Root Maze is too symmetrical, it slows us down just as much as the opponent. The best turn 1 plays are Enchant Lands - Wild Growth and Utopia Sprawl. This gives us the best shot of landing an Enchantress or a Sterling Grove with mana to activate on turn 2. Root Maze might have a home in some funky Stasis/Enchantress deck, but it really doesn't belong in Confinement/Enchantress. This deck has evolved quite a bit and been honed a lot, people are working on the last few slots of the deck and aren't really wanting to change the entire deck because you think it should have squirrels in it... to put it nicely.
"If your enemy is secure at all points, be prepared for him.
If he is in superior strength, evade him.
If your opponent is temperamental, seek to irritate him.
Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.
If he is taking his ease, give him no rest.
If his forces are united, separate them.
Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected."
-Sun Tzu
Ok some ideas:
Against Iona- what about Karakas, or Karakas in the sideboard?
Aura Shards- if you run a full set of Elvish Spirit Guides for mana acceleration, then you have 8 potential draws in midgame (the argothian enchantresses and the spirit guides) that become disenchants, at 2 or 3 mana respectively. You can run it as a singleton bullet or in the sideboard.
Titania's Song- kills artifact based combos if you accelerate into it. And I just asked for a ruling, but would Titania's Song + Aura Shards turn your Petals and Moxes into 0 casting cost sorcery speed Naturalizes? Also artifact lands.
Boseiju, Who Shelters All- To force through a Replenish.
Hideaway Lands- To bypass the casting cost of an expensive enchantment.
Squirrels get no respect- but Aura Shards should.
Jiaz - Actually, your list looks a lot like the list that later evolved into Solitaire. Only the combo was Deranged Hermit + Lifeline + Martyr's Cause. Also, Kamahl, Fist of Krosa + False Prophet. Either way, the keyword is probably "evolved".
Karakas is an interesting option. I've been tinkering with 1 as a Wish target. But I don't know, it seems kind of narrow.
Aura Shards - Who would you want it against and why would it be better than Aura of Silence?
Early one morning while making the round,
I took a shot of cocaine and I shot my woman down;
I went right home and I went to bed,
I stuck that lovin' .44 beneath my head.
Enchantress and Affinity, and numerous 2 card combo decks that rely on either an enchantment or artifact. It may also hit random disruption/ locks/ defenses your opponent is using.Originally Posted by SpatulaOfTheAges
2 card combos:
Leyline of the Void/ Helm of Obedience: Hits both parts.
Dream Halls: You can blow up Dream Halls in response to Conflux.
Painter's Servant/ Grindstone: Hits both parts.
Charbelcher: You would have to hit Charbelcher with something like Root Maze.
Aluren + X: Hits Aluren. Trickier because it can all be done at instant speed, but still feasible.
Disruption/ Utility:
Counterbalance/ Divining Top: Hits both.
Isochron Scepter/ Orim's Chant: Kills Scepter.
Standstill: You can break Standstill without giving them cards.
Ethersworn Canonist, Blood Moon, Arcane Laboratory, Crucible of Worlds
Aether Vial: Blow it up to slow them down.
For my deck it takes out Engineered Plague.
You use it against whatever they have to stop your win condition, whatever Enchantress uses whether it be Moat, Confinement, Runed Halo, Oblivion Ring, or Meekstone or Winter Orb or Wheel of Moon and Sun or Ensnaring Bridge. It's not enough to make Angel tokens, sometimes you also have to clear the board.
Why Aura Shards over Aura of Silence? First I would say it is easier to make GW1 than WW1. Aura of Silence, in play, slows down artifacts and enchantments but it doesn't stop them. And Enchantress gives the other player more than enough time to come up with 2 mana. Aura of Silence would not help against Affinity if it is slow to come out. I think most decks with artifact and enchantment pieces, that expect to handle Krosan Grip and Kataki, can handle either of Aura of Silence's effects, but probably cannot play around Aura Shards + an instant speed token generator. Finally, you can use it to blow up your own enchantments at will. I use that all the time to get rid of excess Presences and Dueling Grounds when I'm going for the win.
Aura of Silence doesn't need other cards on the board to function though. And when you're talking about spot removal, that's a more important factor than the extra W.
Early one morning while making the round,
I took a shot of cocaine and I shot my woman down;
I went right home and I went to bed,
I stuck that lovin' .44 beneath my head.
Hi all! Posting 2 report from 2 Trial i've done in the last weeks.
This is the my list:
6 forest
3 windswept heath
2 mistyrain forest
1 plain
1 karakas
1 tropical
1 taiga
2 savannah
2 serra sanctum
4 argothian enchantress
4 enchantress presence
3 sterling grove
3 solitary confinement
4 elephant grass
2 ground seal
3 Elvish spirit guide
4 utopia sprawl
3 wild growth
1 moat
1 aura of silence
2 mirri guile
2 replenish
1 oblivion ring
1 lignify
2 in the eye of chaos
1 word of war
2 sigil of the empty throne
SIDE
2 city of solitude
1 choke
1 suppression field
1 aethersworn canonist
1 rule of law
2 enlightened tutor
1 compost
1 Cop red
1 runed haloo
1 replenish
1 sterling grove
2 karmic justice
1) merfolk: 2-0. winned quite easy. 1st match replenish wins, 2nd match moat give me time to set confinement.
2) white weenie: 1-1. Bad opponent. i burn him 1st match. 2nd he set gaddok and canonist lock at 3rd turn i was going out but i made an herror and i lost the match. time give us a draw.
3) the rock: 2-0. easy win
4)landstill: 0-2 unlucky match. i see no lands in the 1st match and i mull to 4 in the second. he blindflipped with counterbalance an elspeth on my replenish -.-
5)Ad Nauseam: 2-1. win the 1st setting aura of silence 3rd turn and in the eye of chaos at 4th. 2nd match he kill me his 2nd turn. 3rd i set a turn 2 rule of law and he give up after 2 grove ad 1 confinement.
6)tempo *****: 0-2. 1st match i was screwed and he killed me in 7 turn with a goyf 3/4. second match he chained 4 ice on my land with wild growth. killed by 2 moongose and a bolt.
7) merfolk: 2-1. I easily win the 1st. i had some bad draw in the second and he arrange to win. 3rd match i set a suppression field. he tapped out attacking with a mutalvault and i resolved a choke that kill him :)
final result 15/62 2 point from top 8
i got 2 unlucky match and a lucky one so i return at home quite happy for the result.
the weekend later i went to another trial. deck was same i make a little changes:
+ 1 gerrard battlecry
+1 oblivion ring
1 moat moved to side
changhes 3 vexing susher for the 2 city and the choke in side. and i moved out compost.
1) dredge: 2-1 easy match.
2) baseruption: 2-1 I started with 1 game loss cause list irregularity-.-. he set 2 time cb lock on second turn. i arrange both match a replenish when i was quite dead.
3) eva green with marit lage combo 1-2. combo at 2nd turn 1st match, i set a good elephant grass in the second, i get unlucky and after a mull to 5 in the last.
4) MIRROR: 1-1 1st i win for time, 2nd i was screwed, 3rd we set both a confinement with 2 grove but we go to time and so we draw.
i go to top 4 for rating.
semifinal was with the evagreen that i killed in 10 min with a 2-0
final was with a bantcontrol with countertop.
i win quite easyily. the 1st he resolved some fast goyf in the second and he win. the last match on 2nd turn i have an ESG on his daze on my enchantress and same later on a replenish.
both time karakas make me win bouncing gaddok.
1st on 12 :)
About my deck
i'm playing 63 card and i need to reduce them to 60-61. but sincerly i don't know what to take out .
In the eye of chaos is a bomb. not only vs control deck but vs a lot of combo and burn deck
ESG give me the win a lot of time. a lot better than mox according to me. used a lot of time a antidaze and spellspierce
karakas is very useful in some match but sincerly i don't know if mine manabase can have 1 more non- basic land in.
vexing susher its a bomb. i know it go under the creature removal spot but i suppose people side them out at the second match:). and sincerly i find myself a lot of time with the hand full of hateful card for control deck but no time to cast them . so i decided to try susher.
thank you for your time
if anyone want i'm looking for some suggestion about cards to take out from my deck.
Last edited by Opax; 01-30-2010 at 08:44 PM.
Gerrard Battlecry... ???
In the eye of chaos is great. I play 2x maindeck along with 2x city of solitude. This deck looses only vs blue.
Hand full of hateful cards but no time to cast them? You centred the point! Time is what our side must improve vs Blue decks. My solution? 4x carpet of flowers!
Gerrard battlecry was a test. i'm searching an alternative finisher, and i always wonder to beat with the enchantress :)
by the way i'm going to cut it out.
About carpet of flower : If they arrange a counterbalance lock with a drop of 3 on the top 3 card i'll have an hard match so i decide to use susher. i think it let you make your game.
sincerly i think is not mana our problem. with a cb on second turn carpets will give us 2 more mana at our 3rd turn that is not a lot. i'll test them by the way and we will see.
First of all, with 63 cards you only have 19 lands? I am running 21 with a 60 card deck and feel it is just barely adequate. This might be part of why you are mulling to 5 a lot.
What I would cut:
-1 ground seal (having 1 gives you an out against Loam decks, but drawing 2 in a game is really meh)
-1 in the eye of chaos (tutor it when you need it)
-1 aura of silence (move it to SB, you have O.ring as a catch-all solution game 1)
-1 mirri's guile (2 is better, but you need the space)
-1 sigil (you still have 2 win conditions, but less of a chance to draw them)
-1 karakas (too situational for MD)
-1 elvish spirit guide (it's this or solitary, and i like having 3 solitary)
+1 Savannah
+2 forest (up to 21 lands)
+1 Sterling Grove (it's like the 2nd copy of seal/eye/sigil all at the same time)
As far as alternate win conditions, I run Sacred Mesa in addition to WoWar and Sigil. It has decent utility before winning just in making chumps, and it lets you really abuse Serra's Sanctum to its fullest. I think it is better than Gerrard's Battle Cry, at least. Another alternative is the Pandemonium/Saproling Burst combo. Another is Helix Pinnacle. All that said, I think a 1/1 split of WoWar and Sigil is probably the best.
"If your enemy is secure at all points, be prepared for him.
If he is in superior strength, evade him.
If your opponent is temperamental, seek to irritate him.
Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.
If he is taking his ease, give him no rest.
If his forces are united, separate them.
Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected."
-Sun Tzu
double post, please delete.
"If your enemy is secure at all points, be prepared for him.
If he is in superior strength, evade him.
If your opponent is temperamental, seek to irritate him.
Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant.
If he is taking his ease, give him no rest.
If his forces are united, separate them.
Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected."
-Sun Tzu
-1 ground seal: i know its a dead card but i play 2 because in my meta there are a lot of black based deck. according to me it gives a solid answer to reanimator, dredge and other black deck using volrath or witness recursion.
- 1 in the eye of chaos: i think i'll cut the 2nd of it. A lot of time it kills itself after a replenish.
-1 aura of silence: i know oblivion is better as removal but aura works well just staying on the board, and usually if there is a quasali on the table i disenchant my own O-ring with my aura. And i think aura is a good lock for a combo deck. Sincerly i'll probably prefer 1 aura instead of 1 O-ring. I'll think about that.
- 1 mirri's guile: i don't know, its a good proposal but it's an hard choice.
-1 sigil: No, i'm looking for 1 more finisher because a lot of black deck has start to put in sideboard sadistic sacrament and having a turn 1: swamp, dark ritual, sadistic sacrament on my WoW and Sigils is not so funny.
- 1 Karakas: i was just thinking about it, but when i decided to play it i didn't know that has been reworded. Now target are only Iona, gaddok and marit lage. ( in case the switch is for 1 forest)
- 1 ESG: i think i need 3 of them at least for having a good backup from them. 3 is the right number playing 2 its very random. I have thinked to play 4 in sideboard too and side them in when i need to have a fast open. Sincerly i don't know.
+1 savannah and +2 forest: sincerly i think this deck need 2 land and 1 growth/sprawl to engine. According to me a 19/60 or 20/61 its enought. do you agree??
About finisher i've tested quite all of them and this is my opinion about them :
Pande-burst: strong but 2 card.
hoofpring of the stag: to slow
Word of wind: not a real wincon. if the opponent know how to play will not concede and start timing and you will go to a draw ( that's not what we want)
Primal order: strong clock but its too situational
Sacred mesa: mana expensive, but pehalps the stronger one out of Wowar and sigil.
Helix pinnacle: very funny, but too fragile(EE at 1 and Deed at 1), the stronger in a mirror i think.
Luminarch ascension: i think this one is playable in side for control deck and mirror. 4 turn is not a lot if you have it in your opening hands. What do you think ??
Opalescence + Parallax wave: really really funny but not playable XD
I'm thinking a new one with the new ench terra eternal + living lands. I'll test it. (so i was testing gerrard)
I'll have some test and then i'll repost my list as i have 1 more tournament in a week :)
Thank you for your time Sevryn and sorry for my horrible english.
Your manabase seems fine. 19 lands with ESGs and Growths is fine for a 60 card deck. Cut 1 Eye, 1 Sigil and 1 Guile.
Also, change either O. Ring or Aura of Silence to Seal of Primordium.
Early one morning while making the round,
I took a shot of cocaine and I shot my woman down;
I went right home and I went to bed,
I stuck that lovin' .44 beneath my head.
What you guys think of Immolation nowadays?
It is an old tech against Meddling Mage, but now we have Dark Confidant (an early, unanswered Dark Confidant is very VERY dangerous), Ethersworn Canonist, Gaddock Teeg and whatnot.
It has the great advantage of being only one mana, but the disadvantage of being red. Did Lignify make this obsolete? Thoughts?
"Want all, lose all."
If you needed creature point removal, why not just play Seal of Fire? It effectively does the same thing against creatures, and could go to the dome for the last two points if need be.
The deck in the opening post of this thread has 3 Seals of Fire in its 75, but things have changed a lot in the past three years. There are a lot of things Seal won't answer, and yes, Lignify does answer them better (huge creatures, Iona, etc).
Won't people usually name Green with Iona? Oblivion Ring is also a nice answer to targetable permanents through.
Then, there are more drastic stuff like Humility.
You're right, I completely forgot about Seal. Anyway, neither Seal nor Immolation are seeing play, and I think for those that play with red (I have WoW and Blood Moon) those two cards are again great options due to Confidants and Canonists. I'll test some.
O. Ring is 3 to cast, another kind of answer I think.
"Want all, lose all."
What is Enchantress's best answer to post-board Gaddock Teeg?
Why exactly do we need to remove him? He stops us from casting Sigil and Replenish, but that's about it (maybe Moat, if you run it). We still get to draw our entire deck and surely somewhere in there, there'll be at least a single copy of Lignify, O-Ring, or WoW. If their hate is just Teeg, I'd call that a good thing. If they're backing him up with something like Reverent Silence, then I'd go with Karmic Justice.
edit -- Oops, they can't cast Reverent Silence with Teeg out. In that case, I think we can say that Teeg poses pretty much no threat at all.
Last edited by Otter; 02-11-2010 at 12:14 AM.
teeg doesnt really matter against us. he doesnt do much aside from being a bear. he is easily removed via o-ring and doesnt do anything. he dies to a WoW or a sacred mesa and granted you cant cast replenish or sigil they cant cast FoW or any disruption like that. if anything im happy anytime a teeg has been boarded in.
Team Lucksack, professional badasses
Originally Posted by rockout
So it's a single red for the lightning bolt effect and 6 colorlress to make it draw a single card. WTF mate that is god awful.
That card dodges the shit out of counterbalance.
Hello, I'm new here, but, I thought I would post up my deck list for some opinions. Currently, the decks I can test against are U/W Counter slivers, Belcher, Life combo, Suicide Black, my incomplete Survival Elves, and my Faerie deck. Me and my team are working on proxying out a gauntlet of the top decks to test against to better prepare against the decks, a work out changes to our decks. I have access to some stuff, but, more duals and stuff like Moat I don't have access to, and I'd need a few weeks to save up the money to get them (after all, bills come first.) Anyways, here's my deck, and my results against the decks i can play against.
Land (20)
4 Windswept Heath
2 Serra's Sanctum
1 Karakas
1 Savannah
1 Taiga
8 Forest
3 Plains
Creatures (4)
4 Argothian Enchantress
Spells (2)
2 Replenish
Enchantments (34)
4 Wild Growth
4 Utopia Sprawl
4 Sterling Grove
4 Elephant Grass
4 Echantress's Presence
3 Solitary Confinement
3 Runed Halo
2 City of Solitude
2 Suppression Field
1 Aura of Silence
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Sigil of the Empty Throne
1 Words of War
SIDEBOARD
3 Wheel of Sun and Moon
3 Choke
3 Ethersworn Cannonist
1 Suppression Field
1 Aura of Silence
1 Ground Seal
1 Sacred Ground
1 Karmic Justice
1 City of Solitude
As far as the decks I have been able to play against, this is the usual results:
Life Combo: I usually lose this match unless I get Suppression Field down on turn 2, and keep it in play through his bullet board and Living Wishes. He has no Main Deck hate against it, so, if I can get Suppression Field and Sterling Grove down, I win. this is usually 70/30 in Life's favor, due to the consistency of turn 3 10 billion life.
Post Board: -2 City of Solitude, +1 Suppression Field, +1 Aura of Silence
U/W Counter slivers: This can be a hard match up without a good hand. I cut my opponents deck each time, but, he still ends up with a god hand almost every game. Suppression Field early can help against Vials, and City of Solitude either resolves and shuts off his counters, or allows me to resolve something more important by wasting his counters. 4 Elephant Grass really helps this match up. This is usually 50/50
Post Board: - 3 Runed Halo, - 1 Aura of Silence, - 1 Oblivion Ring, + 3 Choke, + 1 City of Solitude, + 1 Suppression Field
Belcher: I hate this matchup. 90/10 my favor pre-board, because turn 1, before I even get to play my first card, i'm either dead, or facing 12 goblins. if I play first, and don't die turn 1 to belcher, Runed Halo comes down on Belcher, or Elephant Grass if he's got the goblins from Empty the Warrens. Suppression Field is also a great card, making him need 5 for activate belcher usually is a 2 turn process if he fails to activate or kill on the first one.
Post Board: - 2 Replenish, - 2 City of Solitude, + 3 Ethersworn Cannonist, +1 Suppression Field
Suicide Black: This matchup is one of the easiest if I can get Elephant Grass out. However, stupid turn 1 shenanigans can make this a hard matchup. This deck can potentially ruin my hand turn 1 (I know, because it's my own Suicide deck, and, I've gotten turn 1 Dark Rit into Triple Duress against Belcher.) I don't even have a sideboard plan against this deck. I need to focus more on Enchantress' Presence because of Diabolic Edicts.
No idea on Sideboard plans.
Faeries: I played this matchup once, since I just finished the Faerie deck 2 days ago, handed it to my team mate, and played against it. I did pretty badly. I was able to drop down an enchantress before he drew into a ton of counters and Mistbinds, but, once his Turn 1 suspended Ancestral Vision resolved, it was pretty much over. 2 Elephant Grass both got countered with Spellstutter Sprites, and City of Solitude was Force of Will'd. Post Board, they have too much to counter, but, it's a race. I doubt I got my sideboarding 100% correct, only time and testing will tell.
Post Board: - 3 Runed Halo, - 1 Oblivion Ring, + 3 Choke, + 1 City of Solitude
any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Reply With Quote