[Deck] T.E.S - The EPIC Storm

[r3dd09]

So I finally got a spark going on amongst my community to where we are going to have weekly legacy. * probably just 6-8 people each week till it gets noticed*

I will start keeping reports as I have tes built, but haven't played anything outside of proxied decks of dredge and junk. Hopefully i can eventually give my input on countertop and other decks as i know one person will be playing dreadtop.

Have we come to conclusion on what the sb should be?

[Diprivan]

So I finally got a spark going on amongst my community to where we are going to have weekly legacy. * probably just 6-8 people each week till it gets noticed*

I will start keeping reports as I have tes built, but haven't played anything outside of proxied decks of dredge and junk. Hopefully i can eventually give my input on countertop and other decks as i know one person will be playing dreadtop.

Have we come to conclusion on what the sb should be?

No

And I believe we just CAN'T till the new metagame starts to show.

You can play the standard SB for now, it has proven its value.
For now, I'm testing the etw plan

1 TOA
1 D returns
1 iggy
3 etw
1 grapeshot
1 tropical island
3 xantid swarm
1 meltdown
1 deathmark
2 chain of vapor

I like it for the moment. More testing is necessary however.
Though with such a small metagame, you should adjust accordingly: i.e. if 2 of them play MUD more artifact hate/bounce is necessary etc

[x8eikdls]

I'd recommend varying your bounce spells again. I've been running 3 Chain of Vapor to deal with hate bears and random things like Thorns/Pillar/etc, but once New Phyrexia is legal I'll be running the 1-1-1 split of Chain / Echoing Truth / Wipe Away. Or possibly even 2 Echoing Truth and 1 Wipe Away. The hype around Mental Misstep is huge, and I'd expect a lot of baddies running aggro decks to side them vs TES along with Hate bears and such. No need to lose to Misstep when you try to bounce Canonist with a Chain of Vapor when it can just be an Echoing Truth instead. Just something to take note of.

[Diprivan]

I'd recommend varying your bounce spells again. I've been running 3 Chain of Vapor to deal with hate bears and random things like Thorns/Pillar/etc, but once New Phyrexia is legal I'll be running the 1-1-1 split of Chain / Echoing Truth / Wipe Away. Or possibly even 2 Echoing Truth and 1 Wipe Away. The hype around Mental Misstep is huge, and I'd expect a lot of baddies running aggro decks to side them vs TES along with Hate bears and such. No need to lose to Misstep when you try to bounce Canonist with a Chain of Vapor when it can just be an Echoing Truth instead. Just something to take note of.

Seems logical, but is this really true?

They don't have MM => chain >>> truth
They have MM:
I: chain, MM, bummer
You: truth, proceed to combo, dark ritual, MM, bummer.

Truth has the advantage that when you bounced canonist, you can chant them (and blank their MM), but this advantage doesn't apply to teeg, where you can chant them no matter what.
I understand your reasoning and will test it out, though I'm still very attached to my chains.

[r3dd09]

one thing is that i'm not running xantid :/ if i do, i'd have to invest in different fetches and the Trop.

I will see how my meta is before i invest, but i do plan on getting a playset of each dual and fetch kinda soon. so this might get the ball rolling.

[lorddotm]

one thing is that i'm not running xantid :/ if i do, i'd have to invest in different fetches and the Trop.

I will see how my meta is before i invest, but i do plan on getting a playset of each dual and fetch kinda soon. so this might get the ball rolling.

Diprivan is wrong. You only need the normal main deck to run Xantids, no Tropical needed.

Also, Echoing Truth is just better than Chain of Vapour. When you have Chain in your hand and they play Chalice at one, you will want to shoot yourself. Or if they have two Meddling Mages or something weird like that, Echoing Truth has been awesome for me, and in TES I have never wanted anything else.

[Admiral_Arzar]

Diprivan is wrong. You only need the normal main deck to run Xantids, no Tropical needed.

Also, Echoing Truth is just better than Chain of Vapour. When you have Chain in your hand and they play Chalice at one, you will want to shoot yourself. Or if they have two Meddling Mages or something weird like that, Echoing Truth has been awesome for me, and in TES I have never wanted anything else.

The only time I ever wanted anything else was when Zoo Pyroblasted my Echoing Truth and beat me down with hatebears. I switched to Wipe Away, and then promptly lost to Null Rod + Wasteland when I was unable to hit three mana. I agree that Truth is definitely better after that experience.

[Diprivan]

Tropical isn't there to cast xantid. It's there against wasteland. I board it in against landdestruction.dec and really like the 14th land there. Since it's convenient to not have to blow a petal on it, it being green does help cast xantid swarm in those matchups, where the chance of you having a 5c land in play are not that super.

On truth vs chain: both have their merits. Chain is vulnerable to MM and cotv, but truth has it's own weaknesses: 2 mana, spell snare, daze/pierce more relevant against it, 1 damage more of Adn, etc.
But erh, if they play cotv on 1 and I don't have burning wish, well yeah, I'll lose that one. But if they play thorn/golem/sphere and I only have 2 lands, I'll laugh and you'll die with truth in your hand.

It's like your right hand and a prostitute:
both serve the same purpose, one is cheaper though less able to pull it off everytime, the other is more expensive, but gets the job done almost everytime.

[r3dd09]

i just imagine my meta being inexpensive decks in the beginning, i'm going to be loaning out dredge and affinity, there will probably be 2x gobos, and most likely another dredge plus the dreadtop. I should be able to do good against everything so far, i played against a junk player and still rocked him when he's wastelanding me.

expect weekly updates on my deck/ matchups

[Diprivan]

Thanks in advance for the input.

Dredge, affinity and goblins all are excellent matchups, so with normal SB hate they should be a walk in the park. But beware, once they'll know you win the small tournament everytime, you'll face a SB of 15 anti combo cards and you'll need to adapt.

[lorddotm]

Tropical isn't there to cast xantid. It's there against wasteland. I board it in against landdestruction.dec and really like the 14th land there. Since it's convenient to not have to blow a petal on it, it being green does help cast xantid swarm in those matchups, where the chance of you having a 5c land in play are not that super.

I've only lost to being Wasted out once. That was when they drew three Wastelands, and they were blue. I don't expect that to happen too often. However, if you are concerned about Wasteland and want another land to help, just use another City of Brass, it produces every colour.

On truth vs chain: both have their merits. Chain is vulnerable to MM and cotv, but truth has it's own weaknesses: 2 mana, spell snare, daze/pierce more relevant against it, 1 damage more of Adn, etc.
But erh, if they play cotv on 1 and I don't have burning wish, well yeah, I'll lose that one. But if they play thorn/golem/sphere and I only have 2 lands, I'll laugh and you'll die with truth in your hand.

The thing is, you're going to lose a lot more due to Chain being shitty than Echoing Truth being an issue. Maybe you live in a world where people never have two hate cards out, but I sure do. I don't play against Sphere effects too often, they are almost always too slow to affect us too, or they are coming from a deck I expect it to come from, and I will be playing out my Artifact mana. I used to use Chain, and then I realized that it was just needed when I was playing badly, and when I was being a good Magic player, Echoing Truth was always better.

Also, with the whole Burning Wish being an out, that is two whole turns you are giving up to answer one spell. I get that we rely on Burning Wish to get us out of a lot of things, but it is slow, and it takes away a business spell.

both serve the same purpose, one is cheaper though less able to pull it off everytime, the other is more expensive, but gets the job done almost everytime.

That is a horrible analogy. If you can't finish when you beat it go to a doctor, watch less fucked up porn, or beat it less.

[Diprivan]

I've only lost to being Wasted out once. That was when they drew three Wastelands, and they were blue. I don't expect that to happen too often. However, if you are concerned about Wasteland and want another land to help, just use another City of Brass, it produces every colour.



The thing is, you're going to lose a lot more due to Chain being shitty than Echoing Truth being an issue. Maybe you live in a world where people never have two hate cards out, but I sure do. I don't play against Sphere effects too often, they are almost always too slow to affect us too, or they are coming from a deck I expect it to come from, and I will be playing out my Artifact mana. I used to use Chain, and then I realized that it was just needed when I was playing badly, and when I was being a good Magic player, Echoing Truth was always better.

Also, with the whole Burning Wish being an out, that is two whole turns you are giving up to answer one spell. I get that we rely on Burning Wish to get us out of a lot of things, but it is slow, and it takes away a business spell.



That is a horrible analogy. If you can't finish when you beat it go to a doctor, watch less fucked up porn, or beat it less.

The only decks I face with cotv also play sphere/golem/thorn (ie MUD), so I kinda like the chains there. Though if everybody and his cousin starts playing MM or cotv 'cause OMFG it stops MM!!!!!1!!!1 COMBO", I'll switch to truth.

Relax, just joking. We're discussing 2 slots in a SB of a magic deck and both cards are - let's face it - not that different.

[lorddotm]

Relax, just joking. We're discussing 2 slots in a SB of a magic deck and both cards are - let's face it - not that different.

I'm celebrating Bob Marley's life, I'm very relaxed.

I was just offering sound medical advice.

Also, Distress and Thoughtseize aren't too different, but one is clearly better. The same is with Echoing Truth and Chain (although if we are going by mana cost, it would be reversed).

[Diprivan]

I'm celebrating Bob Marley's life, I'm very relaxed.

I was just offering sound medical advice.

Also, Distress and Thoughtseize aren't too different, but one is clearly better. The same is with Echoing Truth and Chain (although if we are going by mana cost, it would be reversed).

As long as we celebrate Bob Marley, we make this world a better place.

[TUMBLES]

i just imagine my meta being inexpensive decks in the beginning, i'm going to be loaning out dredge and affinity, there will probably be 2x gobos, and most likely another dredge plus the dreadtop. I should be able to do good against everything so far, i played against a junk player and still rocked him when he's wastelanding me.

expect weekly updates on my deck/ matchups

I don't know why I find it funny that you're loaning out decks like goblins and affinity to jumpstart legacy and then playing TES, but I do :D

[Pulp_Fiction]

I have finally arrived at a TES list that I like. I have been testing this list for a while and this is the only one I have been satisfied with since the MT banning. Here is what I have been playing:

4x Petal
4x Brainstorm
4x Burning Wish
3x Infernal Tutor
3x Chrome Mox
2x Personal Tutor
4x LED
4x Dark Ritual
4x Ponder
4x Rite of Flame
4x Duress
3x Swarm
1x Tendrils
1x EtW
1x Ad Nauseam

4x Gemstone Mine
4x City of Brass
2x Sea
1x Volcanic
1x Mire
1x Tarn
1x Strand

SB

2x Wipe Away
2x Shattering Spree
1x Chain of Vapor
1x Swarm
1x Meltdown
1x Thoughtseize
2x Deathmark
1x D Returns
1x IGG
1x EtW
1x Infernal Tutor
1x Tendrils

The Personal Tutors have been nuts. However, I am still unsure about the EtW. The fact that I can fetch it so easily is really great but ... I still feel like it should be AdN. I took this deck to my local tournament tonight and scrubbed out after going 2-2. I beat CBThopter and Spiral Tide and lost twice to 4c CB. This list is ... amazing against Merfolk but TES is still just so weak against CB, especially when you have to mull and keep sub-par hands. I just kept asking myself "why out of all nights, there is not a single Merfolk player in the room, am I not playing DDFT?" The SB could certainly be modded a little bit but ... DD is just so much better against CB, but Merfolk still gives it problems. So thats the dilemma. However, I encourage people to test this list before theorizing about it, it is a pure beast and Personal Tutor is no joke in this deck.

EDIT: Forgot manabase.

[kicks_422]

I like Personal Tutor, but back when Mystical wasn't banned, I remember that it was Dark Ritual that I tutored for the most, by far.

[Pulp_Fiction]

Yes. However, it does find Rite of Flame and action spells so it beats the hell out of the 2-3 Preordains that I had been testing for a little. It seems janky, but running 2 is just perfect. Adds a whole new level of consistency to a deck that I usually sleeve up and take apart after 30 mins and put DDFT back together. This list has been sleeved for 4 days or so now.

[lorddotm]

Yes. However, it does find Rite of Flame and action spells so it beats the hell out of the 2-3 Preordains that I had been testing for a little. It seems janky, but running 2 is just perfect. Adds a whole new level of consistency to a deck that I usually sleeve up and take apart after 30 mins and put DDFT back together. This list has been sleeved for 4 days or so now.

Looks like your list is a card short.

Also, Xantid main is an interesting choice.

Am I the only one that has a winning record against CB in tournaments?

[r3dd09]

I don't know why I find it funny that you're loaning out decks like goblins and affinity to jumpstart legacy and then playing TES, but I do :D

Dredge and affinity is what I'm loaning out,

I'm loaning those two out because that's what I have complete and one being straight forward to play and the other being a more skill intensive deck( dredge).

Plus, I'd rather not loan out a deck to people I don't know that has wastelands, forces and other stuff in it.

I've only started to purchase legacy cards a month ago so my pool isn't too amazing :p

My priority was to finish tes, and that's all that matters ;)

-ps, I'm glad the decks I'm loaning out don't have their sideboards ready yet. Lol