This may sound a little crazy but I have been play testing Bind instead of Sinkhole and I think I am in love.
It hits
Fetch Lands <--- Its a green stifle here!
Plainswalkers
Sensei's divining top
Aether Vial
Mother of Runes
Stoneforge Mystic
Mangara of Corondor
Wasteland
Rishadan Port
Karakas
Grim Lavamancer
Coralhelm Commander
Umezawa's Jitte
Gempalm Incinerator
Siege-Gang Commander
Goblin Sharpshooter
Qasali Pridemage
Knight of the Reliquary
Maze of Ith
Pernicious Deed
I've been hating on Nighthawk quite a bit recently. It's a tiny bit on the slow side against aggro, though it is rather good there, but so often its either too slow or just worthless against other decks.
I feel like Snuff Out and 2 or 3 Tombstalker are necessary to keep up with the decks out there, even with the full set of Bobs. It's a lot of life loss, but if you can manage to keep control of the game between Snuff out, Deed, discard and Goyf acting as a wall, I've found I can usually either win or re-gain life with Nighthawk before I kill myself. Plus, all the lifeloss makes the deck more exciting to play! Bob usually gets killed/countered anyway.
What do you guys think about Hyppie? I've been running 2 and I love the guy. He's so useful in forcing the opponent to play whatever they have in hand and he does a great job of hurting any blue deck.
With the increasing amounts of Combo coming back, I think the Chokes in my board might be going back to 2 Tormod's Crypts and a spare discard spell.
Something like...
4 Extirpate
2 Tormod's Crypt
2 Krosan Grip
3 Engineered Plague
2 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Duress
What are you trying to accomplish with 2 crypt against combo? Crypt is not very relevant against combo (unless you consider dredge combo and even if you do, you have enough hate for it already)Originally Posted by Sintheros
Hits re animator too. Shrug. There's just a whole lot of combo lately and there's not a lot we can do against it sometimes. Have any better ideas?
Phyrexian revoker to start with. If you expect a lot of combo even mindbreak trap. Additional discard is allright too. Needle if they have DD plan.
Reanimator is rarely played here, I don't know how relevant it is in your meta. Against ichorid I believe ravenous trap may be the better card if you don't have trinket mage or E tutor to fetch crypt.
I know tombstalker is good. But is the control version of this deck really better then the suicide confidant negater approach?
Has anyone tried the white splash? The 3 best threats in legacy are Goyf, Stalker and KOTR. KOTR and stalker don't gel and the problem with Stalker is that multiple are bad and the dis synergy with bob. Having white also gives you vindicate for the total mana denial plan. KOTR fetching wastelands further enhances the mana denial plan. You are also able to play Bobs now that Stalker is cut. The deck seems to look like a suicide version of the Rock. I plan to give this a try:
4 Dark Ritual
4 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition of Kozilek (Need more 1cc spells, could also be top)
4 Hymm
4 Sinkhole
4 Vindicate
4 Goyf
4 KOTR
4 Bob
2 Snuff Out
2 STP
4 Wastes
9 Black Fetches
4 Bayou
3 Scrubland
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Karakas
Thoughts?
You're essentially playing Dark Horizons now.
Naming conventions are a pain. Is there a thread for Dark Horizons? Or should the white splash discussion be moved to "the rock" thread? I get confused by the names.
All the same. A list like that belongs in the Rock thread though.
you just gotta take it like a man. chances are they will waste all their removals on bob anyways. so you wont' even have a bob in play.
and 3 cards out of 60...you wont hit it THAT often to cost you the game.
Agreed 100%. 3 Tombstalker has won me countless games, even with 4 Bob, no tops and Snuff Outs. Of course I play 4x Nighthawk, but 2-3 Tombstalker is absolutely neccessary to seal games off quickly, especially since Stalker survives Deed like a champ. I think Top is far too mana-intensive for Evagreen.
I don't know about Top... I often find myself not really needing it, but sometimes it really saves my ass. The thing with Eva, you're always putting all your eggs in one basket. It usually pays off, but when it doesn't, you really need to be able to control your draws.
That said, I run two tops...but no Bobs. Like bracer said, everyone spends their removal to get rid of him. He acts more like a red herring than a card-draw engine. I don't run fish, why play a herring?
Skizzik No Kicker. Like a true retard.
not a fan of the gatekeepers. gave them a try and i think they are too hit or miss. for every dark ritual, into gatekeeper on lackey, there is a swamp,bayou, wasteland, top deck gatekeeper hand.
going to just swap them straight for nighthawks and see how that goes...or try some combination of bobs/tops
I've been not liking the Gatekeepers lately as well. I run 3 and 3 Nighthawks right now. I was thinking about just swapping the Gatekeepers for Edicts and taking out 2 Tombstalkers for 2 KotR...making my deck less and less Eva...
It's been a few pages since I've posted my list, so:
Creatures (15)
4x Tarmogoyf
4x Tombstalker
3x Vampire Nighthawk
3x Gatekeeper of Malakir
Spells (21)
4x Thoughtseize
4x Hymn to Tourach
2x Reaminate
2x Pernicious Deed
3x Maelstrom Pulse
2x Sensei’s Divining Top
4x Swords to Plowshares
1x Umezawa’s Jitte
Land (24)
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Marsh Flats
4x Bayou
2x Scrubland
4x Wasteland
1x Forest
1x Plains
4x Swamp
Sideboard (15)
2x Choke
3x Engineered Plague
3x Leyline of the Void
2x Ravenous Trap
2x Perish
1x Relic of Progenitus
1x Ethersworn Canonist
1x Tormod’s Crypt
Skizzik No Kicker. Like a true retard.
This is the deck i will be entering in 2 weeks in a 40 man unknown meta tournament.
[DECK]
Creatures
3x dark confidant
3x tombstalker
3x gatekeeper of malikar
3x vampire nighthawk
4x tarmogoyf
Enchantments
2x pernicious deed
2x engineered plague
Instants
3x smother
3x go for the throat
4x dark ritual
sorcery
4x hymn to tourach
4x thoughtseize
2x inquisition of kolizek
lands
4x bayou
4x wasteland
4x verdant catacombs
2x marshflats
1x forest
5x swamp
sideboard
2x umezawa's jitte
3x krosan grip
1x engineered plague
4x pithing needle
4x extirpate
1x pernicious deed
[/DECK]
I'm thinking. against the fish matchup and goblins, I don't ever play pithing needle. I would rather put in my engineered plagues.
So, i actually i don't even know why i need 4x pithing needles in my deck. I cannot stop storm combo with it. The only thing i can do with pithing needle is maybe use it against sneak attack. and thats about it.
So do you guys think i should take out the 4x pithing needles for maybe 4x mindbreak traps?
Also, should i take out the last pernicious deed for 1x maelstrom pulse?
I think it's time to revive sui black/eva green
No one will ever dare block that die, or try to burn him, so barring StP, it's a four turn clock.
Between this, Gatekeeper of Malakir, Vampire Nighthawk, Dark Confidant, Hymn to Tourach, Dark Ritual and Duress, maybe even Go for the Throat or Hypnotic Specter, I'm liking how the deck is looking.
We will need to do away with Wasteland, and thus Sinkhole as well though, but I don't think that hurts the deck. So many decks play Wasteland and are prepared for opposing Wasteland that it's not as broken a card as it once was.
Thinking of playing Eva Green at the SCG Open Denver in June, here's my tentative list:
4 Dark Ritual
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Thoughtseize
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Diabolic Edict
2 Sylvan Library
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Tombstalker
4 Nantuko Shade
4 Hypnotic Specter
4 Phyrexian Crusader
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Marsh Flats
4 Bayou
1 Forest
7 Swamp
SB
4 Extirpate
4 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Engineered Plague
3 Null Rod
1 Pernicious Deed
The creature package is where I'm mostly having issues...Shade/Specter/Crusader are all pretty debatable. Possible alternatives include Nighthawk, Gatekeeper, and the new Phyrexian Cancellor (maybe a 2/2 split between him and Crusader). Also 3 Deed/Edict vs. 2/2/2 with Maelstrom Pulse?
Opinions?
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