I am unsure if you cannot read or don't know which deck this thread is about.Originally Posted by HokusSchmokus
I think he is attempting to communicate that reanimator should run ground seal game two, without actually saying anything. I think this new black demon can definitely be played as a 1 of at least in reanimator. That life link is huge. Drawing seven cards at instant speed is also the nuts.
Ground Seal + Exhume is a possibility, though it seems pretty bad since it shuts off your other reanimation cards.
Oh trust me, i'm not suggesting ground seal.
Karakas/Maze is less of a consideration than STP, in STP's case we will draw 7 cards for 0 life loss with Griselbrand which is a lot better than drawing 0 cards for +5 life with Jin Gitaxis.
Despite that, Giselbrand doesn't change the position of the deck against the hate it is facing.[/QUOTE]
Although he doesn't do anything about the graveyard hate, Griselbrand does make some cards that are good against us slightly less relevant (Karakas, Swords to Plowshares).
Reanimator might be on the list of DTB, but it hardly wins any major tournaments these days, does it? (Sincere question, not sarcasm, at least I haven't noticed any major wins.) Imagine a player like LSV, Caleb Durward, Paulo Vito etc. going to a major legacy tournament (most likely a grand prix). Do you see any of them thinking: "Ah yes, legacy, I need to bring the strongest deck possible because I want to win (and because I play for cash) - Sure, I'll bring Reanimator!". Just can't picture it. They will bring a variant of the Big Three: RUG Tempo, Maverick, UWx Stoneblade (maybe High Tide?).
I would have loved if Caleb Durward piloted his Nic Fit at GP Indy, but lo and behold, he chose RUG Tempo. They say legacy is a diverse format. Maybe it is, and I think a lot of it has to do with card availability and people having pet decks. (I'm one of those actually, I love Reanimator and Pox, mostly playing one of those decks instead of any of the big three.)
Kind of the opposite of what Vicar in a tutu wanted. He wants a Hexproofed Graveyard not a Shrouded one.
Why are Karakas and Maze not to be taken into account? They both shut off the demon and can be tutored for with Knight.
Karakas less relevant? What does Giselbrand do if he cannot connect? Nothing and you obviously won't reanimate a Jin into a Karakas, so you at least get to draw seven cards (unless there's an instant sword, where Giselbrand is indeed better).
Yes, the Demon is better against STP, but I still like Jin's ability against combo and control much more.
Being a DTB is not about being the overall strongest deck, but about being popular and placing well in tournaments.
I didn't say they shouldn't be taken into account, I said they're less of a consideration than Swords to Plowshares. A 3cc creature that has to tap to put an answer on the board and a 1cc instant aren't exactly comparable. I'd rather concentrate on worrying about STP than a 1xLegendary Land.
Yes, Karakas becomes less relevant in the sense that you get to draw 7 cards before the demon is bounced ("less relevant" obviously not meaning "irrelevant"). I don't think the question is whether to run 3 Gitaxias or 3 Griselbrand, Gitaxias rocks. I would (like another poster suggested) play 2 Gitaxias and 1 Griselbrand. Also in the case of Maze: I get to draw 7 cards and my creature still stays on the battlefield with lifelink (in case anyone tries to attack and they don't have mother of runes). That's fine by me, I can use some of the cards drawn to do other cool stuff.
Griselbrand just gives you more options. Drawing seven at the end of your turn is always good. Being able to draw seven whenever you want (albeit at a price) is better. Sure the opponent gets to keep their hand, but against most decks, we are only concerned with a fairly narrow list of cards. Answer my Flying 7/7 Lifelinker in the next three turns through a multitude of counterspells that I can draw into at instant speed or die.
And as a sidenote... I do think Temporal Mastery deserves a 1-of slot in Reanimator builds using Personal Tutor.
You can only draw seven if you can connect with the lifelink or didn't have to use reanimate on him. I'd like to see you drawing cards off Giselbrand when he gets bounced just to be finished by their creatures. Mother is a relevant part in that matchup and it counters Giselbrand as well (now give Mindcensor to the mix). He is just rendered useless by so many cards in the Maverick MU.
I will most likely try him out as well, but on the paper he doesn't look that convincing to me.
I dont think personal tutor deserves a spot in reanimator, but I do think TM does deserve a 1-2 spot. personal tutoring for TM and saying, 'hehe, go', is just asking for thought scour, predict, jace, etc. BUT setting a TM with a ponder/brainstorm is a sneaky little turn the tables trick I could see working really well. with 4 BS and 3 ponder + jin/griss you'll have no shortness of ways to draw into it.
TM pretty much only makes sense in this deck if you have a creature out and need to finish the game fast by getting the beats in. Our manabase won't allow any neat tricks with it.
This and the already conditional Miracle mechanic combined aren't as good as "take an extra turn" sounds.
I'm still curious how we're going to know that is what they drew that turn. What keeps a guy from drawing a card, spending a couple seconds "flipping" cards in his hand the way we all do, then proclaiming that to be the card he drew? How do we know what he drew?
If the reveal isn't immediate, then they don't get to cast it for it's Miracle cost. The trigger would be missed.I'm still curious how we're going to know that is what they drew that turn. What keeps a guy from drawing a card, spending a couple seconds "flipping" cards in his hand the way we all do, then proclaiming that to be the card he drew? How do we know what he drew?
Miracle XX: You may cast this card for its miracle cost when you draw it if it's the first card you drew this turn
Tusk up.
Swords to Plowshares in a range of decks is more important than Karakas/Maze in Maverick, so far he's been the best reanimation target I've played with and Jix Gitaxis has taken a back seat as a 1x. It's really not hard to figure out how good he is after a few games, against a lot of decks you don't even need to use his ability to win because you just outrace their board position and only trigger the ability vs Swords to Plowshares.
Play more Animate Dead if you're killing yourself with Reanimate, which you shouldn't be.
Edit: Also being Black and not Blue is a big fucking deal vs. REBs post-board.
Judges are ruling it similar to a Sylvan Library trigger. The cards are drawn, but kept separate from your hand during the resolution to ensure you don't put any cards from your hand back on top of your library that weren't drawn off the triggered ability. Same thing with a Miracle card. You draw your card, see that it is a Miracle card, and that is the chance you have to play it. The moment the car physically enters the rest of your hand, then the trigger has been missed.I'm still curious how we're going to know that is what they drew that turn. What keeps a guy from drawing a card, spending a couple seconds "flipping" cards in his hand the way we all do, then proclaiming that to be the card he drew? How do we know what he drew?
In Reanimator the use of TS is directly tied to the use of Brainstorm and to a lesser extent, Ponder and Jin/Griselbrand. The extra turn can be found quickly and primed with a BS for us to find at the beginning of our turn. The only question is how much gain do we net from an extra turn?
Can you explain me why Griselbrand is not way better than Jin?
I agree that it does not help to solve the problem against most of the existing hate.
The question is: how often do you currently not win after reanimating a creature? I do not play reanimator and have no idea obv., but I suppose most of the time you win, so in general a "better" dude won't help Renamiator as much as a better enabler.
Anyway: In which situation is it not better than Jin?
Against aggro/burn: Lifelink and the much better body make up for not shutting down the opponents hand size.
Big Advantage against the DTB RUG, Blade Control and Maverick:
Against STP/Redblast or other removal they might have: "Draw 7-14": Force it and/or win with the new cards...
Against combo: They keep their hand, but you can draw hate. Should not really matter.
Currently playing: Elves
Gristelbrand is not better than Jin because Jin makes your opponent discard their hand if he survives until the end of their next turn. You also have to pay 7 life to use Gristelbrand's ability. So if you are in a grindy game and you Thoghtseize, FoW, and fetch a few times then are forced to Reanimate him, you might not even get to draw at all. Also against RUG Delver, I would never feel safe paying 7 life in fear of Stifle. Most likely you will get to use his ability once a turn and that's if you are connecting with him each turn. Jin draws you 7 a turn no matter what.
Gristelbrand is only better when they have an immediate answer to your creature or just as a solid beater with lifelink. Jin is better in almost all other situations.
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