, and burn hurts it too (although to be fair, that's just less burn that's getting thrown at the face)...
Not at all. We play it because it can also be a control card. And in Landstill 8-10 4c cards is acceptable. It's a late game deck.Elspeth is kind of win-more (in a way), as you have to play it when they only have 0-1 threats on board (i.e. you're already in great shape board-wise)...
Elspeth is very good with humility though, but with that, humility, wrath, and decree vying for spots in the deck, which do you choose? It seems everyone here thinks 8-10 4cc spells is acceptable.
ICBE - We're totally the coolest Anti-Thesis ever.
"The Citrus-God just had a Citrus-Supernova... in your mouth."
Indeed would you cut brainstorm?? I really like top but i feel confortable with crucibles and counterspell. Maybe a good cut is stanstill, just 1 off course and a wish in favor of 2 top.
I hate to drag out this troll, but nobody's mentioned this yet: Entomb is not banned.
Often casting Brainstorm once per game is enough. Beyond that, the decisions of what to put back can be agonizing and not worth it, and if you're casting it without a shuffle afterwards, then Ponder or Top would be better. I see no big problem with Top becoming Brainstorms 4 and 5, as long as you mind the blue count for Force. Reusable Brainstorm = good.
Cutting a Standstill seems okay in a very fast meta where Zoo will have a bunch of guys on the board by the time you can cast it, and Merfolk can play under it just as well or better than you can.
Actually this is a question to put to far more experience players than I - between the 4th Standstill and the 4th Brainstorm, which is more cuttable. You'd probably get a feeling for where opinions lie from reading the last few months of this thread. A common configuration seems to be 3Stills/3BS/3Top.
3 Wish probably is too many, I would be worried that it the second and third copies that you draw could get stuck in hand, with you wishing they were more point removal, but having already Wished for your one Path. Two Wishes should be enough.
The usefulness of Spell Snare is going to depend a lot on your metagame. In a developed meta where you need to stop things like Counterbalances and Hymns when you're on the draw, it will be indispensible. In a less developed meta, or facing randomjank.dec, it'll more likely sit in your hand until you pitch it to Force. Personally I'm an old-school player and really don't want to go below 4 Counterspells either.
If I have slighted the Landstill gods in some way, do say so.
@ citrus god-
I was trying to get the point across that the cards aren't degenerate or broken.
I mentioned the fact that it is pseudo-disruption.
Also, while it is the deck's objective to create an empty board, it doesn't always happen, and I will never cast an elspeth against a board with two or more sizable threats (which was the point I was trying to get across).
Thank you citrus-god I think you were the only one who understood what I was saying. I wasnt bitching about the power level of these cards in a random deck or in a non landstill-established deck. I only wanted to talk landstill- and the cards we play in it -I personally think landstill right now is one of the top 3 competitive decks because of these cards (top 2 maybe). But I will digress this point because I guess this is the wrong place to talk about cards that are played in landstill.
Nothing in Landstill is degenerate or broken. Landstill will never be a broken deck. It's too fair.
Then the players must be awful at the game if they don't create empty boards by turn 6-8. The only time creatures get to resolve is when you have flying Angel tokens and/or an Elspeth out.Also, while it is the deck's objective to create an empty board, it doesn't always happen, and I will never cast an elspeth against a board with two or more sizable threats (which was the point I was trying to get across).
ICBE - We're totally the coolest Anti-Thesis ever.
"The Citrus-God just had a Citrus-Supernova... in your mouth."
The easiest way for other decks to deal with Elspeth is for them to simply run their own, which they can and will do. (see: the Rock, and potentially Bant Countertop)
It's not a big deal playing against opposing Elspeths. The only problem I would have is playing against opposing DoJs.
ICBE - We're totally the coolest Anti-Thesis ever.
"The Citrus-God just had a Citrus-Supernova... in your mouth."
Nice stab.
Anyways, Most players in my meta generally don't over-commit. And with stifles, wastelands, and dazes I can only usually cast and use my mass removal turns 6-7 anyways. Don't kid yourself by acting superior in any way, i'm just stating facts and perspectives.
If you're facing two significant threats on the board with no answers you have big problems whether you're running Elspeth or not. As in, you're going to die unless you find an answer in the next 2 turns, and Elspeth is fantastic because your win-con allows you to deal with only 1 of the threats, as you can then cast that win-con, and perma-chump while you dig for another answer, or win the game in 5 turns if you find an answer.
So I don't see how that's even a "criticism" of Elspeth as a win-con that does double work as defense and card advantage.
I guess my problem is that I usually play a more disruptive build of landstill (just 2 decree and 5-6 manlands)... It frees up more effective board control. I am a little biased though, as in my metagames planeswalkers just die to burn and whatnot. This leaves me in situations where i would prefer to simply destroy their crits right off the bat.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Reply With Quote