Excellent point IBA. I'm guessing since the checklist cards are official magic cards, having a checklist with the dual lands on it won't be tournament legal. But the question needs to be asked to WotC. The checklist card is a proxy.
Are you going to have to show proof that you own the double-faced cards before a tourney? What if you "borrowed" them from a friend, but your friend decided to use his physical copies? Are your checklist cards not valid anymore?
Originally Posted by hyperchord24
Did you even bother to read the article.
To use the checklist card, set your double-faced card aside and make a mark on the checklist card next to the name of the double-faced card it represents. Be sure to use a writing implement that won't be visible through the back of the checklist card, and to mark only one double-faced card name on each checklist card.
Only official checklist cards may be used to stand in for double-faced cards in a deck. If you use a checklist card to represent any of the double-faced cards in your deck, you must use checklist cards to represent all of them.
You'll use the checklist card any time it's important to keep the identity of your card secret—in other words, when it's in your library, in your hand, or exiled face down. You'll switch to the double-faced card when the card is on the stack, on the battlefield, in the graveyard, or exiled face up.
Any time a double-faced card is visible—whether because it's in a public zone, because it's revealed (say, by Telepathy), or because it's being looked at by a player due to an effect (say, Coercion)—the players who can see it can see both faces. Any player who can look at a checklist card in a hidden zone may look at the double-faced card it represents.
A founding member of Team Bluff the Lotus - Bringing the crazy from Bob's Baseball Dugout
Can I look at double faced chards if I *might* have a checklist card in a hidden zone? Is there a limit to the number of double-faced cards that can be brought in or looked at?Any time a double-faced card is visible—whether because it's in a public zone, because it's revealed (say, by Telepathy), or because it's being looked at by a player due to an effect (say, Coercion)—the players who can see it can see both faces. Any player who can look at a checklist card in a hidden zone may look at the double-faced card it represents.
The checklist mechanic seems like it's open to all kinds of clever cheating... are there going to be official rules on how the cards have to be marked? (What happens if someone has a card with half a dozen pips marked?)
"Any player who can look at a checklist card in a hidden zone may look at the double-faced card it represents."
This assumes that the checklist card is to be made available by the player who owns the physical card. You know what happens when one assummes . . .
What?
Like if I thoughtseize you and you have a checklist in your hand then I get to look at the card it represents.
"and to mark only one double-faced card name on each checklist card."
A founding member of Team Bluff the Lotus - Bringing the crazy from Bob's Baseball Dugout
^Yeah. What happens if you can't produce the card? The caster of thoughtseize is allowed to see the double faced card, but it doesn't say the owner is the one to have to produce it. Does it? I know it'll just lead to a game loss if you can't. But it is interesting that they'd just say "set it aside." That's such a open statement.
Furthermore, if your opponent sees you looking at extra cards (with double faces, mind you, so you sort of have to be sneaky about it to not allow your opponent to see the cards), doesn't that look suspicious and give away that you have double faced cards in your deck?
You seem under the impression that the checklist cards are proxies. They aren't. They're basically bookmarks.
Also all we've gotten so far are summaries and plain-English explanations, not carefully worded Comprehensive / Floor Rules. Until we do, you can't go play dicklawyer over precise turns of phrases.
Yes. Just like flipping through your sideboard suggests that you have just drawn a Wish, or that you are trying to bluff having one.Furthermore, if your opponent sees you looking at extra cards (with double faces, mind you, so you sort of have to be sneaky about it to not allow your opponent to see the cards), doesn't that look suspicious and give away that you have double faced cards in your deck?
YOU'RE GIVING ME A TIME MACHINE IN ORDER TO TREAT MY SLEEP DISORDER.
It's a physical representation of a card played in a deck other than the card itself, so yes it's a proxy.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
YOU'RE GIVING ME A TIME MACHINE IN ORDER TO TREAT MY SLEEP DISORDER.
Is against the rules to reply to that post with just a "lol"?
Please stop talking about whether Force of Will is broken or not. It obviously is, and rather than "the glue that holds vintage together" it would be better to call it "the rug under which you hide the filth until there's so much that you can no longer conceal it".
It's not a proxy, because you need to actually have the phisical card with you in order to use the checklist card. If you have 4 checklist cards, you need to have 4 of these cards with you during the matchs.
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
Oh. Just rule summaries, okay.
A checklist card is as much a proxy as a car is an automobile. They have the same definitions. But that doesn't matter. If a Rules Manager wants to say that checklist cards are not proxies (if only to not let the flood gates of debating wether or not to allow proxies open), then it's his right.
EDIT: @ Gui: Which brings it back to IBA's point about not wanting to shuffle up his actual duals. He can have the card on display (which will likely be part of the official rules), but the "checklist card" in his deck.
It is a proxy. To go back to gold bordered FoWs, even if I have regular Forces with me, if I'm playing gold-bordered ones in a deck, that's against the rules. IBA is right, they are sanctioned proxies. Whether that actually means dickall is up for debate, but the checklist cards are proxies; a proxy is just a stand in for the actual thing.
Well, sure, as long as he has the actual card during the match and he uses the corresponding checklist printed for duas. xD
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
This design is so bad that it's worth complaining about. Since I started playing in 1998, only two things have made me facepalm as hard: the revamped cardfaces in 2002 and these double-sided cards.
I quit the game in 2002. I think these double-faced cards are pretty bad, but the rest of the game offers enough to be excited about that I'm not threatening to quit or anything. Still, it's understandable that people would want to vent about this, and I'm surprised we're only on 3 pages.
Not that this line of reasoning will ever amount to anything because judges would never go for it. And if they did (to make a point), they'd be banned if the DCI ever got wind of it.
6 pages already...
"Yes it is."
- Jack Elgin
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
Not everyone uses the same pagination setting, but yes, 6 by the default AFAIK.
So go argue on Twitter. I'd watch!
“It's possible. But it involves... {checks archives} Nature's Revolt, Opalescence, two Unstable Shapeshifters (one of which started as a Doppelganger), a Tide, an animated land, a creature with Fading, a Silver Wyvern, some way to get a creature into play in response to stuff, some way to get a land into play in response to stuff (a different land from the animated land), and one heck of a Rube Goldberg timing diagram.”
-David DeLaney
That doesn't mean it's not a proxy. That just means it's a proxy for a card you actually own.
For my confessions, they burned me with fire/
And found I was for endurance made
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