Trinket mage is better now than it has been for almost a year. In a stifle-rich meta, you want to avoid your turn 3-4 play being completely negated for 1 mana. In an abrupt-decay meta though, which at least New England is doused heavily in, Trinket Mage is to be feared. People take it with discard nearly as much as candelabra of tawnos itself, which is great, and not entirely the wrong choice either.Originally Posted by SBGpinas
Does anyone tested Teferi's Response?
To be frank about it, I don't think Teferi's Response has any place in your 75.
It is a card with an extremely limited use in the deck, as it only possibly stops 2 cards in Legacy - Wasteland and Sinkhole. There aren't enough Pox decks to be significantly worried about Sinkhole, so that leaves only Wasteland as the sole reason to consider this card.
Now, currently, we have the following tools to combat Wasteland strategies:
- Crop Rotation (Respond to a Wasteland activation - Sacrifice the targeted land)
- Pithing Needle (MB or SB)
- Primeval Titan (A resolved PrimeTime renders Wasteland moot)
- Candelabra of Tawnos (Enables you to go off with less lands in play)
- Show and Tell (In a pinch, lets you cheat your win conditions into play)
- Bojuka Bog (To combat Life from the Loam shenanigans that have been popular lately)
As it stands, the above cards should be more than enough to get past Wasteland strategies - barring of course insane RUG hands, but then again, it wouldn't be called "insane" if it was easy to play against.
So personally, I would skip it and never look back.
Sorry for that but I desagree. What you are talking about is very relative. First there are some other cards you can find that might destroy lands a.k.a. Vindicate. And even against Wasteland, draw two card is by far the best choice than just sac lands with Rotation instead.
My opinion is:[*]Crop Rotation - Is good but is counterable and sacrificing lands to pay the cost still screw when couldn't be resolve[*]Pithing Needle - prevents wastes but not spells and you can't draw anything comparing with Tef. Resp.[*]Primeval Titan - this monster isnt's a reason to prevent land destruction but a way to win games in late game[*]Candelabra of Tawnos - Isn't a prevention but acceleration[*]Show and Tell - maybe the best choice because is slight faster than Candelabra[*]Bojuka Bog - does nothing against wastes byitself and spells
Even mainly against only Wastelands worth it a playtest. Draw two cards is very strong.
Teferi's Response was awesome. It shines against rishidan port, which hasn't been mentioned yet. I think stifle would be better vs wasteland if you're that worried about it. Plus stifle has broader applications. I don't think you want to land-go your turn two to keep mana open for response. That's if you weren't wasted t1. And after t3-4, their wastes are likely too late.
Hello guys,
I managed to land another T8 last sunday at a 45 people tournament.
The matchups details are a bit lost to me but I can say that the deck served me well (again). I was playing the solid list with one candelabra with a weird experimental sideboard:
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
4 Flusterstorm
3 Divert
3 In the Eye of Chaos
2 Beast Within
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
I didn't encounter any combo deck and couldn't, thus, verify my testing on the field. Please feel free to bash my sideboard selection :) Highlight for the day is having the chance to meet a foreigner Sourcer that was visiting Rome and decided to stop by to play in the tournament (hello Tomas!!)
Best play move of the day has been the Divert on an Hymn to Tourach during my 3rd match...not a very happy opponent after that :)
I lost in the first turn of T8 against a very very very skilled opponent after winning the first round and punting brutally (I won't tell you what I did because I'm ashamed of myself ;) ) on a play that could have brought me the match
I'm testing a new build incorporating 4 Noble Hierarcs in the place of 1 Brainstorm, 1 Repeal, 1 Expedition Map and 1 Pithing Needle. In addition I'm thinking to swap one of the Tropical Island for a basic forest.
My thinking for the experiment is:
- having quick access to coloured mana to accelerate towards an expedition map or a S&T
- stabilize the coloured mana base to avoid denial and/or mana screw
- accelerate titan by one turn or more
- facilitating double coloured choices in the sideboard
At the moment it seems that the testing is not detrimental to the game plan, I'm not sure if it improves it that much but the jury is still out... :)
@Rock Lee – thank you very much for your work on this deck. I’ve enjoyed playing it very much in the last months and have been reading this thread and the old one with much delight.
I started playing a GR variant with Burning Wishes some months ago and then changed to your UG version after your Starcitygames showing. This is the list I’m playing right now:
Artifacts
1 Candelabra of Tawnos
4 Expedition Map
3 Pithing Needle
4 Sensei's Divining Top
Creatures
4 Primeval Titan
Instants
4 Brainstorm
4 Crop Rotation
4 Repeal
Legendary Creatures
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Sorceries
1 All is Dust
3 Show and Tell
Basic Lands
1 Forest
1 Island
Lands
1 Bojuka Bog
4 Cloudpost
1 Glacial Chasm
4 Glimmerpost
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Tropical Island
4 Vesuva
Legendary Lands
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Karakas
Sideboard:
2 Spellskite
3 Elephant Grass
1 Sylvan Library
3 Krosan Grip
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 All is Dust
1 Show and Tell
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Maze of Ith
The lone, but searchable All is Dust has served me very well (edit: my mistake, it isn't searchable...). The only thing I’m thinking of changing in the MD is 1 Pithing Needle or 1 Expedition Map to 1 Trinket Mage.
Regarding the sideboard, I have the luxury of not having to prepare for any combo decks since I’m mainly up against RUG Delver, Esper Stoneblade, Maverick and Prison style Enchantress. With that metagame in mind are there any changes you would suggest for my sideboard?
Maze of Ith and Cavern of Souls are two cards I’ve also noticed pop up in other lists from time to time so I would like to hear your as well as other people on this thread's experiences with them?
The Maze of Ith has served me pretty well and Vesuva’ing one can stall a lot of decks long enough. I've also found it a useful trick to be able to untap Titan so that I still get the lands while keeping it ready to block next turn (or avoid it being blocked by a bigger blocker if that’s the case).
Cavern of Souls is a little experimental. Uncounterable Titans should be very strong but perhaps it is too narrow a use.
Oh, and the Pongifys in your latest board – are they just for Griselbrand et al or am I missing something?
Thanks again – and let’s keep this great thread going.
Hans
Last edited by Hanzalot; 12-28-2012 at 07:22 PM.
@Hanzalot
When you say that the lone All is Dust is searchable, you mean you dig for it with Top, correct?
Just making sure you're not thinking of Eye of Ugin, because only the cost-reduction effect works with All is Dust. The search effect can only be used on colorless creature cards (because I made the same mistake before)
@Masamune
I've tried Teferi's Response in lieu of a few copies of Crop Rotation and Pithing Needle in a few games in Cockatrice, and based on my experience, I very rarely am able to draw cards with it. In the very rare occasions that I was able to draw cards with it, I drew it in multiples (I played around with a list containing 3 copies of this card) with the extra copies stuck in my hand the rest of the game.
Most of the time, I never even see it, or draw into it too late, or don't have enough blue sources to cast it, and still win a good percentage of the time anyway, in spite of Wastelands and Ports.
You're right I missed Vindicate, but in our meta, Junk and Deadguy Ale are practically in-existent, while Esper runs very few of copies of it (which is immaterial, because Esper is pretty much a bye 70% of the time).
Based on my experience, Teferi's Response is too janky for my taste. It's cool when you get it to work, but you don't really lose anything by not using it.
How are you searching All is Dust? Am I missing something? lol
Argh - but I'm glad I'm not the only one. I even got it from an article somewhere since originally I didn't "know" you could do it :). I must have misunderstood it. Well, then I'll probably make room for one more MD.@Hanzalot
When you say that the lone All is Dust is searchable, you mean you dig for it with Top, correct?
Just making sure you're not thinking of Eye of Ugin, because only the cost-reduction effect works with All is Dust. The search effect can only be used on colorless creature cards (because I made the same mistake before
Thanks for correcting me!
Hans
An easy mistake. I've had several fans of the deck come up to me at events and ask me after watching a game "Why didn't you tutor up All is dust with ugin during that game!??"
I really love the power level and the fun this deck has. I'm glad i built it :) I hope that gatecrash gives us some new toys
Maybe it's because it would be oh so sweet if indeed it was possible :).
Did you have any suggestions on what to sideboard in an almost non-combo metagame?
I can't even imagine that. describe it?
I'm actually in a fairly non-combo meta. Kind of odd. Mostly creature beats aggro and tempo, with a scattering of counter-top and the only combo I've seen recently has been Show and Tell based, or reanimator-styles.
Bearing that in mind, heres what im running right now:
// Lands
4 [FNM] Cloudpost
4 [TSP] Vesuva
4 [SOM] Glimmerpost
3 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
4 [B] Tropical Island
1 [ZEN] Island (2)
1 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [CMD] Bojuka Bog
1 [IA] Glacial Chasm
1 [ZEN] Forest (1a)
// Creatures
1 [ROE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 [ROE] Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 [ROE] Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
4 [M12] Primeval Titan
// Spells
3 [US] Show and Tell
2 [5E] Brainstorm
4 [UL] Crop Rotation
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
2 [AQ] Candelabra of Tawnos
4 [ZEN] Expedition Map
4 [GP] Repeal
3 [10E] Pithing Needle
2 [ROE] All Is Dust
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [LG] The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
SB: 4 [CMD] Flusterstorm
SB: 2 [FUT] Venser, Shaper Savant
SB: 3 [NPH] Beast Within
SB: 3 [VI] Elephant Grass
SB: 2 [8E] Ensnaring Bridge
I was on the fence about Ensnaring Bridge for a bit, but it's saved my ass a few times against cheated-into-play fatties. F U Progenitus!
Ensnaring Bridge is a nice SB tech for Sneak Show decks. Good call :)
Credit goes to Rock Lee. It's been super useful.
If you are in a super-high aggro and tempo control meta, which I assume means that you are including Junk, Deadguy, & BUG as tempo control, with only a smattering of show/sneaky/reanimator, then that is a healthy meta. It is a meta shifted slightly towards aggro and tempo over a more holistic meta that would contain some storm combo, combo elves, and MUD, but the meta you described should be crushed solidly by Turbo-Eldrazi, regardless of its composition.
to answer your question however without further info, I would go up to 4 show & Tell, especially if you are including Ensnaring bridges in the sideboard. I would personally have a sideboard as follows:
And I would go to 2 island over island/forest if you are agreeing to drop Beast Within. Admittedly, this is still me being stubborn about not including combo answers, but I would rather be overprepared for matchups that are unlikely but unwinnable compared to being completely overprepared for matchups you should already demolish.Code:// Sideboard SB: 1 [US] Show and Tell SB: 4 [CMD] Flusterstorm SB: 2 [FUT] Venser, Shaper Savant SB: 3 [ZEN] Mindbreak Trap SB: 2 [B] Blue Elemental Blast SB: 1 [MR] Chalice of the Void SB: 2 [8E] Ensnaring Bridge
If you are insistent on further streamlining the deck towards your specific meta, and you are willing to go up to 4 Show & Tell, then I would suggest going upto 2x emrakul, and dropping Karakas as well. Small tweaks like this make a huge difference, even if I don't suggest them personally, as I tweak the deck towards large-event showings, where you will have to be able to contend against every archetype.
Solid argument. I clearly need to curb my desire to "win more". Aggro decks aren't really the problem for this deck, although can I just say how frustrating "The Gate" can be to play against? I pout every time they make me sac an Emrakul. Granted, Elephant Grass has Viking sex with that deck, but man is it ever annoying.
It blows my mind when people have issues against pox oriented decks with Turbo Eldrazi. You can streamline the deck to be a deck 100% of card advantage if you want, that directly counters LD. I haven't lost a match to The Gate or Pox in a long long long time.
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