Yes it is, if you run mono-red. The ability to destroy artifact immediately (via Vial) is way better than a 1/2 that waits for next turn, albeit costs a tad more. Although if you run Rg tin street is still better of course.Originally Posted by 1maarten1
My meta is filled with Merfolks at the moment, would running 3 Mutavault over 3 Port be ideal in a non-control/countertop meta? Those Mutavaults will get the Island walk from their LoA. Also has anyone tested 8-12 lord version of Gobs with Mutavault?
I saw the list somewhere here a few months ago but has it been dismissed to be a subpar strategy?
Why?
There is no reason Goblins should have a hard time with merfolk. We run better aggro creatures, make better use of Vial, have Goblin Lackey and run the god damn Goblin Piledriver. We have uncounterable removal in the form of Gempalm Incinerator and run way more bombs and card advantage like Goblin Matron and Goblin Ringleader. There's a reason Goblins has been a DTB for nearly forever.
Just crush Merfolk.
But you need to tick Vial up to 4 in order to have Scrapper Vialed in. That's a loooonnngggg time to wait. I'd rather just Vial in Tinkerer eot, then activate on my turn. If my opponent is holding Instant speed removal for the Vialed in Tinkerer, yeah, that sucks, but Scrapper just seems too slow. 4cc for a non-hasting 2/2 body with a build in Shatter seems not as good as Tinkerer for mono-red builds.
Problems with that:
1) Vial rarely stays at 2. So unless you need to kill an artifact on that one turn, you're probably past the point of vialing tinkerer anyway.
2) Vial often waits at 3 or 4 anyway, so if you draw scrapper after you're already vialing in matrons, lords, or ringleaders, its easy to tick up one or stay at 4 and play it.
3) Most importantly, if they have jitte with 2 counters on it, you need warchief out for tinkerer to even work. And jitte is the biggest threat you're boarding in artifact removal for, generally. Most of the time, even if you had a warchief, it died to the first jitte charge. So you have to catch them with no counters and not let them charge it next turn, or have a warchief survive... its tough to do.
Sometimes I've played both tuktuk and tinkerer, though, since it gives you more ways to draw into the solutions, and each is good against different things. Tuktuk is better against jitte, but tinkerer rocks against top and dreadknought, as well as moxen. If you have to pick one though, pick the one that beats jitte, since that's pretty much the best way for merfolk or zoo to beat you.
Also, regarding the 4cc, generally by the time you have to deal with jitte, you can pay 4 mana.
I use Tuktuk Scrapper.
If they have Jitte with 2 counters on it, you don't have Warchief.
Use Scrapper.
Super Bizarros Team. Beating everything with small green dudes and big waves.
TukTuk Scrapper is much better than Tinkerer.
"Tinkerer is better for Affinity and Dreadnought" - Well, Pyrokinesis and Chalice of the Void on 0 can really deal with Affinity, and Stingscourger can deal with Dreadnought.
Perhaps, the artifacts that hates HARD on goblins are: Umezawa's Jitte and Ensnaring Bridge. These two are nicely removed with Scrapper (unless a stifle shows up to save the day).
The same thing can be said about Tinker & removal. Scrapper isn't effected by that.
Not sure what you're saying here, but Scrappers ability is a triggered ability which can be stifled.
Quit playing Legacy but could still play Goblins (Rgw, Rg, Rw, Rb)
ジェームス・ブラウン
I'm staring in the mirror looking at my biggest rival.
He's just saying that stifle is irrelevant, because all the other alternatives can be stifled as well (and are even MORE vulnerable).
First to the Leyline of the Void, i bord it against Dredge, any Loam based deck and Reanimate. There are probably other decks that it could be good against, but i can't think of any other at the moment.
If i remember correctly i boarded:
Round 1, UGW Survival:
-2 Siege-Gang Commander
-3 Goblin Piledriver
+3 Pyrokinesis
+2 Blood Moon
Round 2, White Stax:
-3 Gempalm Incinerator
-1 Lightning Bolt
+2 Blood Moon
+1 Tuktuk Scrapper
+1 Boartusk Liege
Round 3, Storm:
-4 Gempalm Incinerator
-2 Lightning Bolt (Have no idea if this was correct, since i won g1 on Bolt, but i thought he now knew about bolts and that it was obvious that he would play around it. But i could be wrong).
+4 Chalice of the Void
+2 Blood Moon
Round 4, Storm:
See Round 3.
Round 5, Rock:
ID, so no SB.
Top 8:
Quaterfinals, UW Merfolk:
-1 Goblin Warchief (Since this matchup is not about being aggressive, i thought that a more controlling plan with more removal would benefit more than a Warchief, and it worked great).
-1 Mogg War Marshal
-1 Goblin Chieftain (Since he do not play black).
-2 Siege-Gang Commander
+3 Pyrokinesis
+2 Blood Moon
Semifinals, UGW Survival:
Same buddy from round 1, same sideboarding.
Finals, RGB Goblins, the more aggressive list:
1- Skirk Prospector (The card loss generated from this card would have a to big drawback in the mirror imo, and Sharpshooter takes out the majority of the dudes anyway)
-3 Goblin Piledriver
-1 Mogg War Marshal
+3 Pyrokinesis
+1 Tuktuk Scrapper
+1 Boartusk Liege
EDIT: I remember that i also boarded in Pyrokinesis agaisnt storm, but i can't remember what i boarded out, since one of the storm decks had Empty the Warrens.
Last edited by antonbystedt; 11-24-2010 at 11:24 AM.
I think this is wrong...
I would side out 1 Prospector and maybe 1 Matron instead... SGC is awesome.
The only cards I'd board out from the "Core" group are SGC and Piledriver. Taking a Matron or a Ringleader out is not really smart imo.
I use this sideboard:
3x Pyrokinesis
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Relic of Progenitus (sometimes they want to be LotV, but I find a lot of Tarmogoyfs in my meta)
2x Blood Moon
1x TukTuk Scrapper
1x Boartusk Liege
This is how I usually board out/in:
Against UGW Survival:
-2 Piledriver
-2 Siege-Gang Commander
-1 Goblin Chieftain
+2 Blood Moon
+3 Pyrokinesis (or some GY hate)
Against Merfolks:
-3 Lightning Bolt
-1 Mogg War Marshal
+3 Pyrokinesis
+1 Boartusk Liege
Against Staxx:
-3 Gempalm Incinerator
-1 Lightning Bolt
+1 TukTuk Scrapper
+1 Boartusk Liege
+2 Blood Moon
Against Dredge:
-3 Gempalm Incinerator
-1 Goblin Piledriver
-1 Siege-Gang Commander
-1 Skirk Prospector (uh, this is debatable)
+4 Relic of Progenitus
+2 Blood Moon
Against Storm:
-3 Gempalm Incinerator
-1 Mogg War Marshal
-1 Goblin Chieftain
-1 Siege-Gang Commander
+4 Chalice of the Void
+2 Blood Moon
Against Zoo:
-3 Goblin Piledriver
-2 Siege-Gang Commander
+3 Pyrokinesis
+1 TukTuk Scrapper (in case of Jitte)
+1 Boartusk Liege
Red Elemental Blast used to run a 3 of in my sideboard. Are they good enough? (Perhaps, they can save you in a lot of matches).
Thanks for that post Vandalize, it was helpful, I was about to post my decklist and my queries on sideboarding and found yours and saved me time. :)
Just a few questions:
On Dredge, would Tormod's Crypt be better than Relic in what strategy specifically? Wouldn't paying an additional mana to remove the whole graveyard a drawback? Thanks.
Question to Vandalize: How does your MD look, also why do you board out Lightning Bolt against Merfolk? That card helped me alot in that matchup, a 1 for 1 trade for 1 mana against a deck that has poor card generation, so we often have the card advantage, i find this card very usefull for me in this matchup. But that is my oppinion.
And about the REBS, in the meta i have played, i don't know where it could be usefull. Feels like against the natchups it could be used, we either win anyway or there are better cards like Blood Moon, but i have no idea what your meta looks like.
Otherwise i sideboard almost identicall to you :)
EDIT: And yes raindrainxi, against Dredge you want a cheap fast answer, Tormod's Crypt and Leyline of the Void are exactly that.
I tried it out: G-Unit
The sideboard is really strange and mosty composed of cards I wanted to try out (well I wanted to try out a new concept...I actually was in a "try things out"-mood).
I still find the list good, but what I would change is the following:
- 3/4 Piledriver
+ 2 Ringleader
+ W splash for Mirror Entity
MountainCaverns, Lackey, Go.
If you have an apple and I have an apple and we exchanges our apples, we each have one apple. But if you have an idea and I have an idea and we exchange our ideas, we each have two ideas.
My MD is the same as some posted before:
Lands:
4x Wasteland
4x Rishadan Port
14x Mountain
Core:
4x Goblin Lackey
4x Goblin Piledriver
4x Goblin Matron
4x Goblin Ringleader
4x Goblin Warchief
4x AEther Vial
2x Siege-Gang Commander
Removal:
3x Gempalm Incinerator
3x Lightning Bolt
1x Stingscourger
1x Goblin Sharpshooter
Flex-slots:
3x Mogg War Marshal
1x Skirk Prospector
1x Goblin Chieftain
The Lightning Bolts boarded out gives place to Pyrokinesis (which is much more effective). Using 3x Bolts and 3x Pyrokinesis makes the deck less consistent (I mean, Matron and Ringleader have less targets).
But that is my personal opinion... If you feel like you need more removal against merfolks, just keep the bolts MD... My experience shows that Piledrivers can deal with merfolks with no problems at all.
Its 61 cards btw :)!
I have a question about piledriver, I see some people running 3 and I see some people running 4, whats the reasoning behind not running 4? Also Vandalize your list only has 3 gempalm incinerators, how is that working for you? I never found myself in the urge of running less then 4.
The number of piledrivers that you run depends on the meta. Some time ago, when Zoo was a top deck, some people cut piledrivers because it's pretty weak in that matchup. Then, when Merfolk became the top deck, everybody was back to four piledrivers. In a Vengevival-dominated format, I would recommend four piledrivers because Vengevival doesn't play much removal you need to run goblins that get them to lethal damage quickly.
I see more than others do because I know where to look.
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