[Deck] Merfolk

[TheyCallMeTim]

Yesterday, I played Merfolk for the first time. Finished Top8 with 4-1-1 and won 2 Thoughtseize *woohoo*

Now I want to play the deck again and make some adjustments. I am thinking about playing 16 Lords +2 Kira, 8 Counters. No Standstill, no Jitte. That would leave me with the decision to play 22 lands (like the list that won the Bazaar of Moxen tournament) or play 20 lands plus something like echoing truth.

Congrats. What list did you top 8 with?

[Tru3z3rox]

Yesterday, I played Merfolk for the first time. Finished Top8 with 4-1-1 and won 2 Thoughtseize *woohoo*

Now I want to play the deck again and make some adjustments. I am thinking about playing 16 Lords +2 Kira, 8 Counters. No Standstill, no Jitte. That would leave me with the decision to play 22 lands (like the list that won the Bazaar of Moxen tournament) or play 20 lands plus something like echoing truth.

What I would like to know from those of you that have played with 4 Coralhelm Commanders: Are 20 Lands enough? What is your experience? How many lands does the deck need?

I personally run 19 lands, so of course I think that 20 are enough. I do however only run 3/3 split of wastes and mutavaults. I think with most of our curve at 2 and vials we can safely run 19-21 lands as long as enough of them are islands. I really like echoing truth in the main as it has saved me many times in the past. Also I don't know about running 4 coralhelms. That seems a bit much on the leveler. I think 3 is the right number.

[CleverPetriDish]

So I am interested...
You guys usually side out Standstill against Zoo (and goblins?), right? It is nuts against blue and lackluster against aggro from what I have seen. So with all the shift we are expecting, is Standstill too slow now?

[cdr]

I would side out Force against Zoo before I would side out Standstill. My hope against zoo is to contain them early game and then win when they run out of cards. I might take out Standstill if I had enough to side in, though.

[Purgatory]

I'm currently testing Pithing Needle in the Sideboard of my list and I have to say it's been working well so far. The opportunity to turn off Engineered Explosives, Jace 2, Umezawa's Jitte, Grim Lavamancer, fetchlands, Maze of Ith, Pernicious Deed, Rishadan Port, Sensei's Divining Top, Cephalid Colisseum etc. etc. with one little sharp silver bullet is pretty good, especially since I run a splash list with no room for utility stuff like Stifle.

[Svenanole]

@purg- I agree with you. I was running stifle before starting to run UW because of the amount of zoo/goblins

4 Curcecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
3 Coralhelm Commander
4 Merrow Reejerey
2 Kira, Great Glass Spinner

4 Force
4 Daze
4 Vial
4 Swords
2 Jittes

4 Flooded
3 Misty
3 Tundra
3 Island
1 Plains
4 vaults
3 wastes

4 perimeter captain
2 Threads
2 Pithing
3 Meddling Mage
2 Tormods
2 Relics

perimeters are nuts against zoo/goblins.

[DragoFireheart]

With the banning of Mystical Tutor, this means that more Zoo players are going to pop up. How is this deck going to handle the increase in Zoo decks?

[cdr]

If your meta is full of zoo, this is the wrong deck to play.

[TheyCallMeTim]

With the banning of Mystical Tutor, this means that more Zoo players are going to pop up. How is this deck going to handle the increase in Zoo decks?

Play the UW version and run some of the following wherever possible:

Swords to Plowshares
Path to Exile
Stand // Deliver
Consign to Dream
Propaganda
Back to Basics
Sejiri Merfolk
Standstill
etc.

[Purgatory]

imo, if you wanna play in a Zoo meta, run Ghostly Prison over Propaganda when you splash. Not being able to REB it is bad for the Zoo player.

It can still get Pridemage'd though :(

[dyzzy]

Did anyone see this BU list from another thread?

2nd - Matt Langford
4 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
2 Underground Sea
3 Island
1 Swamp
4 Mutavault
3 Wasteland
4 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Merrow Rejerey
2 Merfolk Soveirgn
2 Wake Thrasher
2 Cold-Eyed Selkie
4 Aether Vial
3 Standstill
3 Smother
3 Daze
4 Force of Will
2 Umezawa's Jitte

----------------------------------------

Sideboard:
2 Blue Elemental
2 Extirpate
1 Relic of Progenitus
3 Spell Pierce
2 Kira, Great-Glass Spinner
2 Threads of Disloyalty
1 Pithing Needle
2 Perish

Just thought it was interesting, looks really off-beat (Selkie? Extirpate?) but I guess he must have done something right. (Then again, maybe not, since he lost to combo in the finals.)

PS: I just realized why we lose so much to Zoo, it's cat tribal vs. fish tribal, the cats are naturally going to win.

[Endrju]

I would side out Force against Zoo before I would side out Standstill. My hope against zoo is to contain them early game and then win when they run out of cards.

Could you explain me please how you want to contain zoo in the early game without having FoW?
(Say nothing about the fact that waiting for a deck containg sylvan libraries to run out of cards doesn't look like a good strategy to me ;) )

First maybe the decklist, before showing my sideplan for this MU:

Main(61):
12x Island
4x Mutavault
4x Wasteland
4x Cursecatcher
4x Silvergill Adept
4x Lord of Atlantis
4x Merrow Reejerey
2x Merfolk Sovereign
2x Kira, Great Glass-Spinner
4x Force of Will
4x Daze
2x Spell Snare
4x Standstill
3x Stifle
4x AEther Vial
Side (15):
3x Submerge
2x Llawan, Cephalid Empress
2x Relic of Progenitus
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Ravenous Trap
2x Umezawa's Jitte
3x Blue Elemental Blast
1x Threads of Disloyalty

So against Zoo i changed it always that way:
IN: 2x Jitte, 2x Relic, 3x Submerge, 1x Threads
OUT: 2x Stifle, 3x Standstill, 3x Daze on play, 1x Stifle, 3x Standstill, 4x Daze on draw. And I found it working well ;)
(but it's important to remember that sideboard isn't all, as spell snares and kiras in mainboard are amazing in this MU)

If your meta is full of zoo, this is the wrong deck to play.

I don't think so. I haven't tested yet the 16-lords version, but I suppose it to handle better with zoo than the old stifle+standstill one, with which (posted above) I did, however, 2-0-1 against Zoos in Madrid, with unluckily tied game as I left my opp having just 2 or 3 life points after 5th turn of termination, with pretty significant advantage on my side of the table. So if 'almost 3-0' is possible with the old version, the new one should easily cope in this MU.

To be honest, I haven't played much since GP Madrid, so the list I posted may be bit out of date, but if it worked well against zoo back then, why wouldn't it now? ;)

[TheyCallMeTim]

I'm glad you are having success against Zoo with a mono U version but it seems to me that the deck definitely needs some removal. With that in mind, I've been working on a UW version that I hope will have success in the new meta, whatever that may be. I certainly don't have an optimal build, just throwing around ideas of what I should be testing. Here's my current list:


3 Cursecatcher
4 Silvergill Adept
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Merrow Reejerey
3 Merfolk Sovereign

4 Aether Vial
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Daze
2 Stand / Deliver
4 Force of Will

4 Wasteland
4 Flooded Strand
3 Tundra
8 Island
1 Plains


Any input? Sideboard thoughts?

[DCTopTeam]

Vs Zoo why do you side-in Jitte when Zoo packs a ton of removals? Jitte's like begging for a creature at that stage. Somebody please explain to me the LOGIC? And I also see that people are now taking away Standstill MD, with Zoo running rampant I think that's a good choice.

[TheSleeper]

So Alex B came 2nd in the SCG Open with this list. I believe is card for card the same as the BoM IV winner -> 22 land (1 Mishra), no Standstill, 2 Kira MD, 4 Coral etc. Not sure about the Snow-Covered Islands tho? Another top 8 (2/41) here kept the 22 land but swapped the factory for a 14th Island. Anyone got opinions on which is better (Factory vs. 14th island)?

Anyways congrats to him on his finish, especially in the face of all the Zoo/Goblins that were no doubt present!

[Endrju]

Vs Zoo why do you side-in Jitte when Zoo packs a ton of removals? Jitte's like begging for a creature at that stage. Somebody please explain to me the LOGIC?

If you play Kira those tons of removal aren't so scary, if you stay with equipped guy as you play the spirit your in a great position. But it isn't the only way Jitte is useful in this MU of course:
-Opp will probably side in his own Jittes. And guess what is the best answer for the opponent's jitte merfolk have?
-it's one of the best topdecks if you both are in the topdecking mode, with noone having advantage on the table (what is really often in games 2-3 with your Submerges and grave hate)
-if you leave some stifles in the deck there's always a chance to provoke qasali to commit a suicide ;)
-it requires only one swing to pump your guys enough to resist any of his burns, so it's better to have lord that can be only sworded/pathed, than the one that can be helixed, bolted and chained as well.

Actually, lot of my games against zoo looked like opp having 0/1 goyfs, 2/2 knights or amazing 1/1 lavamancers with both graveyards empty, while I had already few lords gone, buying time with mutavault for example, and we both stayed with empty hand waiting for something to turn our guys bigger than the other one's. In that case I definitely prefer to draw jitte than daze, standstil, fow or other stifle...

[Finn]

@DCTopTeam, I side in Jitte against Zoo for game two almost always (when I have it) the main reason being as a disenchant. Yes, it is hard to connect with it, but if they get one going you are dead. And you can bet that more Zoo decks will be packing them in the future.

[neji21]

jitte seems too slow against zoo especially with quasali and their own jittes around.

[PanderAlexander]

I went to the Knightware tournament in L.A. yesterday Sunday and ended up 1st out of 51 with mono-blue Merfolk. I played the list without Standstills. Before the tournament my friend and I noticed it was a huge Zoo meta and yep I decided to play Merfolk.

My record was 7-0-2

Rd 1: Reanimator went 2-1
Rd 2: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 3: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 4: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 5: draw
Rd 6: draw
- Top 8 consisted of me with merfolk, reanimator, zoo, zoo, dredge, ant, UBR fairies, and eva green
Quarter-finals: Dredge 2-1
Semi-finals: Ant 2-1
Finals: Reanimator he dropped to me and we split the prizes

The new Coralhelm Commander is amazing, it won me so many games, especially against Zoo. I didn't lose a single game against Zoo and it wasn't a fluke since I went against 3.* All Zoo games my opponent came out blistering fast with good hands but I played the matchup different, I didn't try to stall and out-attrition my opponent, instead I was really aggressive. I can't say enough about Kira that hasn't been said already, she's amazing.

I had one maindeck jitte and one sideboard jitte, if I had to do it again they would both be out. They were too slow, I'd cast it, waste mana equiping just to have the creature removed or against Zoo they have enough creature removal and pridemages.

[boclfon479]

I went to the Knightware tournament in L.A. yesterday Sunday and ended up 1st out of 51 with mono-blue Merfolk. I played the list without Standstills. Before the tournament my friend and I noticed it was a huge Zoo meta and yep I decided to play Merfolk.
*
My record was 7-0-2
*
Rd 1: Reanimator went 2-1
Rd 2: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 3: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 4: Zoo went 2-0
Rd 6: draw
Rd 7: draw
Top 8 consisted of me with merfolk, reanimator, zoo, zoo, dredge, ant, UBR fairies
Quarter-finals: Dredge 2-1
Semi-finals: Ant 2-1
Finals: Reanimator he dropped to me
*
The new Coralhelm Commander is amazing, it won me so many games, especially against Zoo.* I didn't lose a single game against Zoo and it wasn't a fluke since I went against 3.* All Zoo games my opponent came out blistering fast with good hands but I played the matchup different, I didn't try to stall and out-attrition my opponent, instead I was really aggressive.* I can't say enough about Kira that hasn't been said already, she's amazing.
*
I had one maindeck jitte and one sideboard jitte, if I had to do it again they would both be out.* They were too slow, I'd cast it, waste mana equiping just to have the creature removed or against Zoo they have enough creature removal and pridemages.

mind posting your list? i am contemplating either merfolk or aggro elves for post ban legacy, but i was curould about your list because you stated that zoo was fairly easy for it.