[Deck] Dredge

[TerribleTim68]

. . . No you won't swords my ichorid, I'm getting tokens dammit. (Among other things)

LOL! Awesome play! Mental note time!

[sconnell]

New article about Dredge is up!

I'm looking forward to the Cabal Therapy article - as you say, it's one of the most potent but also most hard to play cards in the deck.

[Mr. Froggy]

I played Dredge at my LGS, finished 4th.. out of 5...
Burn, ANT, StoneBlade, Turbo Eldrazi, Dredge

Round 1
Burn: 1-2 (was about to win in our 3rd game)

Round 2
BYE

Round 3
ANT: 1-2
One of THE weirdest matches ever in the history of me playing..

Game 1: Ichorid beats into Flayer win.
Game 2: He draws a billion cards, nothing. And wins shortly.
Game 3: Nothing important.

[Michael Keller]

I'm looking forward to the Cabal Therapy article - as you say, it's one of the most potent but also most hard to play cards in the deck.

Article is up.

[CabalTherapy]

Article is up.

Nice one.
I am a fan of this card (just look at my nickname here). In my last tournament I won against Storm in the Quarterfinals naming "Cabal Ritual" and hitting two of them.
If someone is interested, I can write a report of this tournament in detail. (Lost in the Semifinals in the Top8 after 7 Rounds, 74 players.)

[teonsw]

I just recently switched from Manaless Dredge and i am currently running the LED list in the primer. I am curious if anyone knows what cards are now in Ando's sideboard. In addition, is Leyline in our sideboard a good or bad thing? If anyone could give me some sample boards they are running i would really appreciate it!

[Mr. Froggy]

I just recently switched from Manaless Dredge and i am currently running the LED list in the primer. I am curious if anyone knows what cards are now in Ando's sideboard. In addition, is Leyline in our sideboard a good or bad thing? If anyone could give me some sample boards they are running i would really appreciate it!

I run Ando's list also, a bit different on the numbers though.

My SB:
4x Nature's Claim
2x Ancient Grudge
2x Ray of Revelation
3x Coffin Purge
1x Darkblast
1x Elesh
1x Iona
1x Ichorid

Its not the best sb, but it works for me.

[raikenxy]

I just recently switched from Manaless Dredge and i am currently running the LED list in the primer. I am curious if anyone knows what cards are now in Ando's sideboard. In addition, is Leyline in our sideboard a good or bad thing? If anyone could give me some sample boards they are running i would really appreciate it!

The sideboard i use is

4 natures claims
2 firestorms
4 leyline of the void
1 elesh norn
1 flayer of the hatebound
1 ichorid
1 cabal therapy
1 ancient grudge


generally after i win game one, if they are ANY deck that is not maverick or running maindeck deathrite shaman, i board in 4 claims and an ichorid, removing 3 breakthroughs 1 thug and one putrid imp. i've won a lot fo game two's doing this jsut because the most common hate i've ever come in contact with is a tormod's crypt, relic, or leyline of the void. personally these are in my opinion the easiest but LAZIEST forms of hate we see as dredge players and are easily just played around. bringing the extra ichorid ( i run two preboard ) helps set u up for what will be grind games.

against maverick, i really just bring in the two firestorm, elesh norn, and the xtra cabal therapy. you can pretty much just race them based on my experience. outside of surgical extraction they can't interact with you on your turn until they get a hate monster on the field like ooze deathrite or militant. just abusing this knowledge should help you get the win. remember that cabal therapy is a GREAT weapon for fighting hate. especially against maverick, you'd be surprised how often you'll hit green sun's zenith with a blind therapy.

leyline has saved me many times. a lot of the time reanimator players just don''t expect you to have it. i find it fits our mulligan heavy strategy perfectly and i dont have any problem running four in my sideboard. they're great in the mirrior match too obviously haha

[teonsw]

The sideboard i use is

4 natures claims
2 firestorms
4 leyline of the void
1 elesh norn
1 flayer of the hatebound
1 ichorid
1 cabal therapy
1 ancient grudge

Raikenxy could you post your list, I see that your running 1 ichorid side board. Is that because you run 3 main

[raikenxy]

Raikenxy could you post your list, I see that your running 1 ichorid side board. Is that because you run 3 main

sure no problem.

creatures

4 golgari thug
4 golgari grave troll
4 stinkweed imp
2 ichorid
4 narcomoeba
1 griselbrand
1 flame-kin zealot
4 putrid imp

instants/sorcery/enchantment

3 faithless looting
4 careful study
3 breakthrough
3 cabal therapy
2 dread return
4 bridge from below

artifacts

4 LED

lands

4 collisseum
4 gemstone mine
4 city of brass
1 tarnished citadel

i used to run 3 ichorid's main deck, but after a while i started noticing i would draw ichorid in my opening hand often... and honestly i hate seeing it in my first 7 -_-... i'd much rather just mill into it. game 1 never lasts long enough for ichorid to mean much of anything, it's a recurring beater yeah... but if i mill the first thirty cards of my library it rally doesnt matter that much. ichorid is prlly the slowest factor of the deck game one, not saying it is not usefu, god no. ichorid for me jsut always seem's much more important in games two and three then it does game one. such the reason i only run two maindeck

[feline]

In honor of the Dredge deck & fellow Dredgers.

For myself I have turned my dredge deck in, even though it's alot of fun and such a different perspective on the game with what it does, & doesn't do. Out of all my decks dredge is one of the ones I have not been playing lately even at the local store / weekly level. The hate is just a pain on top of the stuff people are already maindecking now like Scavenging ooze's / Deathrite shamans, etc. The deck is still explosive though and on the play can still go off through even that when it's fast, but my local metagames always have people packing graveyard hate. I did manage about a year ago to get a couple wins with dredge but it came with about half a dozen failed attempts at 1st, netting 3-1 & 2-2 records.

In defense of dredge, especially with environments unprepared, the deck is awesome, and in a place where people haven't seen it before, some are almost awestruck the first time they see it, asking questions and watching games because "it is just a crazy deck" there are also some decks that dredge just eats, any deck that has no main deck interaction, has to dedicate sideboard slots & even then, there's no guarantee on their end, they will likely have to win 2 sideboard games & they might even have to mulligan aggressively to get to what they sideboarded in.

So for those of you still dredging, keep fighting through the hate, & keep on dredging!

[KobeBryan]

Anyone have a recent decklist i can copy to playtest against?

[joemauer]

Anyone have a recent decklist i can copy to playtest against?

Why?

Dredge isn't a deck to beat right now. No need to test against it.

And you can free up some of your sideboard space by removing that graveyard hate.

[KobeBryan]

Why?

Dredge isn't a deck to beat right now. No need to test against it.

And you can free up some of your sideboard space by removing that graveyard hate.

True, but in so cal, there are always gy strategies. One tournament I went to when 3 months ago had 4 dredge decks out of 20 people

And i faced dredge three times that day.

[feline]

This might help.
4th palce - Dan Walton - StarCityGames.com Legacy Open 2012-12-02 Baltimore:
Creatures (22)
4 Golgari Grave-Troll
3 Golgari Thug
3 Ichorid
4 Narcomoeba
4 Putrid Imp
4 Stinkweed Imp
Lands (14)
4 Cephalid Coliseum
4 City of Brass
4 Gemstone Mine
2 Undiscovered Paradise
Spells (24)
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Bridge from Below
1 Darkblast
3 Breakthrough
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Careful Study
4 Faithless Looting
Sideboard
2 Pithing Needle
3 Nether Shadow
1 Terastodon
2 Firestorm
3 Nature's Claim
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
2 Dread Return

[Mr. Froggy]

Why are people panicking over Dredge? Has it always been that way? It might not be a DTB atm, but even with all the gy-hate running around, I believe in the hands of a competent player (a la Hollywood) its still an awesome choice.

[Michael Keller]

Why are people panicking over Dredge? Has it always been that way? It might not be a DTB atm, but even with all the gy-hate running around, I believe in the hands of a competent player (a la Hollywood) its still an awesome choice.

If people just sat down with the damn thing, sorted a stock list out and gold-fished a few hundred pre and post-board hands they would be fine.

The hardest games to win with Dredge are obviously games two and three. This is where you have to have experience in tournament play to make playing it worth your while. Yeah, the deck gets stupid hands and wins games without interaction sometimes. But when you're in round six or seven of an eight or nine-round tournament and need a "win and in," you had better believe your opponent is (probably) competent enough to at least give you trouble if you put the deck on autopilot and think you're going to cruise to the elimination rounds. Not gonna happen.

Every time I pick up Manaless Dredge and play it I go into each match assuming my opponent is prepared and capable enough of beating me flat out. I play each hand tight - super tight. I stay humble in the face of my opponents and give each and every one of them the benefit of the doubt. But you have to fucking practice. Longevity is what makes you a better player with any deck, and while it appears on paper to be easy to play, it just really isn't. Graveyard hate has shit to do with keeping the deck down; it's poor piloting. And until people start realizing that they will continue to under-perform with it in large events.

If you're new to playing it and want to master it, test it in three phases like I did:

Phase One: Play a few hundred hands pre-board by yourself until you get comfortable with making decisions and how the deck works. Have a metagamed sideboard prepared for later.
Phase Two: Find a friend and test a gauntlet through each competitive deck in the format pre-board. Do this until you're comfortable playing against those decks.
Phase Three: Assess each match-up's strengths and weaknesses and build a list of what to bring in and what to take out. Then test against the same gauntlet post-board until you've got a feel for what to sub in and out and make adjustments as needed.

Remember: in a tournament, you have to win two games to win a match. This might mean having to play three games, which means that there's a reasonable chance that 66.7% of your individual rounds in a tournament will include sideboard cards (games two and three).

Think of playing Dredge like playing a guitar. It's not that hard to play Major (easier | game one) chords once you get them down, but in order to get better you have to combine those chords to ultimately make an entire song (harder | games two and three). If you want to make your song good, you need to decide what chords work well together. This necessitates practice, something you have to have if you want to succeed at this game - and Dredge in particular.

[Que]

Phase Two: Find a friend and test a gauntlet through each competitive deck in the format pre-board.
Phase Three: Assess each match-up's strengths and weaknesses and build a list of what to bring in and what to take out. Then test against the same gauntlet post-board until you've got a feel for what to sub in and out and make adjustments as needed.

Seems to me these phases are most difficult. No one wants to sit through any of this. xD

[KobeBryan]

Seems to me these phases are most difficult. No one wants to sit through any of this. xD

This is what separates men from boys.

[Que]

This is what separates men from boys.

Are you volunteering? >:]