[Deck] Dredge

[Izor]

Congratz on the finish Hollywood!


I agree that Coffin Purge/whatever Extraction hate people play are somewhat underwhelming and I more often than not just fare better ignoring such hate.

I also like the 3rd Ichorid back in the main, that's the way to go. Darkblast seems very good on paper but I gave up running it because it was mostly disappointing.



I would be happy to play a 4 round tournament and see only 2 Surgicals througout the whole tournament. The 4 round event I played lately rewarded me with 2 Extirpate, 2 Surgical and 1 Tormods. The only opponent who had nothing was Storm, which lucksacked me 2-0 :/

[GoldenCid]

Maybe a little late on the suggestion but Hollywood, could you write the sideboarding plan for the different match ups as a complement for the primer?

[jares]

I agree that Coffin Purge/whatever Extraction hate people play are somewhat underwhelming and I more often than not just fare better ignoring such hate.

I also like the 3rd Ichorid back in the main, that's the way to go. Darkblast seems very good on paper but I gave up running it because it was mostly disappointing.

I have been doing the same against Surgical Extraction etc., and have been rewarded with some hard-earned wins so far.

Regarding Darkblast, it seems that people have had mixed results about it, though at this point I feel that having an extra Dredger (13th?) in the sideboard would most certainly help in the games where things aren't too favorable.

Cheers,
jares

[joemauer]

Maybe a little late on the suggestion but Hollywood, could you write the sideboarding plan for the different match ups as a complement for the primer?

Dredge has no hard and fast rules when it comes to sideboarding. It is a case by case situation. Furthermore it is very subjective.

I think it ignited a two page argument on the last dredge thread when someone asked about sideboarding for merfolk.

Other combo decks have very obvious SBing plans. Storm needs to bring in disruption/counterspells against blue decks and bounce against maverick. With dredge, you never have any idea what kinda of hate(or how much) the top decks to beat are going to bring against you because despite the maindecks being similar their SBs vary dramatically.

Personally my preferred sideboarding is some number of breakthroughs and/or dread return and it's target(s). Or I will do the shave technique: -1 thug/Pimp/ichorid.

[jares]

Or I will do the shave technique: -1 thug/Pimp/ichorid.

I like that, the "Shave Tech".

Game 2 is usually the best time to do the Shave Tech, given that you don't have certainty over what you'll be going against. I'm also careful about needlessly diluting the deck, as being "over-prepared" would usually do you more harm than good.

Cheers,
jares

[iPhael]

So, it's spoiler season again, and yet again we get a new toy right off the bat. This time in the form of an 8/8 Flying Vigilant Indestructible Angel. Oh, and she makes your Zombies invulnerable as well. I know it's slightly counter-intuitive to have perma-Thugs and such, and that Flayer/FKZ is still a faster kill, but I'm having a hard time thinking of how you could lose if she resolves. Sure there's some bounce and burn to the dome to worry about, but seriously now, this is pretty ridiculous.

Clicky for Pic

[jares]

So, it's spoiler season again, and yet again we get a new toy right off the bat. This time in the form of an 8/8 Flying Vigilant Indestructible Angel. Oh, and she makes your Zombies invulnerable as well. I know it's slightly counter-intuitive to have perma-Thugs and such, and that Flayer/FKZ is still a faster kill, but I'm having a hard time thinking of how you could lose if she resolves. Sure there's some bounce and burn to the dome to worry about, but seriously now, this is pretty ridiculous.

Clicky for Pic

I feel that the Dread Return targets that we already have contribute more to Dredge's game plan when compared to a creature that, while visibly imposing, is really just a big body that's difficult to get rid of - and I believe that we already have that in Golgari Grave-Troll.

Even Reanimator might not even use this card at all.

Regards,
jares

[joemauer]

So, it's spoiler season again, and yet again we get a new toy right off the bat. This time in the form of an 8/8 Flying Vigilant Indestructible Angel. Oh, and she makes your Zombies invulnerable as well. I know it's slightly counter-intuitive to have perma-Thugs and such, and that Flayer/FKZ is still a faster kill, but I'm having a hard time thinking of how you could lose if she resolves. Sure there's some bounce and burn to the dome to worry about, but seriously now, this is pretty ridiculous.

Think harder. There is a common one mana spell played in a lot of decks that removes creatures from the game for the small trade off of life gain.

[TheKingslayer]

Think harder. There is a common one mana spell played in a lot of decks that removes creatures from the game for the small trade off of life gain.

I wish that I could just ominously like posts(like on facebook.)

[HokusSchmokus]

I feel that the Dread Return targets that we already have contribute more to Dredge's game plan when compared to a creature that, while visibly imposing, is really just a big body that's difficult to get rid of - and I believe that we already have that in Golgari Grave-Troll.

Even Reanimator might not even use this card at all.

Regards,
jares

What he really meant is the Angel sucks major ass for every competitive deck. Kitchen Table stuff.

[chibi]

Hi I'm new to legacy. I just shifted from standard because I recently completed my dream deck lol. Anyway, I've already played dredge in a couple of tourneys (which were my first tourneys btw) and went well (3-0, 2-1) for a newcomer. I'm starting to get hooked with the format and I'm preparing for a big tournament here.

Here's my list:

lands: 13
4 cephalid coliseum
4 city of brass
4 gemstone mine
1 undiscovered paradise

creatures: 22
4 putrid imp
4 narcomoeba
4 golgari grave troll
4 stinkweed imp
3 golgari thug
2 ichorid
1 flayer of the hatebound

spells: 25
4 lion's eye diamond
4 faithless looting
4 careful study
4 bridge from below
3 cabal therapy
3 breakthrough
3 dread return

sideboard:
2 firestorm
1 ancient grudge
3 nature's claim
3 faerie macabre
1 cabal therapy
2 ichorid
1 iona, shield of emeria
1 angel of despair
1 elesh norn grand cenobite

I'm currently working on a generic sideboard since I really don't know what the meta is. :P Can you help me tweak this? Also I'm preparing the sideboard against maverick so any sideboard tips for that matchup?

Thanks!

-smallguy (chibi)

[HokusSchmokus]

hi i'm new to legacy. just shifted from standard because i recently completed my dream deck lol. anyway, i've already played dredge in a couple of tourneys (which were my first tourneys btw) and went well (3-0, 2-1) for a newcomer. i'm starting to get hooked to the format and i'm preparing for a big local tournament here.

here's my list:

lands: 13
4 cephalid coliseum
4 city of brass
4 gemstone mine
1 undiscovered paradise

creatures: 22
4 putrid imp
4 narcomoeba
4 golgari grave troll
4 stinkweed imp
3 golgari thug
2 ichorid
1 flayer of the hatebound

spells: 25
4 lion's eye diamond
4 faithless looting
4 careful study
4 bridge from below
3 cabal therapy
3 breakthrough
3 dread return

sideboard:
2 firestorm
1 ancient grudge
3 nature's claim
3 faerie macabre
1 cabal therapy
2 ichorid
1 iona, shield of emeria
1 angel of despair
1 elesh norn grand cenobite

i'm currently working on a generic sideboard since i really don't know what the meta is. :P can you help me tweak this? also i'm preparing the sideboard against maverick so any sideboard tips for that matchup?

thanks!

-smallguy (chibi)

Hi!
First things first, the mods and users in this forum value punctuation relatively high, you might want to check out the forum rules. Also check out the hyperlink function: [cards]Ichorid[/cards.] without the . = Ichorid, you just have to put [cards] at the beginning and [/cards.] without the . at the end of your decklist e.g.
Regarding your list:
I strongly recommend the 4th Therapy maindeck. I would also use a third Ichorid, but that's more a matter of taste( Though having 3 Ichorids maindeck makes room in the sideboard since you don't have to run 1-2 Ichorids in your board anymore)I would cut a Land+x for it if you want to make this change, it's better to test it first ofc.

Regarding your board:
2 Firestorm and 3 Nature's Claims do almost nothing, I'm sorry. Exspecially Nature's Claim, you really cannot afford not to have it if your opponent slams a Leyline or such things, so a 4th Claim might be good.
2 Firestorms is a bit random, too I think, also Firestorm is a bit worse in LED builds, since you don't want to board them out against Maverick, still you want to bring in Firestorms and seriously, having a hand of Firestorm, LED,LED, Thug, Troll, Land, Looting or so makes Firestorm less good. Still it CAN be good,though.

I'm curious why you chose to run Faerie Macabre in your board, care to elaborate?

[Final Fortune]

I have 0 problems with Firestorm and LED post-board, you guys are either doing something wrong or you aren't recognizing when the disynergy doesn't matter because you've already won the game.

Firestorm is ridiculous, play it.

[chibi]

Hi!
First things first, the mods and users in this forum value punctuation relatively high, you might want to check out the forum rules. Also check out the hyperlink function: [cards]Ichorid[/cards.] without the . = Ichorid, you just have to put [cards] at the beginning and [/cards.] without the . at the end of your decklist e.g.
Regarding your list:
I strongly recommend the 4th Therapy maindeck. I would also use a third Ichorid, but that's more a matter of taste( Though having 3 Ichorids maindeck makes room in the sideboard since you don't have to run 1-2 Ichorids in your board anymore)I would cut a Land+x for it if you want to make this change, it's better to test it first ofc.

Regarding your board:
2 Firestorm and 3 Nature's Claims do almost nothing, I'm sorry. Exspecially Nature's Claim, you really cannot afford not to have it if your opponent slams a Leyline or such things, so a 4th Claim might be good.
2 Firestorms is a bit random, too I think, also Firestorm is a bit worse in LED builds, since you don't want to board them out against Maverick, still you want to bring in Firestorms and seriously, having a hand of Firestorm, LED,LED, Thug, Troll, Land, Looting or so makes Firestorm less good. Still it CAN be good,though.

I'm curious why you chose to run Faerie Macabre in your board, care to elaborate?

Thanks for the quick feedback!

About the 4th therapy maindeck, I think with this build's explosiveness, I can win fast enough without having to use therapy much. As for the 3rd ichorid, well same reason for not having the 4th therapy maindeck. I board the extra therapy and ichorids in matchups where I think I should win via beatdown than combo (with the chance of having to combo of course).

As for the sideboard, I've been thinking about firestorm too. I think it's good against maverick and delver. I'll test it out. For now, I have just been reading about its effectiveness in LED dredge sideboards.

I have 0 problems with Firestorm and LED post-board, you guys are either doing something wrong or you aren't recognizing when the disynergy doesn't matter because you've already won the game.

Firestorm is ridiculous, play it.

This.

Faerie macabre is for reanimator and mirror match not to mention decks that run snapcaster mage. This was supposed to be Leyline of the Void but after some time I realized that I don't want it in my sideboard anymore. It's already a dead card if don't have it in my opening hand. Having to mulligan for it is not worth it. I'd rather mulligan for a keepable hand that could win.

And as for my previous post, I'll edit it. Thanks for the heads up! :)

[HokusSchmokus]

I have 0 problems with Firestorm and LED post-board, you guys are either doing something wrong or you aren't recognizing when the disynergy doesn't matter because you've already won the game.

Firestorm is ridiculous, play it.

That's exactly what I mean. I have more "oh, guess I won the game" situations than "ha, Firestorm got ya" situations.

[chibi]

So, should I up the firestorm count? How about faerie macabre? Do I take them out?

[HokusSchmokus]

Macabre is fine if you face a heavy dredge and Reanimator meta. I guess it's quite good against stoneblade stuff too, since you can respond to Extraction with an uncounterable effect, but again there is a huge antisynergy with LED, which you might take out though, I guess. It's certainly worth considering running it though.

Yes, if you want to run Firestorm, I would certainly run 4.

[chibi]

Macabre is fine if you face a heavy dredge and Reanimator meta. I guess it's quite good against stoneblade stuff too, since you can respond to Extraction with an uncounterable effect, but again there is a huge antisynergy with LED, which you might take out though, I guess. It's certainly worth considering running it though.

Yes, if you want to run Firestorm, I would certainly run 4.

I see. Thanks so much for the thoughts! I'm still waiting for Hollywood or Klazam and other experienced dredge players for their thoughts and ideas. I will try and test the firestorm count to 3 and cut one macabre. Also, I don't know if I should be running chain of vapor instead of nature's claim.

[Michael Keller]

Firestorm is a card as I had previously mentioned that is really only necessary against super-mega-fast aggro decks. It's both necessary and unnecessary in that you can overwhelm an opponent ridiculously fast before they even start assembling creatures and it looks attractive for its ability.

It's honestly starting to collect dust in my board, but that doesn't mean it's "bad."

[jares]

I see. Thanks so much for the thoughts! I'm still waiting for Hollywood or Klazam and other experienced dredge players for their thoughts and ideas. I will try and test the firestorm count to 3 and cut one macabre. Also, I don't know if I should be running chain of vapor instead of nature's claim.

I've also been using Faerie Macabre in my sideboard, and I've found it to be the best utility card to address Reanimator, so I would suggest running the full set if you're concerned with Reanimator in your meta. I also run [3x] Firestorm in my sideboard, and I would certainly go up to a full set if I had the room for it - for now, [3x] seems like a good balance. Having said that, I would suggest that you consider shaving off on the Dread Return targets - run only the ones that are absolutely necessary in your meta.

Good luck.

Kind Regards,
jares