A brief tournament report.
Round 1 vs GW Aggro
G1: I put him on the wrong deck and get punished for keeping a poor hand.
G2: I have removal for his threats and the rest is Tarmogoyf beats.
G3: Steppe Lynx hits for 5 on turn 2. I burn him out a couple turns later.
2-1
Round 2 vs Faerie Stompy
G1: He plays Chalice for 1. My hand consisted of Tarmogoyf, Tarmogoyf and Knight of the Reliquary.
G2: I get him down to 5 life then we play draw go for a while. I top deck a Krosan Grip and play it on his Chalice for 1. Chain Lightning, Lightning Bolt -- GG.
2-0
Round 3 vs Deadguy Ale
G1: On turn two he plays Dark Ritual, Dark Ritual, Hymn to Tourach, Hymn to Tourach. I magically pull a win on the back of a Sylvan Library and lone Tarmogoyf.
G2: Turn 0 Leyline of Sanctity.
2-0
Round 4
Cancelled due to a car hitting a power line outside, which caused my LGS's power to shut off. The car did catch fire, and I did see some cool explosions though.
Will the new Mental Misstep be trouble for Zoo decks?
It can counter a half the deck, I think. Hits Lightning Bolt, Grim Lavamancer, Chain Lightning, Path to Exile, Swords to Plowshares, Wild Nacatl, Kird Ape, Loam Lion, Figure of Destiny, Steppe Lynx, etc...
The drawback is pretty revelant tho, losing 2 life against Zoo can be pretty bad.
Zoo isn't a deck that needs to be worried, It's a deck that should be rejoicing. You can play the card yourself, be redundant enough to not care, and also be a damage oriented deck. With two new free cards that cost life, this deck becomes a bit better.
Chalice at 1 > Mental MisstepOriginally Posted by Vandalize
Don't worry about it, let people board it in against you.
We can always board it in ourselves. Nice Top counter too!
Quit playing Legacy but could still play Goblins (Rgw, Rg, Rw, Rb)
ジェームス・ブラウン
I'm staring in the mirror looking at my biggest rival.
Yesterday i let my friend borrow my Zoo deck at a 10man local legacy tournament. He took 1st place while i took 3rd... i do have to add this that he took out 2 Knight of the Reliquary and replaced them with 2 Burning Tree Shaman.... and i have to say, the Shamans were a hosue.... they were dealing like over 5-6 damages with their annoying abilities alone while the Goyfs and Knights were being chump blocked... i was pretty surprised how badly he beat Forgemaster... even with a Wurmcoil engine out the guy lost cause he was already low in life and a wurmcoil cannot block more than 1 creature..
For those of your running Null Rod to deal with the rise of artifact-based decks, is it time to start switching to Ancient Grudge instead?
An early Null Rod is GG against a lot of the artifact decks, but you only have a 40% chance of drawing it in your opening hand, and we have no library manipulation. You can't aggressively mulligan for it either because your risk getting blown out by a Force of Will or Painter's Servant/Red Elemental Blast against U/R Painter, Thoughtseize or Nature's Claim against Affinity, or fat beats like Wurmcoil Engine against Forgemaster Stompy.
Moreover, Null Rod is completely crippling only against Affinity, but only if they don't already have a significant board presence. It only slows down Painter and Stompy slightly.
Ancient Grudge is a two-for-one Vindicate that can be played at instant speed on turn two, and recurred on turn 3, whether or not they have Counters/Discard. Against U/R Painter, it slows down both their grindout plan and their Emrakul plan (by hitting their manabase), while threatening to fizzle their Blasts by destroying Painter in response. Against Affinity, you can aggressively destroy their crappy manabase and even turn off metalcraft and affinity if you have it early, but you can also answer a Master of Etherium or Cranial Plating if you rip it late, which Null Rod cannot do. Against Forgemaster decks, it answers the devastating Chalice for 1 play (as well as Trinisphere), as well as hitting all their creatures, which they are capable of dropping off Ancient Tomb/City of Traitors. It's pretty solid against the likes of CounterThopter too. The only problem is that it's not great against Storm combo, which Null Rod is solid against.
I used to run 4 copies of Null Rod, but I think I'll start switching a number of them plus Krosan Grips for Ancient Grudge because my metagame is so inundated with artifact based decks.
That's all sound logic, but there are a few things you didn't really take into account. Null Rod is a fire-and-forget type hate artifact. Ancient Grudge is a one time, maybe two time shot, that requires more open mana. Null Rod in the right match up is a great top deck, none the less. In match ups where it is good, your removal is also good, so a Path/Bolt in the mean time will do just fine. I've quite liked it, to be honest. It's unconventional, but I borded in Rod against Storm to a win. Lotus Petal and LED looked pretty dumb in his hand while he dug for a bounce spell.
In general, global effects are better hate for Zoo to pack than one time spells
I run 3x Null Rod, 2x E-Tutor, 1x Canonist, 1x Pyrostatic Pillar in the board. You won't have an issue with finding the Rod when you can tutor it up, plus it dodges Duress effects.
With Misstep in the format, E-Tutor may be harder to resolve, though.
A book about the dark side of Legacy: "Magic: The Addiction" // Conversations with Magic players: "Humans of Magic"
I tried the Enlightened Tutor package back when 43 Lands, Storm, and Dredge were popular about 9 months ago, and I was pretty happy with it. It allowed me to squeeze a lot of silver bullets in the board while protecting from discard. However, Enlightened Tutor package isn't as hot against decks running counterspells that can 2-for-1 you (U/R painter, Counter Thopter, High Tide, etc.) It's also a bit weak against Forgemaster combo because the most dangerous thing they run is Chalice for 1.
I tried the Enlightened Tutor package back when 43 Lands, Storm, and Dredge were popular about 9 months ago, and I was pretty happy with it. It allowed me to squeeze a lot of silver bullets in the board while protecting from discard. However, Enlightened Tutor package isn't as hot against decks running counterspells that can 2-for-1 you (U/R painter, Counter Thopter, High Tide, etc.) It's also a bit weak against Forgemaster combo because the most dangerous thing they run is Chalice for 1.
i just got 2 times champion last April 16 & April 23 using my Aggro Zoo.. 5 rounds.. just for PR Pass Tournament.
April 16 - with 11 Players - 5-0
Round 1 - just got Lucky with a bye
Round 2 - vs MBC - got 2-0 - win via aggro nactl and kird ape + burn
Round 3 - vs TES - got 2-0 - win via true believer + combo hate
Round 4 - vs Enchantress - got 2-1 - win via canonist on game 1 + game 2 mindbreak trap
Round 5 - vs Rock - 2-0 - win via aggro + burn
----------------------------------------------
April 23 - with 15 Players - 4-0-1
Round 1 - vs MBC - got 2-0 - win via goyf, nactl + burn
Round 2 - vs Dredge - ID because he was my team mate - 1-1 draw
Round 3 - vs Merfolk - Mono Blue - got 2-1 - misplay on game 1 wrong computation on burn , win via game 2 and game 3 via grim , nactl, goyf
Round 4 - vs Merfolk - Mono Blue - got 2-1 - land drought on game 1 mullgan for 4 1 land play T_T , game 2 and 3 win via grim + goyf + burn
Round 5 - vs BW Deadguy - got 2-0 - he was also my team mate. - win via aggro
-----------------
this was my deck i was currently using:
CREATURES :
4 Wild Nactl
4 Qasali Pridemage
4 Grim Lavamancer
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Kird Ape
2 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Phyrexian Revoker
2 True Believer
SPELLS :
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
4 Path to Exile
3 Lightning Helix
LANDS :
4 Windswepth Heath
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Taiga
3 Plateau
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Arid Mesa
1 Karakas
1 Forest
1 Plains
1 Mountains
SIDEBOARD :
3 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Mindbreak Trap
3 Pyroblast
1 Krosan Grip
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Pyroclasm
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Price of Progress
1 Pithing Needle
=============
this wil lbe my deck that i will use this coming April 30 - Mox Sapphire Tournament hope that my zoo will prevail
heres my list for Fast Zoo and its been performing great in playtests:
4 steppe lynx
4 wild nacatl
4 tarmogoyf
2 loam lion
2 grim lavamancer
3 qasali pridemage
4 lightning bolt
4 chain lightning
4 lightning helix
2 fireblast
2 price of progress
3 path to exile
2 sylvan library
11 fetches
2 plateau
2 taiga
1 savannah
1 horizon canopy
1 mountain
1 plains
1 forest
3 green sun zenith
2 gaddock teeg
3 ethersworn cannonist
2 pyroblast
2 red elem blast
3 tormods crypt
so far it beats the hell out of my buddies fish deck and can beat dredge too... i just need to take it to a tournament to try it out. Anyone else having fun with steppe lynx?? i just gotta say that hes a beast... there were plenty of times when he swung with exalted for 5 damage on turn 2.. I'd say just 1 or 2 swings alone makes the steppe lynx worthwhile for inclusion... its true that hes a terrible topdeck, but usually by topdeck, i have nacatls and goyfs to compensate for his MIA from early games. On top of that, goyfs and nacatls can usually only deal 3-4 damage on turn 2-3... steppe lynx on the other hand is a just crazy...
EDIT: Also, depending on what i think the meta will be, i swtich out my sideboard options to the usual suspects of Jitte and/or Kgrips
Hey,
No Goblin Guide? I would replace the 2 Loam Lion and 3 Pridemage's with 4 GG and +1 Lavomancer. Pridemage just doesn't seem great here.
I would replace the Lightning Helix with +1 Fireblast and PoP, and personally I have been running 2 Reckless Charge, but if you don't like these then +2 Fireblast / PoP I guess. I don't really like Helix in this deck at all.
I think 12 fetches, 4 Taiga and 4 Plateau is optimal personally, we don't really need to concern ourselves with wasteland protection, and Horizon Canopy seems out of place.
the pridemages are great and i will never ever take them out of zoo ever again.... theres just been way too many times where they are useful... besides, they help Lynx or Nacatls swing in for 1 more life.... that 1 life point can mean the difference. Also, i was thinking bout cutting back on some helix's, but they are still an instant effect bolt and the life gain is nice VS other aggro decks... i thought about running goblin guide too since he helps u see what they have ready for your early game... ill try testing out GG next time i get a chance.
Also, Horizon canopy is just really good... theres also been many games where i used the draw effect at EOT of opponents and drew a pesky land... then on my draw step i would draw a bolt effect... i even thought bout runnign 1 more.
Hello. First time poster, long time lurker. I've been playing Zoo for the past 5 months recently getting back into Magic after a long hiatus. I've been piloting Zoo to some top 8 finishes at our local tournaments. Our meta is interesting, being comprised of some top tier decks and many rogue decks. Goblins, Fish, Show & Tell, Reanimator, The Gate, NOPRO Bant, Countertop and Elf Ball are many of the decks being played. I've adjusted my build to fit our current meta and it hasn't disappointed yet. Here's the list:
3 Plateau
3 Taiga
1 Savannah
4 Wooded Foothills
3 Windswept Heath
3 Arid Mesa
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Plains
1 Forest
1 Mountain
3 Grim Lavamancer
2 Kird Ape
3 Steppe Lynx
4 Wild Nacatl
4 Qasali Pridemage
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Wooly Thoctor
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
4 Path to Exile
4 Chain Lightning
The SB varies. At the moment we have no combo decks in our meta so it mainly looks like this:
3 Pithing Needle
3 Red Elemental Blast
3 Orim's Chant
3 Faerie Macabre
3 Oblivion Ring
I've based some of the deck choices on other people's lists, trial and error, and from what I've seen other players playing. Wooly Thoctor for example I know is just a vanilla creature with a somewhat difficult mana cost. This weekend he was a champ for me against our Fish player. I decided to run 2 copies of KOR and 2 copies of Thoctor which has worked out for me so far. If our meta shifts again I will probably be looking at playing GSZ for obvious reasons, but I've yet to test it. I like the applications of it giving you a better late game if it gets that far. I'm looking for some feedback. If you have any advice or questions I would appreciate it.
Thanks
Don't wait for the meta game to shift. Go ahead and run GSZ. It's a wonderful addition to the deck, you won't look back.
Looks like you are trying to get in for quick damage in the early game since you are running Steppe Lynx... i would probably want to cut an ape and run up to 4 copies of the Lynx... you always want to draw one in your opening hand because of the amount of pressure he can cook up to an opponent on turn 2-3 and even turn 4.
Also, after doing more playtesting with steppe lynx, i'm currently going to 12 fetches now and im not turning back, i used to run 10 and then 11.. but the early game with steppe lynx is VERY important if you want to apply early pressure. I'd also like to state that without the inclusion of steppe lynx, the deck seems to lean more towards Regular Zoo (mid range if you wanna call it that).
After doing hours of testing with different people, I'd also like to say that goblin guide has been VERY good at testing... hes never a bad option in your opening hand and hes never a bad topdeck... there were many times where i would Turn 1 steppe lynx, pass turn. Turn 2 play a fetch, crack it to fetch a mountain land and then swing for 6 damage on turn 2. Thats like 1/3 of your opponents life basically... 6 damage on turn 2 is huge BTW, remember reanimator decks going off on turn 2 with Akroma... thats basically what you are doing here (ofcourse the little pussy cat and a goblin are no match for a akroma)
Anyone had any success in a rather large tournament with Steppe Lynx?
Sure, but I only played three. Through my own experience, I never wanted to draw more than one, at any point in the game. If you play your fetch lands conservatively, it's not a bad draw.
I went 7-2 with zoo this weekend at the Star City Open in Boston. First time playing legacy ever. Had a blast. Got 19th. Here's the list I ran:
CREATURES (20)
4 Wild Nactl
3 Kird Ape
3 Loam Lion
4 Qasali Pridemage
4 Tarmogoyf
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Terravore
SPELLS (19)
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Chain Lightning
3 Rift Bolt
2 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Lightning Helix
2 Sylvan Library
1 Fireblast
LANDS (21)
4 Arid Mesa
3 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothills
3 Plateau
3 Taiga
2 Savannah
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Forrest
1 Mountain
1 Plains
SIDE BOARD (15)
2 Gaddock Teeg
3 Kataki, War's Wage
4 Ethersworn Canonist
4 Mindbreak Trap
2 Krosan Grip
My list has one or two unorthodox includes/excludes. I didn't run any Paths, or Lavamancers, or Knights of the Reliquary -- all fantastic cards that seem to be really en vogue for zoo decks. Instead, I ran more Kird Animals and burn. This was an attempt to improve my matchup against combo. The idea being that by limiting dead cards and increasing redundancy I could achieve a more consistent and meaningful Game One without also then giving up too much ground in my aggro matchups.
Here's a breakdown of some card choices and my reasoning (I have very little experience with the deck and format, so keep that in mind when I say something obviously stupid. Feedback very appreciated):
Path to Exile x 0
PtE was the last card I cut, and will probably be the first card I put back in. Ultimately, though, it didn't gel with my build's thesis, and I felt I could get away with replacing it. Path is a great answer to most giant creatures, but it doesn't answer Emrakul and it doesn't answer Progenitus -- two of the three giant creatures I'm most afraid of. Sure, it's a nice card to have against Knight of the Reliquary, Tarmogoyf, Coralhelm Commander, Tombstalker, etc.
My thinking was that these demi-giant creatures, while still threats, wouldn't be able to end the game in one swing on their own, so if I gained an early tempo advantage via creature pressure and burn I would create a game state in which my opponent's bigger threats were forced to defend. Once this happened, I could just wait for favorable combat math, creating a board stall that would likely swing in my favor due to the amount of direct damage my list is packing. So I cut my PtE's with all this in mind, hoping Pridemage would be enough maindeck action against Stiflenaught.
Rift Bolt x 3
So what's the natural alternative to one of the best removal spells ever printed? I don't know. Not Rift Bolt, but that's what I put in over Path (3x Rift Bolt, 1x Fireblast). While not as cool as Path, Rift Bolt still manages to be pretty cool. It does a lot of neat things for the deck. For instance, Suspend 1 gives you virtual turn-one removal that essentially avoids Daze while setting up powerful turn-two tempo plays (Turn 1: land, suspend Rift Bolt. Turn 2: untap, resolve Rift Bolt, land, Nactl, etc etc). Its casting cost helps get around Counter/Top and Chalice (and Mental Misstep, once it's legal). It's a sorcery, which helps pump Tarmogoyf. Best of all, it's three damage for one mana, which increases the chances of resolving nine damage by turn two. Against any deck that plays Ad Nauseam, that kind of pressure seemed to vastly increase likelihood of winning, especially on the play. In nine rounds of Legacy I was never unhappy to draw Rift Bolt.
Kird Ape x 3 / Loam Lion x 3
Pat Cox top 8'd Atlanta with six of these guys in his zoo. Awesome list. His version also ran an equipment package, so he got a little more value out of his Kird Animals than I did, but even without equipment their 2/3 bodies and their one-mana casting cost makes them worthwhile. Three toughness on turn one*lets you control the initial pace of a lot of aggro matchups, especially against the tribal decks. On the attack, three toughness limits an opponents ability to trade creatures with you when blocking becomes the play. Untapped, three toughness creates a wall that necessitates lords, goyfs, or three-drops. If you're representing burn, you basically control the combat phase turns 1 through 4.
Cox played a 4-2 Ape/Lion split. I think it should probably be 3-3. Loam Lion is perhaps more resilient than Kird Ape because it avoids Hydroblast effects?
Knight of the Reliquary x 0
Wonderful, powerful card. I don't like it in zoo -- not because it's bad in zoo, per se. I mean, it's in the winning zoo lists. It wins. Can't argue with that. I just don't know what it's in zoo for. Sure, different zoo builds get varied mileage out of the knight's tap ability, but none of the lists I've seen really lean on its utility. In zoo it's basically a big dude that gets bigger, which is a fine thing for a creature to be, but to what end?
The knight's casting cost helps with counter/top, but Green Sun's Zenith kinda already solves that problem -- and you don't want three drops against combo decks. In the matches where you want a big creature, Tarmogoyf is normally big enough for the job. I guess Knight of Reliquary is good against other Knights of the Reliquary, but so is path. And knights stalling each other out creates a sort of neutral board position where both sides are just waiting to draw something else, unless of course one of the decks is taking better advantage of the knight's tap ability, but that probably won't be the zoo deck. In my opinion, Zoo doesn't need Knight of the Reliquary.
I'm firmly in the one-of Terravore camp. It's "worse" than Knight of the Reliquary, but it absolutely destroys Knight of the Reliquary so who cares. This three-drop is a murder machine. It tramples, giving it value beyond dumb power/toughness arms races. It's also a lhurgoyf, so it fits nicely into zoo's lhurgoyf sub-theme…
In nine rounds I played against:
Merfolk
Affinity
Bant
Junk
NO Bant
TES
Goblins
Merfolk
TES
I lost to Junk and Merfolk. If anyone is curious about any specific matches let me know and I'll give details.
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