So, I played in a local legacy tournament yesterday with about 35 people. I finished second and figured I'd put up a list and a quick rundown of my matches.
Round 1 UBW Counter Top with Thopter/Sword of the Meek
Game one - I play some cards that he one-for-ones and manage to kill him with Words of War shortly after he assembles sword/foundry.
Game two - An early blood moon turns him off for more than long enough for me to get set up. Match goes to time after I land Sigil and Words and he's gaining 9 a turn with thopter/sword. I'm pretty sure I win if time isn't called.
Match 1-0
1-0
Round 2 Rb Goblins
Game one - I keep an incredibly speculative hand, and don't get there.
Game two - Goes pretty much to plan. I stick an Elephant Grass on the right turn and a Runed Halo on Siege Gang the turn after. He scoops after I get two draw effects and Solitary on the board.
Game three - He gets ready to come over for 18 points on turn three. You know what beats that? Elephant Grass. The card buys me infinite time until I can get a stable lock.
Match 2-1
2-0
Round 3 Mono-R Goblins
Game one - More little red men? Yes please. He plays some guys. I play a moat. He scares me a bit with some Kiki-Jiki / Sharpshooter shenagans, but I stick the Solitary with plenty of breathing room and Angel him out.
Game two - More of the same. Turns out goblins don't fly, so Moat is pretty sweet. There is never a point in any of these games where I feel like I am close to losing.
Match 2-0
3-0
Round 4 - U/R Sneak and Tell
Game one - Turn two Emrakul? Sweet.
Game two - He goes off turn three with a Progenitus. He gets a hit in and then I stabilize with an Elephant Grass and a Choke and some other stall that makes him stare at me for five turns. I let the grass fall and tap out for a second Enchantress effect and a Solitary with the Grove for the hard lock in my hand. He rips his card, shrugs, lays the Sneak Attack he's been holding and pops in the Terastodon (the only one in his deck) that he ripped, kills some stuff and swings with Progenitus for the win.
Match 0-2
3-1
Round 5 - Rgw Goyf Sly (zoo)
Game one - He attacks me with some guys, I stabilize behind a Moat and Words of War (for his Grim Lavamancer) while I look for the lock. I get greedy and decide to hold Solitary for a turn before I assemble Voltron and he punishes me for it by hiting me with three or four burn spells in the face to finish me off.
Game two / three - My notes are shit, but these games are similar. He burns me quick and attacks me with dudes, and I fight back with some combination of Moat / Elephant Grass / Solitary / Leyline. I really like two copies of Leyline in this match, because there are so many red instants in the opposite deck. Moat / Elephant Grass just isn't enough for a soft lock like it is vs Goblins. Game three is also incredibly satisfying, because he wants to make sure that I can actually kill him, so I get to bring someone to zero instead of just watching them pick up their cards.
Match 2-1
4-1
Round 6
My strength of schedule is strong (the Sneak and Tell Guy is undefeated) and I'm in 4th place, so I draw in.
4-1-1
t8 - Dead Guy Ale (B/W agro)
Game one - he plays some Bobs, a Mother of Runes or two and some swords. I set up a lock and start digging for a Grove to beat his vindicates. At some point, while I'm digging for a Grove and he's digging for a Vindicate he pays a black to lose two life, show me his hand and discard two cards (attempts to Thoughtseize me with Confinement out). I find the Grove (my third of the game) and start going for death by Angles. He buys some time with swords and suited up Serra Avengers, I realize I have 4 draw effects on the board and 11 cards left in my Library, sac the grove to search up Words of War (bottom card) and DD him to death so as not to deck myself.
Game two - More of the same except that he's never close to in it, as I have double Grove lock most of the game. God I love decks that win by turning guys sideways.
Match 2-0
5-1-1
t4 -Sneak and Tell
Game one - The same guy who was my loss in swiss. Awesome. He shows in a turn 3 Emrakul and I pick up my cards. Deja Vu.
Game two - He's digging several turn after I have an oblivion ring for the Emrakul he shows in. I get set up and Words of War him to death before he gets another monster on the table (thank you, Ancient Tomb).
Game three - Pretty tight game. He has a chalice for 1 on turn one, which blanks like 4 cards in my hand, but, thankfully, not a lot of follow up. There's some back and forth with a Woodfall Primus, a Terrastadon, some O-Rings Echoing Truth. At one point he attacks with an Sneak Attacked in Emrakul into my Solitary / draw lock, I manage to bin six of my twelve permanents and fight back. There's a hairy moment towards the end of the game where I have to sack my only grove for the shuffle (Three Enchantress effects, Solitary, one enchantment in hand and three lands on the top) and he Sneaks in a terrastadon to wreck my shit. there are like two turns where if he draws a threat I am pretty boned but I manage to rip the replenish first and promptly words him to the face.
Match 2-1
6-1-1
Finals Ugwr Counter Top
Game one - I'm pretty sure this list is a port for the last Starcity 5k, but if not, close enough. I play a bunch of good cards in the first few turns to bate out his hard counterspells, play a Sigil of the Empty Throne turn 4, and beat down with angels over the next three turns for the win.
Game two - He sticks both pieces, I stick a Shusher, but am a little choked on mana. Infinite blows are traded between the Shusher and a Trinket Mage. After I play a moat he Firespouts and lays a 'Goyf. I feel super vulnerable and dig for a Sterling Grove, and, sure enough, get my moat Gripped in response to casting the Grove. I can't find a Solitary or a Replenish before I get run over.
Game three - This game is a lot like game two. We trade some blows, he eventually Firespouts to clear an Enchantress and a Vexing Shusher, and Grips me before I can find a Grove. If I see a replenish at any point (nigh impossible for them to counter with Counterbalance) or a Grove earlier in either game two or game three, I win.
Match
1-2
6-2-1
The list:
4 Solitary Confinement
4 Enchantress's Presence
4 Argothian Enchantress
4 Sterling Grove
3 Mirri's Guile
4 Elephant Grass
4 Wild Growth
4 Utopia Sprawl
2 Replenish
1 Moat
1 City of Solitude
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Runed Halo
1 Words of War
1 Sigil of the Empty Throne
4 Windswept Heath
2 Serra's Sanctum
1 Savannah (there were supposed to be three, but I couldn't find them, so I put in an extra forest and plains. TBH I couldn't tell the difference)
1 Taiga
9 Forests
4 Plains
SIDEBOARD:
4 Leyline of Sanctity (For Combo, also good in other matches, like Zoo)
2 Blood Moon (Incredible against Junk, can't beat 43 Lands without it, very good against Blue Control with no red)
2 Choke (for 4 color top and other blue decks with uses for red mana)
2 Vexing Shusher (Control takes out all or almost all of their removal after game one. Allstar)
1 Oblivion Ring (Utility)
1 Ground Seal (Dredge / Academy Ruins / Life From the Loam etc)
1 Aura of Silence (Top)
1 Lignify (Iona on white)
1 Dovescape (Its good v counter top, cause, good luck flipping a six with your counterbalance. I haven't been super impressed, though)
I meant to put in a Humility, but forgot to before I turned my decklist in. I would probably cut the dovescape. I also wasn't particularly impressed with Aura of Silence. It just doesn't do enough.
Hope this is helpful, The list got me a Moat. Also, this deck is hard to play and draining (which I'm sure you all know) so go in aware.
Last edited by Hisa; 02-21-2011 at 09:13 PM.
Hmm.....Congrats!!
Your list is nice but I'd rather run one Green Suns Zenith instead to control enchantress effect faster....
My list have just a single Enrakul + Sigil and Words... by the way I like to kill faster w 15/15, because its a monster to beat just with turn 1 clock.
Does anyone knows how handle with Sneak&Show? IMO is a bad match :( despite Hisa take 2nd taking one down but losing before...
I was the Sneak/Show guy, just wanted to compliment you on possibly the best single game I can remember having. Too bad you didn't pull off your matchup in the finals, but Dan Jordan is a pretty hard opponent to beat. Look forward to seeing you at the Depot in the future.Originally Posted by Hisa
Wait a sec... I didn't catch this...
Is Oblivion Ring a legal target to remove Emrakul when SandT is played?
Yes. Emrakul has protection form colored spells. When Oblivion ring picks a target it is a permanent, not a spell. Though if you're asking about the timing on Show and tell I'm not sure. I played the spell the next turn because I wasn't sure on the ruling and didn't want to give away my hand by talking to the judge.
Ehhhh. DJ is a good player, but my record vs him in constructed is pretty good (and I'm way up on him in draft). I made like a mistake and a half in the games I played against him (I missed an attack with a shusher which turned out to be pretty irrelevant, and I played around daze all three games when I'm 95% sure the list he was playing didn't have any). Other than that my reads were all pretty much dead on, and I'd like to think I did my shit independent of his head games and shit talk. Some times the cards flip the way you need them to, and some times they don't. That's why its MtG and not Chess.
Unrelated and back on topic: I want to fit one more replenish main and one more sideboard. That card is a HOUSE against Counter-Top. Two Jaces and a Moat are your only 4s? Cool, one-for-oneing me is now even worse.
I'm running three Replenish in the MD and none in the sideboard. It's been great especially in my control metagame. Replenish basically functions as a win condition against blue decks.
Targeting Emrakul with O-Ring just seens to me that we can't remove because the protection means all colored sources. O-ring beeing white doesn't matter how it does in play, but still is white and screw us a little bit, when it is played with SaT. This is my opinion (yes I want to see the rules for sure). IMO if there are any rule about it maybe it would be considered something compared with Enduring Ideal + Confiscate enchanting anyone shroud creature controled by opp
The explanation for why an Oblivion Ring can exile an Emrakul can be clarified. The reasoning behind why Oblivion Ring can do so is because its ability is an ETB Trigger, which Emrakul does not have protection from, as simple as that. The triggered source can be all five colors and still target Emrakul.
Show and Tell is resolving - You pick Oblivion Ring, your opponent picks Emrakul.
Show and Tell resolves - Both permanents are put onto the battlefield.
Oblivion Ring's ability triggers - Emrakul is a legal target since at this point, Oblivion Ring is no longer a spell on the stack.
Same concept behind Sower of Temptation, Gilded Drake, and other favorites.
Not to be confused with Show and Tell'ing a Mind Control/Confiscate/Control Magic type card into play (an Aura); that won't work. 303.4f of the Comprehensive Rules:
303.4f If an Aura is entering the battlefield under a player’s control by any means other than by
resolving as an Aura spell, and the effect putting it onto the battlefield doesn’t specify the object
or player the Aura will enchant, that player chooses what it will enchant as the Aura enters the
battlefield. The player must choose a legal object or player according to the Aura’s enchant
ability and any other applicable effects.
Since they are entering the battlefield simultaneously, the Aura will not see Emrakul and it will not be a legal object that it could enchant.
If you are playing Enduring Ideal + some Aura, since it will enter the battlefield with Emrakul already there, then that Aura can enchant it.
In the scope of an Enchantress, if you want to save yourself from Emrakul, Show and Tell an Oblivion Ring into play. If you can't, put a Solitary Confinement into play, discard your Lignify, then cast Replenish
Delver enthusiast and avid practitioner of blind flipsmanship.
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Nice! I'm glad now to think how I can handle with these hard-shrouded-mounsters...by the way so...If I play Lignify with SaT targeting Emrakul, its resolves like O-Ring right? Knowing about this all concerns about compreensive rules, what is the best strategy?The explanation for why an Oblivion Ring can exile an Emrakul can be clarified. The reasoning behind why Oblivion Ring can do so is because its ability is an ETB Trigger, which Emrakul does not have protection from, as simple as that. The triggered source can be all five colors and still target Emrakul.
Show and Tell is resolving - You pick Oblivion Ring, your opponent picks Emrakul.
Show and Tell resolves - Both permanents are put onto the battlefield.
Oblivion Ring's ability triggers - Emrakul is a legal target since at this point, Oblivion Ring is no longer a spell on the stack.
Same concept behind Sower of Temptation, Gilded Drake, and other favorites.
Not to be confused with Show and Tell'ing a Mind Control/Confiscate/Control Magic type card into play (an Aura); that won't work. 303.4f of the Comprehensive Rules:
303.4f If an Aura is entering the battlefield under a player’s control by any means other than by
resolving as an Aura spell, and the effect putting it onto the battlefield doesn’t specify the object
or player the Aura will enchant, that player chooses what it will enchant as the Aura enters the
battlefield. The player must choose a legal object or player according to the Aura’s enchant
ability and any other applicable effects.
Since they are entering the battlefield simultaneously, the Aura will not see Emrakul and it will not be a legal object that it could enchant.
If you are playing Enduring Ideal + some Aura, since it will enter the battlefield with Emrakul already there, then that Aura can enchant it.
In the scope of an Enchantress, if you want to save yourself from Emrakul, Show and Tell an Oblivion Ring into play. If you can't, put a Solitary Confinement into play, discard your Lignify, then cast Replenish
I was thinking about it minutes ago... in my current list I'm running:
1x O-Ring
1x Karakas
2x Replenish (maybe that what I said could work)
1x Emrakul
SB:
1x O-Ring
I'm not saying you're wrong, but the judge at our event said lignify can't target Emrakul since the target is announced as the spell is put on the stack, at which point it is still a colored spell, not a permanent. I'm not sure if this is right, it's just what we were told.
You are correct. Lignify cannot be used as an answer to Emrakul.
But Iona sure loves to be enchanted by it.
So, y'know, I'm really starting to get annoyed by the Rock MU. Their entire removal suite (with exception for StP) is relevant against us, and I'm just wondering how many other people are having the same issue/how we can best resolve this.
I already am running 4 Leyline of Sanctity in the SB, 1 Karmic Justic MD/SB, however MD Thoughtseize/Hymn/Vindicate/Deed/EE aside, they also have access to Extirpate, Engineered Plague, Diabolic Edict/Deed's/EE's/Krosan Grip (last Rock player I went up against even had Gaddock Teeg and Phyrexian Revoker).
True, mulling aggressively for that Leyline does help, however even that you still need to try and drop Enchantress effects as well as Sterling Groves which even in a good MU is sometimes difficult. I'm thinking about throwing Suppression Field back into the SB as it helps to stop/negate their various Top and shuffle effects (like KotR fetching Karakas/Bog) and at least slows down their fixing/thinning. Granted it'd hurt my deck a little bit more than others since I'm running 8 fetches, but still I'm just trying to figure out ways to deal with this MU.
As for the rest of my SB the only other cards I have that would be of any relevance are my 2 Wish targets Peacekeeper/Bojuka Bog, both of which would only weaken their creatures which is the lowest priority for me most of the time.
Anyway, lemme know what your opinions are.
Forlorn Egoist
As a Rock player, I'd think that Rock would be your toughest MU. Blood Moon really doesn't do much against us if we are running Mox Diamond. The thing that works best is laying down Sterling Groves and comboing off as fast as possible. Boarding in more Replenish can also be key. Lignify is great too and a lot better than O-ring against us.
My friend plays enchantress, but he plays the blue build, which is why I think the following question is important to answer:
Does the benefits of the standard red splash outweigh the blue.
Red: Blood Moon, Words of War
Blue: In the eye of chaos, Copy Enchantment, back to basics, Energy Flux as an option for the board.
At first, the list he ran contained words of wind, but he chose to replace it with a second in the eye of chaos which at this point has been a universal bomb against everything non aggro which has historically been the more difficult area for enchantress. As a combo player, he has taken several games from me as In the eye of chaos is the only card that the deck cant answer, and as long as the combo player doesnt win first turn it is easy raceable. Back to Basics effectively functions as mana denial, taking over Blood moon's role while copy enchantment functions as general utility, copying draw effects, sterling groves, oblivion rings, or anything else you need at the time. My friend has been successful with his build, and I would like to know what everyone's opinions are.
Call me Ishmael
IMO In The Eye of Chaos is slight worse than a City of Solitude (considering control meta). I don't like Blood Moons and Back to Basics...Moons effects affect my own fetches and Sanctuary too. BtB in SB is good against most control decks (wich would be replaced by Chokes) but affect my lands instead...
Actually I advocate this because my current list follows a different system: draw many cards as you can get every turn, playing low cc enchants and tap a single Sanctuary summoning Emrakul to hit in a single move. Often I need Sanctuary early and Moon or BtB screw me up sometimes. I hate when it happens, so I prefer change my SB (run Chokes maybe 3).
Explaining about Sneak&Show strategies and compreensive rules (I found, yes I did lol):
6/15/2010: Emrakul may be affected by colored spells that don't target it or deal damage to it, including those that cause it to become blocked. Abilities of colored permanents (such as Journey to Nowhere) may target it. Auras may be moved onto it by abilities or by colored spells that don't target it (such as Aura Graft).
Right. Oblivion can eat the monster! Sweet :P (live and learn ^^)
In my side i play sacred ground for face emrakul. Simply setting me under confinement or runed haloo for avoid direct damage, i can survive to the annihilator problem using my lands with sacred ground.
And Sacred ground is very useful is some match-up like aggroloam playing devastating dreams or a stax.
Sacred Ground does certainly have some merit in mid-late game scenario, however it is not really tech I would consider useful for Emrakul. We're afraid of Emrakul primarily when facing Sneaky Show/Hypergenesis/etc. that can accelerate him out T3-5 whereas in the mirror the Annihilator is manageable. Remember that in regards to Annihilator/Stax (sac) effects, you can't bypass them with SG by simply re-sacing the same land X number of times (because thats against the rules, children). SG does save our lands, however aforementioned sac effects can still rip apart our board to the point of death. Most AggroLoam lists have begun to abandon DD entirely as it is a card that does little to aid the game state for them, hence it has been reduced to a mere Wish target. TBH I've learned to essentially stop trying to stop combo decks and just build a SB to strengthen our aggro/combo MU's.
Forlorn Egoist
If you have to sac X permanents you can simply sac X land. SG will save all of them. Right?
Sadly you will lose your growth but no more.
Of course t3-5 fatty is a problem but if you arrange to slow him down to a mid-game you can bring it home with a strong lock.
This deck is not played a lot in my meta, but, should it become, I'll return to 1 karakas maindeck and 1 crop rotation in sideboard as when reanimator was heavily played.
The list in the t8 of the SCG 5k looks terrrrrrrrible, by the way.
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