excited again!!!Originally Posted by tsabo_tavoc
Think this could maybe replace Ad Nauseam if a list was built correctly?
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I think it can definitely replace the 2nd Ad off people's lists, but I don't know about it replacing the single copy; Nauseam just wins, and this card is more of an enabler.
That was my plan exactly.
I think this card is going to replace IGG in my list, which is saddening. I mean, I have a Japanese altered hottness one (Thanks Yawg).
Seems like losing the ability to reuse Lion's Eye Diamond could be awkward. It is also limited because you only get access to as much mana as you have Rite of Flames or Dark Rituals in the yard. In my experience, I usually have some combination of LED and ritual effects which would make using Ill-Gotten Gains better. Obviously, there will always be situations when Flames of the Past or Ill-Gotten Gains are better than the other, but but I think there are a lot of things that Flames of the Past can do internally to make the deck run better and solves the the weakness that using Ill-Gotten Gains has against control match ups (Especially given the prevalence of control).
As an aside, if you do end up replacing your awesome Japanese altered Ill-Gotten Gains, you can get a Korean Flames of the Past now...
With this getting printed and the possibility of Mental Misstep being banned, Storm could be in a great position.
Last edited by Fossil4182; 09-13-2011 at 10:00 PM. Reason: Did math
Thats really what it seems like its good at. A replacement for IGG that has the added value of being the shit against blue
This card is just what 3C TES needed. Need to have a korean foil one :P.
How does Past in FLames differ from IGG? I mean in terms of playing. How would you set this up? You would need quite a large amount of untapped mana or rituals to use it effectly no? I think this could make our discard spells stronger, but I'm hesitant to say that it's any better than IGG since I rely so heavily on LED to win a lot of my aggro match ups.
Agreed, IGG is still better than this; if ANYTHING, it should be replacing any 2nd copy of Nauseam, and makes for an EXCELLENT wish target.
+1.
IGG will indeed be better against non blue decks but the card is awsome when you are at low life total and playing against a blue deck. 1 copy Maindeck and 1 in the wishboard seems about right.
I don't think it's going to end up a maindeck card, I do think it's going to replace Ill-Gotten Gains in the sideboard. What do you people recommend then? Three storm engines in the sideboard with two of them being redundant? One of these cards needs to go, don't be ridiculous.
Past in flames is conditionally better than IGG, something some people seem to miss. It's sweet because it's like this you have 2 dark rit's and a rite of flame in the yard along with infernal tutor. Then you also get one more storm count. And past in flames at least doesn't help blue decks get countermagic back, unlike IGG. And for people saying they used IGG to mindtwist people on turn 1, you're probably doing it wrong then. Not to mention you can also flashback random ponder's and brainstorms in the yard to generate yet more storm. We run a lot of sorceries and instants in here with only 12 or less artifacts and lands.
I'm all for replacing IGG in the board with PiF. The card is better in more instances than IGG is since with IGG you need to have resolved chant against blue to make IGG worthwhile and we usually win whenever we resolve a chant anyways so yeah...
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If the word "or" creates a timestamp that prevents future cards from gaining Flashback, I think you still want Ill-Gotten Gains over this card.
1. The ability to Flashback Brainstorm or Ponder. So what? If I'm casting Burning Wish for a card in order to Flashback the aforementioned, I'm either going to be cracking Lotus Petals or Lion's Eye Diamonds for Blue or maybe tapping one land. Since this is probably midcombo when you're attempting to Flashback cantrips, wouldn't I rather cast Diminishing Returns and draw seven cards? Even though the ability to Flash these spells back may be useful, I think casting Diminishing Returns is a much more powerful play.
I also think part of this question will depend on what happens with the B&R updates on the 20th. If Mental Misstep is banned, then the argument that Past in Flames avoids the negative interaction with Blue decks becomes less relevant since Blue decks will take a hit post banning. I'm going to withhold my final opinion on how this impacts the Blue based match ups until I test some more and until the B&R list comes out.
I guess it may depend on your local meta - PiF is better against blue but IGG is better against decks with disruption and no blue (+ aggro).
I would wait for INN FAQ + Sept B/R announcement to make a move though.
So I've "wasted" already ~4h to try PiF (1x MB, 1x SB). I've tested vs. UW-Blade, BUG-Still and Team America. The one copy in sideboard is sure for me now but the one in maindeck is so-so. Before testing I didn't have 2x Ad Nauseam, I prefer +1 Chant effect. Like with IGG or ToA drawing PiF is usually so annoying that I wanted to dismiss that idea on the spot. But after few games I also had some sick comebacks because of PiF. I'm not sold yet, more testing has to be done but I think that mainboard PiF is better to be placed in ANT with added Volcanic(s).
I won't cut IGG in the sideboard yet. There were games where wishing for PiF was useless but for IGG were pure win. For now I use Bryant's SB with few changes:
-1 Deathmark / +1 Pyroclasm
-1 Meltdown / +1 Past in Flames (-1 Meltdown / +1 Wipe Away was a metagame call few weeks ago)
An interesting interaction to note is that you can crack LEDs with this card in hand, and then use its flashback with the mana you get.
You can also cast it then crack all your diamonds in response having a pile of mana to play with all the stuff in your yard afterward including the things that were in your hand before you cast it.
The biggest problem I'm having so far is that you almost need to use infernal to win. Since wish rfgs itself. Which makes playing draw spells post PiF worse as you lose hellbent.
I think if this is the case, Past in Flame should replace Diminishing Returns rather than IGG, since DR isn't great against blue as well and you use it at low life. This also doesn't weaken our aggro game by taking out IGG. Of course, the overall deck just becomes more suscpetible to graveyard hate....
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