Howdy, I'm joining these forums to discuss this deck. A buddy of mine saw this thread and pointed me to it. I readthe initial decklist and went "that is literally a collection of my favorite acrds, all thrown into a deck together!" I read through everything and came up with my own list and am looking for thoughts.
Creatures:
3x Bloodghast
4x Gatekeeper of Malakir
4x Vampire Nighthawk
3x Abyssal Persecutor
2x Tombstalker
Equipables:
2x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
Kill Spells:
4x Smother
4x Diabolic Edict
Discard:
4x Inquisition of Kozilek / Thoughtseize
3x Cabal Therapy
Draw:
4x Phyrexian Arena
Land:
20x Swamp
2x Bojuka Bog
Sideboard:
4x Hymn to Tourach
3x Faerie Macabre
4x Sadistic Sacrament
4x Leyline of the Void
I haven't had a chance to test my list yet, but I've goldfished a ton and come up with some thoughts. First off, Bloodghast. I'm a former Pox player, and I fell in love with this little guy. Sure he can't block, but he makes a great Jitte carrier. Equip and swing without fear of blockers, Jitte gets it's counters and your next land brings him back for more. next, Tombstalker. he's a big guy with evasion that can potentially only cost BB. He was a house for me in Pox, but I'm liking him less and less here because I'm not filling my GY fast enough for my liking. If I end up taking him out the Arenas will convert over to Bobs (I'm liking that idea the more I think about it). Which brings me to my next point, Arenas. I've loved Phyrexian Arena in past decks, but here it always seems like I'd rather play out my hand before I end up playing it. It seems like I'd be better off running Infernal Contract or Sign in Blood for a more reloading effect as opposed to Arena's passive CA effect. My discard spell of choice fluctuates. At first it was Duress, as I feared the lifeloss from Thoughtseize. I decided that I needed a T1 answer for Lackey or Cursecatcher, and I thought that Inquisition sounded better than Innocent Blood as it gave me some flexibility at the cost of needing to be used preemptively. I'm now thinking that I may be able get away with Thoughtseize. Moving along to my sideboard. I know that my main deck is bad G1 against anything but creature-based decks, so I wanted to make a transitional sideboard that let me trade out my kill spells for control elements.
I'm hoping we can generate some discussion as to card selection, as this deck really has me excited. Let me know what you guys think.
Went to a tourney with the "standard" list except packing 2 Smother main and 2 SB. They were relevant the whole day against manlands and other flashed or vialed in stuff. I won against Canadian Thresh and Goblins and lost to a BWg Planeswalker.dec and 2 times Combo (Dredge, Donate/Illusions) mostly because none of the Hate cards like GY hate or Extirpates showed up. I wasn't too satisfied with the last 3 matches because the possible interactions from the deck was almost 0. I felt helpless because the deck has almost no draw and no filter options and if you get a mediocre opening hand you have to take mulligans to ensure you get any hate (which I did without any success). Well , this is nothing new from the theory of the deck but it is always different if you really experience it 3 times in a row after a very pleasant start.
What is about adding Sensei Divinig Top and some Fetchies for a better card draw?
Especially when u play Confidants, i would tend to add Topīs too. Its just an awesome combination - u filter for 1 and often enough just put the land top, leaving ur opponent in the unknowing zone about what else u draw and loosing zero life :)
But i wonder.... what could be cut for letīs say 3 Topīs (which would be my thought considering the number of topīs needed)
Fetchies....hm y actually Fetchies + Top is just "the good stuff" but ur also more vulnerable to stifle n shit :/
I tend to believe many more Mask/Stifle-Noughtīs will show up in the Future....iīd just add tops without fetchies, to prevent having a weak spot vs ***** and Horizons and all that other stifling decks ;)
edit:
WHY does the forum block T R E S H and censors it with stars ?!?!? like this : *****
Because it's actually called Thresh... derive from Threshold, since it's the ability Nimble Mongoose has and it's in that deck. And I believe it played a lot more threshold creatures before back in the days.Originally Posted by sporenfrosch1411
hm i still dont get why it gets censored with that incorrect spelling :D
Is there some translation thingy im missing or some slang ^^ ?
Top is great. I like card quality. Thing is, running top in this deck is a bit like castling in chess. It sets you up for some better plays down the road, but costs you tempo to get the Top down initially. When I tested Top in the deck, I often found myself sitting on a Top that I drew in my opening hand for several turns, because I could not spare the tempo loss to play it. Decks like tribal aggro and Zoo can end the game very quickly if not disrupted in the first few turns of the game. In order to play "catch up," I feel as if the deck would need something to enable you exploit the card quality advantage provided by top, without losing tempo and dying an untimely death. Basically, adding Top pushes the deck in a more controllish direction, which then wants other cards which complement and exploit Top, in order to shore up the control role. In turn, some of the more aggro-ish cards must be cut, in order to make room, etc. The end result is a much different deck.What is about adding Sensei Divinig Top and some Fetchies for a better card draw?
However, by all means test top plus fetches, if you think it's worth a shot. I'm interested to hear what you feel after testing, even if you end up totally disagreeing with me.
I Pretty much agree:
VS Zoo i couldnīt cast the Top, ever. It was in my hand for 2 whole games -.-
VS Combo i would have been to slow if i had cast it, so pretty much the same like vs Zoo
VS Landstill....it owned. Srsly, i had Confi + Top and just had such a good game, controlling my Library like i was playing Blue :D
VS NewHorizon i just casted it first turn, which was OK.....but just because i had no Duress/Therapy to play ;) 2nd Game i did that again, and won again, but im not sure if it was rly the Top who won my game or my godlike Draw....which leads me back to the Top...... *confused* :D
The thing is, i found a turn 2/3 Top to be fine, but u just rarely can cast it Turn1. Also, cutting the Diabolic Edict sent me in some trouble sometimes.
I was thinking about cutting 2 Vampire Nighthawks for the Tops, but havent tried it yet.
I don't like Top here. Maybe because I don't run Bobs, but I don't think we can handle the tempo loss personally. For those of you running Phyrexian Arenas (or anyone really), what are your thoughts on Graveborn Muse? She costs 4, but she gets straight nasty in multiples and ups the threat count as well.
4 Abyssal Persecutor
4 Dark Confidant
2 Faerie Macabre
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
2 Bloodghast
4 Duress
3 Cabal Therapy
2 Bitterblossom
3 Innocent Blood
4 Hymn to Tourach
1 Umezawaīs Jitte
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
17 Swamp
4 Wasteland
1 Urborg Tomb of Yawgmoth
So, pretty much the so far standard list with one exception
Cut out 2 Faeries for:
Bloodghast -> I think he fits very well in the theme, he can provide card advantage by returning and is ok to sac in Innocent Blood :) When he comes back, there will be a Jitte or Sword waiting for him, which then makes him a huge threat
What do you think :) ?
Because it's irritating to see people misspell a simple word. It's not that difficult, try it.
Some of my friends sell records,
some of my friends sell drugs.
Funny board, i like that :)Because it's irritating to see people misspell a simple word. It's not that difficult, try it.
But, back to Topic:
What do you think about adding those 2 Bloodghasts? Playable? Reasonable?
Also:
What do you think can be added to the sideboard to be a good runner vs MuD. I think it will show up often in my Meta :/
Is there anything more effective than Gate to Phyrexia :( ? Or do you think needles do all the needed work?
I like the idea of playing Blooghast instead of the Faeris...
Iīm playing two Oblivion Stone for the MUD/Enchantress/Slow Control with shit like Humility,Moat etc. and Iīm really happy with it.
These decks are so slowly that you should be able cast and activate O-Stone.
Why are you playing 1 Sword of Light and Shadow over a secound Jitte?
Iīm testing IoK instead of Hymn to Tourach... donīt know which one is better.
The Sword (of Light and Shadow) protects from Swords (to Plowshares) and it pumps up so hard..... the 4/5 Nighthawk is just awesome :) giving u 7 Life and a creature from your grave with just one Attack
Rather than the Stone iīd play Nevinraels Disk, way better imo....but a nice idea afterall.... i think iīll add 2 or 3 to the sideboard
But im worried that itīs way too slow and too mana-intensive ( i mean cmon....cc4 is tough) :/
Once the Staxx or the Tanglewire is on the board....im in some kinda trouble :)
I went to Oblivion stone out of the board after falling victim to Jace, TMS a few times. I'm not a huge fan of O-Stone or Nev's Disk, but I figure, since I need to run one or the other, I may as well be as thorough as possible. This deck doesn't have any other way to answer walkers, unless one runs either Pithing Needle or Vampire Hexmage in the board. I can't spare the slots for either, so O-Stone it is for me.Rather than the Stone iīd play Nevinraels Disk, way better imo....but a nice idea afterall.... i think iīll add 2 or 3 to the sideboard
This deck can use Phyrexian Tower as a 1-2 to provide additional uncounterable outs to the demon...
Made it to top4 at local 14-man tournament. Many people went to National Champ instead of Legacy))
I used this build:
18 Swamp
4 Wasteland
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Dark Confidant
3 Abyssal Persecutor
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Diabolic Edict
3 Bitterblossom
3 Innocent Blood
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Cabal Therapy
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Duress
// Sideboard
4 Pithing Needle
3 Engineered Plague
4 Ravenous Trap
3 Perish
1 Free slot
Card choices: 3 Persecutor because I own only 3. SoFI instead of 4th Persecutor, SoLS should be better.
Sideboard: I just picked cards, that I had))
Round 1
2-1 against Merfolks
G1 he didn't have any counters and I simple overrun him with Persecutor.
G2 I see only lands, 2 blossoms and some removal
G3 I started with inquisition, saw Vial, Standstill and 2 Lord of Atlantis, named Vial. Opponent was surprised, but next turn I casted Cabal Therapy naming Lords :)
Round 2
2-1 against CounterRebels with Training Grounds
G1 I kept bad hand and he was faster
G2 and G3 I don't remember, but discard and Persecutor ruled.
Round 3
0-2 against 4c Survival
Both games he quickly set up Survival and I didn't side in Needles. Also in G2 I really was manaflooded, but I don't think I could win either.
Round 4
2-1 against Goblins
G1 First turn Lackey and I didn't have Innocent Blood.
G2 First turn Cabal Therapy into Lackey :) And then 2 Hymns.
G3 After his attack with 3 Piledrivers I cast second Plague :)
I think 4th round I win only due to luck.
So I am very satisfied with this deck.
I went 3-1 at a tournament of 23 (Lost to my undefeated friend, to whom I loaned TES). Ended up 6th because of tiebreakers, and there was no cut.
18 Swamp
4 Wasteland
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Gatekeeper of Malakir
4 Shriekmaw
Nantuko Shade
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Deathmark
2 Diabolic Edict
2 Bitterblossom
4 Phyrexian Arena
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Sword of Light and Shadow
Syphon Life
SB:
3 Pithing Needle
4 Planar Void
Syphon Life
3 Engineered Plague
2 Extirpate
Damnation
Tendrils of Corruption
As you can see I opted to do a few changes. First I took out Abyssal Persecutor and replaced it with Shriekmaw. I was able to get an evoke shriekmaw with Sword of Light and Shadow loop going, and against reanimator, was trying to dump it in the yard as soon as possible.
Inquistion of Kozilek + Thoughtseize because since I have no Persecutor, there really is not a big reason to run Cabal Therapy.
Phyrexian Arena instead of Dark Confidant, because I need my draw to stick.
Syphon Life for some late game lifegain as I draw into the bulk of my lands (especially off Arena). I loved this card and may include more in my next draft.
Nantuko Shade may be replaced, and I want to bring in some Bojuka Bog in the mainboard. I faced no one with green or white creatures so Deathmark will probably be replaced next time.
SB:
Planar Void makes so much sense in this deck. Other than Syphon Life/SoLaS for me, and perhaps Therapy for the other players, we are completely independent from the graveyard. Bojuka Bog in the MD would clean up any cards that might slip in before you drop it.
Syphon Life and Tendrils of Corruption are for lifegain against aggro. These spots are probably replaceable.
Round 1
2-1 vs Mono Red Burn
Game 1: I see all 3 Deathmarks while he is able to burn me out after a turn 2 hymn.
Game 2: I Thoughtseize him, take Chain Lightning and am able to keep 2 nighthawks on the board to beat for the win.
Game 3: I Inquisition him, take Sulfuric Vortex. Nighthawk wins the game again.
Round 2
2-1 vs Mono Red Sligh (This player was not very experienced and made plays like bolting BB tokens. He won the first game due to some bad deathmark draws)
Round 3
0-2 vs TES
Game 1: I turn 2 Hymn and get Ad Nauseam and Brainstorm. My pressure is far too slow. He combos off turn 4ish by Burning Wish for Ill-Gotten Gains then getting back Ad Nauseam to combo off.
Game 2: I turn 1 Planar Void. Turn 2 Hymn getting chrome mox and brainstorm. Turn 3 Engineered Plague for Goblins. Turn 4 land nighthawk which he burning wishes for flame slash to kill. Then he is able to combo off with Ad Nauseam after a hellbent Infernal Tutor.
Round 4
2-0 vs Reanimator (he chose to run Bogardan Hellkites over Iona, sac effects and the cards out the sideboard were too much)
I was able to play mainly against the underdeveloped part of the meta and therefore deathmarks were completely useless. At the top tables of Round 4 I saw Bant countertop, Landstill, Goblins, and TES. So my testing of this deck is a little incomplete.
Man Siege Gang Commander is a tough beat... I was running 4x Smother and 4x Diabolic Edict alongside 4x Gatekeeper, and thus I had no way of dealing with him outside of trading (which is rough when he comes down T2 off a Lackey). I'm rethinking Smother as my targeted removal slot simply because SGC owned me time after time. I'm thinking Vendetta might have a slot here.
On another note: What are some thoughts on SoFI vs SoLS here? SoFI is better against Goblins and Merfolk due to the protection, and can be really good against Zoo as well by negating their burn. It also ups the damage count and provides some nasty CA. SoLS gives our creatures some prtection vs non-burn spot removal, and is extremely good in the mirror. It gives us some (often much needed) lifegain and allows us to trade creatures without fear. Overall I like SoFI, but I'm a CA nut and therefor bias. I'd love to get someone else's thoughts.
what about doomblade ?
the swords are nice but too slow for me. if i had to go with an equip to back up jitte it would probably be basiilik collar. this turns your faeries and gatekeepers into real threat.
which bring me to gatekeepers which after playing a lot this past week in mtgo i find to be a subpar card. it seems like card advantage but you are essentially playing 3 mana for in the best case scenario a fusion of two cards that would never make your deck on their own. grizzly bear and a 3 mana chainers edict. at best i think gatekeeper is 1-2 slot utility back up to diabloic edict/innocent blood in decks that run percy not the star of the show.
the hippy and nantuko are still what i want to see early. they may not be the houses they once but they draw out your opponents best cards. the same goes for confidant. he may not live very long but the amount of pressure he puts on your opponent to find a solution is well worth it imo and he carries jitte whch is something the arena cannot do.
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