All B/R update speculation.

[Gui]

Am I really the only one who thinks that this is hilarious?
God this is so true and let me tell you, I hate that sort of play.

Not really, it happens all the time against Dredge and their 3 sided Extractions. All of them seem to have around 2 or 3 extractions in their opening hand.

[HokusSchmokus]

But when the top aggro deck, top control deck, and top TWO combo decks all use those same tools, can't you see how it would be frustrating to people?

Everybody needs to chill. Seriously. Blue is almost always only added for Filtering and Permission. Thqt's because what blue does. Blue has been the card draw color since Alpha. Almost the same with permission. We play a competitive format,of course something is gonna be best and of course it is "blue" as you call it. Get on with it already.
Edit: Exspecially since the cards that send shit over the top are almost never blue cards.

[Esper3k]

Everybody needs to chill. Seriously. Blue is almost always only added for Filtering and Permission. Thqt's because what blue does. Blue has been the card draw color since Alpha. Almost the same with permission. We play a competitive format,of course something is gonna be best and of course it is "blue" as you call it. Get on with it already.

Delver is Permission because you have to have his permission to live!

[HokusSchmokus]

Delver is Permission because you have to have his permission to live!

Delver is actually the only thing that annoys me,not bc of his power level,but because of the color. Does not need to be blue,stylewise.

[Kich867]

Everybody needs to chill. Seriously. Blue is almost always only added for Filtering and Permission. Thqt's because what blue does. Blue has been the card draw color since Alpha. Almost the same with permission. We play a competitive format,of course something is gonna be best and of course it is "blue" as you call it. Get on with it already.
Edit: Exspecially since the cards that send shit over the top are almost never blue cards.

That's fine, honestly, I'm super ok with brainstorm and blue permission. In my opinion, if you aren't playing blue you should be playing enough shit to push through blue or be playing discard to push through.

And that's an interesting dynamic. It's not really unfair or anything. I don't really want to devolve this conversation away from Sneak Attack / Show and Tell though. Sneak Attack is definitely more manageable than Show and Tell, and getting rid of Show And Tell gets rid of a lot of other very, very retarded strategies.

[Moondancerbb]

Dredge is a "blue" deck isn't it?

4 careful study
4 breakthrough
4 narcomeba

Chain of vapor in the side.

[Julian23]

But when the top aggro deck, top control deck, and top TWO combo decks all use those same tools, can't you see how it would be frustrating to people?

No. I'm a Spike. I don't care which kind of light is emitted from the frame of my cards. I can of course see why other people would dislike that.

[HokusSchmokus]

It also makes things less challenging for good players. If people actually started to adept to things instead of durdling around in SCGs Sunday Night Magic with bad lists and without knowing what to,there wouldn't be a problem. I' almost sure we are not going to get bans this time,for the sake of the fornat(playerwise)
Edit: I meant to qoute Kich,damn you Mobile

[Star|Scream]

No. I'm a Spike. I don't care which kind of light is emitted from the frame of my cards. I can of course see why other people would dislike that.

Well if they ban SNT and/or Brainstorm, you'll still get to play with the best cards available, so you'll be fine. And the people who like playing strategies that aren't necessarily blue will also be happy. Seems like win/win to me. That is, if you really are a spike and don't care which cards give you wins. What I suspect is that most people who label themselves spikes are really just homers for brainstorm and blue, and that's why they complain when you say their cards are too powerful.

[Tacosnape]

Also, in digging for various ways to answer the current format via Cavern of Souls, I discovered the following facts:

1. Almost every scary dude in this format flies. Delver, Griselbrand, Emrakul, etc.
2. The only creature that specifically destroys a flyer upon entering the battlefield is Hammerheim Deadeye. A red Giant Warrior. asefkjgsailkjghadlghdyfgld.

So if we're supposed to solve Blue.Format with Cavern of Souls, (I mean, Kithkin Advisor for Gaddock Teeg? Fuck you too, pal.) we're gonna need some tools here, Wizards. So, you know, please print this:

Dragonslayer

Creature - Human Archer
When Dragonslayer enters the battlefield, destroy target creature with flying.
2/1

We'll also take the following, just for dude boostage:

Thundermagus

Creature - Human Wizard
When Thundermagus enters the battlefield, it deals 2 damage divided among one or two target creatures and/or players.
2/1

Hall Drone

Artifact Creature - Construct
Sorceries cost an additional to cast.
Hall pass, please.
1/1

Goblin Grail-Keeper

Creature - Goblin Rogue
Whenever a player casts a spell with converted mana cost 1, counter that spell and Goblin Grail-Keeper deals 1 damage to itself.
Greyk was a terrible choice to leave in charge of such a precious relic. Then again, so were all the rest of the tribe.
2/2

Defiler of Eternity

Creature - Zombie Wizard
If a player would draw a card except for the first card drawn during his or her draw step, that player skips that draw instead.
2/2

[Julian23]

Well, this is not gonna get us anywhere. I on the other side am pretty convinced that most "anti-blue" whiners are just medicore players that never at least Top8'ed a single SCG event. Those people would rather see decks with a higher level of variance more viable. I like Brainstorm for the sake that it lets me beat those players without praying on my drawstep.

On the other hand, I have never ever played neither Brainstorm nor Force of Will in a Legacy Grand Prix. I switched to other decks that were more suited for the metagame, like Maverick in Amsterdam 2011. Never looked back. Although I admit I'm gonna play UW in Gent since it's just too strong to pass upon.

[Lemnear]

Taco, you are Aware that your goblin is the unholy Child of mental misstep (countering One Drops) and Dark confidant (creature that creates CA)?

Protection from discard, burn, combo and spot-removal included^^

[Tacosnape]

Taco, you are Aware that your goblin is the unholy Child of mental misstep (countering One Drops) and Dark confidant (creature that creates CA)?

Protection from discard, burn, combo and spot-removal included^^

It's also a 2-drop red dude in a format where combo exists. I don't think he'd break anything. He still dies to most black removal, being blocked by Snapcaster Mage, or, suboptimally, casting 2 CMC-1 spells. Or, you know, Terminus. Or Jitte. Or Thundermagus. Whatever works. Mental Misstep and Dark Confidant are still better than this guy, hands down.

Regardless of this, though, my point is this: If Cavern's expected to be what diversifies the format, better dudes have to exist. More guys on the Thalia power level for being utility as balls.

[Star|Scream]

Well, this is not gonna get us anywhere. I on the other side am pretty convinced that most "anti-blue" whiners are just medicore players that never at least Top8'ed a single SCG event. Those people would rather see decks with a higher level of variance more viable. I like Brainstorm for the sake that it lets me beat those players without praying on my drawstep.

On the other hand, I have never ever played neither Brainstorm nor Force of Will in a Legacy Grand Prix. I switched to other decks that were more suited for the metagame, like Maverick in Amsterdam 2011. Never looked back. Although I admit I'm gonna play UW in Gent since it's just too strong to pass upon.

Is it possible that having brainstorm in your deck is the reason you've had more success against those you perceive as "bad players?"

Maybe it's the exact opposite and brainstorm actually makes worse players better.

The point I'm getting at is calling someone a whiner because they feel the game should be a certain way is just the other side of the same exact coin.

[Julian23]

Yeah, of course. Brainstorm allows you to outplay your opponent based on skill as opposed to just sheer luck. And yet still too many people still just play End of Turn Brainstorm and hope to get there. I don't mind, I usually beat those people because I actually know what I am doing.

[Esper3k]

I think Knight of the Reliquary and Tarmogoyf are pretty scary and they don't fly...

I mean seriously - look at Tarmogoyf. Do you really want that thing chasing you through a forest?

[Star|Scream]

Yeah, of course. Brainstorm allows you to outplay your opponent based on skill as opposed to just sheer luck. And yet still too many people still just play End of Turn Brainstorm and hope to get there. I don't mind, I usually beat those people because I actually know what I am doing.

Folks have been arguing on here that playing brainstorm actually takes less skill than playing without it and winning.

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

Those people would rather see decks with a higher level of variance more viable. I like Brainstorm for the sake that it lets me beat those players without praying on my drawstep.

I can sort of agree with this sentiment, but I'd like it so that people wouldn't have to play Blue with Brainstorm to stand a chance of properly managing variance. The only other cards I can think of that give non-Blue decks a chance at seeing lots of cards and controlling draws were printed at least 15 years ago, Mirri's Guile and Sylvan Library (no, Top doesn't count because it is used practically exclusively in Blue control decks and a fake deck that uses Scrying Sheets). I want to see the ability of card selection bled out more. I'd like more things in the vein of M. Guile or Library, but maybe on critters. Try these for instance (ignore my poor ability at power level balancing).

Guile Goes in Everything
G
Creature-Human Street Fighter

At the beginning of your upkeep you may look at the top 3 cards of your library and put them back in any order.

1/2


Loot Dude
R
Creature-Goblin Human Elf Cehphalid

Haste

At the end of your draw step you may discard a card then draw a card.

1/1


Big Bad Voodoo Daddy
B
Creature-Coolest Cat on the Block

At the beginning of your upkeep lose 1 life and scry 1.

1/1

Maybe also make some nonblue staple spells for other colors with aggressive cycling, cantrip, and scry abilities to help other colors fight variance. Sure, none of these would be as good as Brainstorm, but at least other colors wouldn't be completely impoverished in the "reducing variance" department.

Doing this, and giving other colors ways to interact with the stack (like bleeding out countermagic), would go a long way in reducing the deathgrip Blue has on the format without having to ban tons of cards.

[Julian23]

Folks have been arguing on here that playing brainstorm correctly actually takes less luck than playing without it and winning.

I can sort of agree with this sentiment, but I'd like it so that people wouldn't have to play Blue with Brainstorm to stand a chance of properly managing variance.

Yeah, exactly. This outlines the problems people have with blue. Reducing variance is part of blue's identity as a color. If they really wanted to see all five colors to appear at the same quantities in tournaments, R&D would have to give this ability to all colors. Right now, the way Magic is and has been designed, Blue has a tactical advantage over the others.

[AngryTroll]

Also, in digging for various ways to answer the current format via Cavern of Souls, I discovered the following facts:

1. Almost every scary dude in this format flies. Delver, Griselbrand, Emrakul, etc.
2. The only creature that specifically destroys a flyer upon entering the battlefield is Hammerheim Deadeye. A red Giant Warrior. asefkjgsailkjghadlghdyfgld.

Stingerfling Spider also nails fliying creatures, is a spider, and is green; a perfect fit. Silklash Spider used to see (fringe) Legacy play to kill fliers.