Good call. I was actually thinking it's for a tutor into the tendrils.. or for the diminishing returns. It was just a random thought, but the post previous to yours made a good point that it can only be used on one spell, the tutor or the engine..Originally Posted by Dark Ritual
which makes sense. Nevermind.
Jund brings in Slaughter Games, Cabal Therapy, Duress, Hymn to Tourach, Surgical Extraction, or Red Elemental Blast. Other cards that might be relevant are Chalice of the Void, a fast clock, Price of Progress, or other graveyard hate.
The best way to combat fair decks?
Practice winning the die roll, and win on turn one more.
Follow me on Twitter @RaNDoMxGeSTuReS
Played in a 35 man tournament last saturday. Using the list with maindeck empty the warrens over tendrils. It did work against the different BUG decks.
matchups:
2-1 BUG
2-1 Gatecrash combo ( I dont know the name of this hermit druid deck. TIP win die-roll)
0-2 S&T (slap myself for not able to count)
2-0 BUG
2-0 Goblins
ID Maverick
top8
2-1 Gatecrash combo (winning cause allowed to start once again!)
Top-4 split.
The amounth of T1 kills really surprised me alot. ETW was great.
^^You were at Rudy's too? Played TES as well, but with a hangover.
I'll join this Dutch party ^^!
Next time I will just counter the ritual (after a probe --> petal --> brainstorm --> gemstone mine (showing that you rly had to go off that turn (no shit sherlock)) when I know that Griselband will close the game on my next turn ;)! That was a mistake i'm not supposed to make.. You won't have counting issues then! Btw, 4 Fow, 3 Pierce, 2 Flusterstorm (also 3 REB and 2 misdirection), a fast Griselbrand and ofc 4 Leyline of Sanctity is not that easy for TES. Allthough I tend to win with ANT aswell when testing vs Sneaky Show (2-1 most of the time)..
Anyway; both top 4 ftw!
I played at SCG ATL yesterday... Overall a giant disappointment after finishing undefeated in the challenge (Especially when I saw most of my challenge opponents at top tables for the Open).
Round 1 Affinity
It was a local so I knew what he was on. I kill him T1. Game 2 I keep a sketchy no lander, but if it gets there he is dead. It doesnt get there. G3 I kill him on T2.
1-0
Round 2 Merfolk
I've never played this MU before. G1 I Silence him and he has no force I kill him. G2 he has curse catchers and all kind of taxing counters. I go for a rite of flame and he draw the spell pierce... G3 I durress and take his Spell Pierce. Next turn I go to go off. He drew the force :/ This was the Merfolk guy who Top 8'd.
1-1
Round 3 Esper Stoneblade.
G1 I see a bunch of discard after a probe. He dies. G2 He draws a bucnh of discard andf counters an throws down a Geist of Saint Traft and I die. G3 he keeps a no lander. I start durressing and taking his counters. Around T4 he draws a land finally. A Plains. LOL. He dies.
2-1
Round 4 SHardless BUG
This was a very VERY frustrating match. Around T4 I make 18 Goblins. He fires off his Ancestral he suspended on T1, then a Brainstorm. He draws his 1-of Mainboard Pernicious Deed. Game 2 I take his only relevant spell, I hide my Infernal Tutor on top of my deck and let him take my Burning Wish with his thoughtseize, then I Ad Nauseum from 19 life. I dont get there. I draw a bunch of brainstorms and Ponders and Probes and stop at 4 life, assuming my deck will bail me out. I cast 4 Brainstorms/Ponders and dont see shit. Pass at 2 life. Next turn I brainstorm. Dont see shit. Cast Ponder. Dont see anything. I die next turn. God if this was not the most frustrating thing to happen.... I was tilted after that...
2-2
Round 5 Burn
He mentions he has never played legacy before so I just put him on Burn or Affinity. I T1 Ponder setting up. He goes Goblin Guide Attack. Next Turn he dies. G2 He T1 Guides and I durress away a fireblast. Then he miracles Thunderous Wrath and then bolts me. Im at 8... I die. Game 3 I just dont draw anything and eventually die even after firing off a tendrils for 14. I probably kept hands I shouldnt have but losing to BUG the way that I did was horrid...
2-3 DROP
I know that this deck is much better than it performed for me and I realize that I DEFINITELY mis played against merfolk in round 2, but it is just an awful feeling to play perfectly AND draw the nuts and still lose like I did against BUG...
Ha! And you think I was kidding about how frustrating it was to play against Burn on my stream. GDI Budget Burn!
West side
Find me on MTGO as Koby or rukcus -- @MTGKoby on Twitter
* Maverick is dead. Long live Maverick!
My Legacy stream
My MTG Blog - Work in progress
Burn is horrible to play against... Especially G2 or 3 and they have Mindbreak trap? Ewww....
How did you misplay? How did you board against the decks? What was your hand against Merfolk?
Follow me on Twitter @RaNDoMxGeSTuReS
Against Folk I remember I had Empty the Warrens in hand and I could make around 14 Goblins and he had a curse catcher on board and I assumed he had Pierce in hand... I had 2 Rite of Flames and a Dark Ritual plus chrom Mox and something else... I played Rite of Flame, which Got Pierced, then I forgot about curse catcher and played dark Ritual which then got cursecatcher'd... So I blew 2 cards there. I just was so worried he would suddenly dump his hand and kill me that I forgot to just play my game. Like I said, I had never played against folk before so I wasn't prepared enough... I don't think I boarded at all against him, which may be wrong. I may have done a Therapy for an Infernal Tutor game 3 against him.
Against BUG I stayed the same deck. And Against Burn I think I didnt change anything as well. Against Burn I just wanted to keep my speed up. As for BUG I figured he would be boarding in FOW and other counters so I figured I was already set up to beat that.
My burn opponent also told me he was playing 2 mainboard Pyrostatic Pillars.... Man glad I dodged that bullet!
That's a shame, strong attempt. Don't give up!
I wouldn't blame it on the deck. Game 1, I wouldn't have 'all in'ed on ETW considering Shardless BUG rarely plays FOW maindeck. Game 2, you probably misplayed by only showing him BW. Given that I don't know your hand (assuming the rest is mana or protection), I would have shown him both tutors and let him pick. If he takes IT, BW could have easily won with DR or PiF. I think post-Ad Nauseam, you made another misplay by casting Brainstorm before Ponder. You would have dug deeper the other way around.
I think you might want some practice with this match up as well.
Regarding SB (if you are playing the OP list), you might consider boarding out an Infernal Tutor and a Ponder for 2x Cabal Therapy. It'll give you more protection from counter magic and streamlines the deck a bit more. Against Burns, boarding out the Silence is probably the correct play as they don't do much in that match up. Cabal Therapy or bounce can save you some damage.
I disagree. Letting the opponent only see Burning Wish causes that card's importance to sky rocket. Had there been two tutors the Thoughtseize may have taken a important mana spell instead.
Then again Burning Wish could have been hidden with Infernal Tutor in hand, going for Iggy or PiF, but it kind of hard to say without all the info.
Not after a brainstorm!
my hand was some thing like LED, BW, dark ritual. I mean I was going to Ad Nauseum from 19 life. I figured winning was elementary. I guess not.
But yeah. I figure he would take wish in that scenario. He did what I thought he would do and what I wanted.
Assuming he took your Infernal Tutor, you could have gone Dark Rit>LED>B Wish>Iggy>Dark Rit>LED>Infernal Tutor>Empty the Warrens(or tendrils if you sided it in) for 16 tokens. With him at 18 from thoughtseize and going down to three cards from iggy would have been a solid play. Without the maindeck Tendrils, Ad Nauseum isn't always and auto win. Lots of times Ad Nauseum will lead to a big Empty which is what the above play would have been, but less risky.
I guess I never stated it but he had a maelstrom pulse in hand. But after getting blown out by a timely pernicious deed I really was not excited to go for the goblins again. Plus that is the only time I have ever fizzled off of AdNauseum at such a high life total.
Definitely.
Yeah Ad Nauseam really isn't a sure win, espeically now that Tendrils is no longer in the main deck. If you knew he had maelstrom pulse, I wouldn't have gone Goblins either. It just sounds like you went off a little too early. YOu could have waited. It doesn't sound like he had any threats on the table to warrent a rushed Ad Nauseam.
I haven't seen a lot of people do this, if any at all, but I decided to go through storm hands articles and do the sample hands while writing down my thoughts. If you would do something differently or would not have done what I did in any circumstances, please tell me. I'm here to learn and become a better pilot. Played out each hand with the newest list and sideboard, deck was shuffled and cut to randomize what's on top. I'm on the play in each game. So, here we go:
Article 1
Opening Hand 1 – Brainstorm, Lion’s Eye Diamond, Chrome Mox, Infernal Tutor, Duress, Duress, and Lotus Petal.
Wouldn't call this a thrilling hand, but not really horrible either. No land and no sure kill, unless I rip a dark ritual from top of deck with brainstorm. I estimate that chance of finding dark ritual would be around 8%. I don't go for it, pass the turn.
Draw - Gemstone mine. Really nice draw, now I could just go for mox petal led tutor for 10 goblins. I decide to brainstorm. Brainstorm reveals Ponder, Rite of Flame and Dark Ritual. There's now either two lines of play, I either go for it now without protection or next turn with protection of Duress. Storm is at one after brainstorm. I put back Ponder and Duress. Play Chrome mox, imprint Duress. Play Lotus Petal, LED, Rite of Flame with Lotus Petal and dark ritual with chrome mox after rite has resolved. Storm is 6, RRBBB floating. Play Infernal Tutor and break LED for black. Search Ad Nauseam. Play Ad Nauseam, storm is at 8 and I leave one black mana floating. Ad nauseam reveals:
Silence 19
Dark Ritual 18
Infernal Tutor 16
Lotus Petal 16
Ponder 15
Probe 14
Duress 13
Silence 12
Brainstorm 11
Ponder 10
Ponder 9
Dark Ritual 8
Rite of Flame 7
LED 7
LED 7
Brainstorm 6
Rite of Flame 5
Play artifacts and rituals, inf tutor for bw and tendrils. If opponent is a dick you can also Past in Flames and grapeshot.
Opening Hand 2 – Underground Sea, Gemstone Mine, Duress, Dark Ritual, Infernal Tutor, Gitaxian Probe and another Gitaxian Probe.
Not so fast hand, but would keep against unknown opponent. Play gitaxian probe with life. Draw Chrome mox, meh. Play UGSea and pass. Draw fetchland. Play it and find volcanic, pass the turn. Draw brainstorm, play it with volcanic. Lion's Eye Diamond, Ad Nauseam and Burning Wish. Put Burning Wish, Ad Nauseam on top. Gemstone Mine, Chrome Mox imprint Infernal Tutor and play Duress. Play LED, Dark Ritual. Storm is now at 5 and BBB floating. Tap Gemstone Mine to play Gitaxian Probe, break LED for red. Draw Ad Nauseam and play it, leaving one R in pool, storm at 7 and life at 17. Ad Nauseam Reveals:
Burning Wish 15
Rite of Flame 14
Rite of Flame 13
Ponder 12
Dark Ritual 11
Rite of Flame 10
Chrome Mox 10
Infernal Tutor 8
Duress 7
Brainstorm 6
LED 6
Brainstorm 5
LED 5
Burning Wish 3
Again, pretty much do whatever you want.
Opening Hand 3 – Burning Wish, Dark Ritual, Dark Ritual, Gemstone Mine, Polluted Delta, Ponder, and Brainstorm.
Definitely keep. Gemstoen mine brainstorm. Reveal Lotus Petal, city and Brainstorm. Put City and Burning Wish on top. Pass the turn, on my next turn draw Wish. Fetch Underground Sea. Play brainstorm off of Underground Sea. Draw Duress, Probe and Infernal Tutor. Put back Burning wish and Duress. Play Gitaxian Probe with life, play ponder from gemstone mine. Show burning wish, silence and brainstorm. No led, mox or lotus petal so I can't go off now, shuffle. Draw Gitaxian Probe. Go deep and play it with life! Draw Lotus Petal. I realize that my math was off I can't actually make goblins. Pass the turn in shame. Draw Silence. Play Silence, then Duress the opponent. Play Petal, Petal and both Dark Rituals. Play infernal tutor, search for Empty the Warrens, play it and throw 16 goblins on the board. Pray.
Next two draws would be Gemstone Mine, Gemstone Mine.
Article 2:
Opening Hand: Underground Sea, Lotus Petal, Empty the Warrens, Gitaxian Probe, Ponder, Ad Nauseam, and Dark Ritual
Drawing Dark Ritual would result in turn 1 AdN, Rite of Flame in turn 2 Nauseam. Keep. Play Sea and ponder. 2 Fetchlands and LED. We can keep these, play land on the next turn and Ad Nauseam. But I like to live dangerously, shuffle and draw it is. Draw Burning Wish. Pass the turn, draw Gemstone Mine. Gitaxian Probe with life, draw LED. Play Ad Nauseam tapping out. Storm is at 4, no mana floating and hand is EtW, Wish and LED, 18 life. Draw awesome cards and silence opponent, bwish IGG and go for the kill.
Opening Hand II: Lion’s Eye Diamond, Infernal Tutor, Lotus Petal, Ponder, Empty the Warrens, Silence, and Misty Rainforest
Keep. Fetch underground sea and play ponder. Silence, Chrome Mox and Brainstorm on top of deck. Shuffle, draw city. Pass the turn. Draw infernal tutor. Play city, infernal tutor revealing LED. Pass the turn, draw brainstorm. Play Silence, 17 life 1 storm. Lotus Petal, LED, LED play infernal tutor with sea and lotus petal. Break LED's and search for Ad Nauseam, play it and leave B in pool. Storm is at 6. Ad Nauseam reveals:
Ponder 16
Wish 14
Rite 13
Duress 12
Lotus 12
Silence 11
Probe 10
Brainstorm 9
Wish 7
Probe 6
Tutor 4
Rite 3
Mox 3
Petal 3
Duress 2
Play Gemstone Mine, petals, exile probe, play brainstorm. Nothing relevant, two lands to top of library. Break petal, play rites, RRRR in pool, burning wish for empty the warrens. Make lots of goblins and see if anyone actually reads this and asks why the hell I didn't just kill the opponent with tendrils. Because I wanted to see does anyone even read this.
Opening Hand III: Infernal Tutor, Ponder, Ponder, Lion’s Eye Diamond, Lion’s Eye Diamond, Rite of Flame, and Chrome Mox
Double LED is always tempting, risky hand but let's have a go at it. Chrome mox, imprint ponder, play ponder and throw your hands in the air! See Infernal Tutor, Chrome Mox and Brainstorm. Turn 2 kill it should be. Draw brainstorm, pass the turn and draw mox. Play brainstorm. Find tutor, wish and wish. Put tutor, tutor back. Chrome mox imprint wish. Rite of flame. Play LED's and burning wish breaking LEDs. Get UUUBBB, search for diminishing returns and play it, leaving UB in pool. Storm at 7. Exile 10 cards, one burning wish exiled. Draw 7: Ponder, Probe, Probe, Sea, Volcanic, Dark Ritual, Infernal Tutor. Ponder, leaving B in pool. Ponder, Ad Nauseam and Lotus Petal. Get Ad Nauseam. Play probe with life, drawing lotus petal and play it. Play dark ritual, break petal and tap sea for mana, play Ad Nauseam. Storm is at 11 and life at 18.
Draw loads of cards:
Ponder 17
Rite 16
Tutor 14
EtW 10
Duress 9
LED 9
Probe 8
LED 8
Tutor 6
Duress 5
Rite 4
Silence 3
Ponder 2
Silence 1
Land played, no mana floating, one life remaining. One petal which could be played for rites, then go and make 20++ goblins. No Dark Ritual no Burning wish means there's no way of winning immediately. Make lots of goblins and pray they get there.
Here would be my samples of playing the "try these hands" in storm hands articles. Would be pretty awesome if someone would have the time / interest to create some sort of puzzles including TES. You have to win on this exact turn, your life total and board is told. Opponent's board is also told and his hand is told IF you somehow happen to see it. The top cards, or at least some of them should be known if you ponder/brainstorm and if you shuffle you would get new set of predefined cards. Would be a lot of work, and making a list of cards that you will see on top when you AdN would be a lot of work. I might try to make a puzzle for you guys later on today.
If Bryant is reading this, please do continue making Storm Hands -articles. Thank you.
I dont see the reasoning in not going off there on the turn that I did. I had a perfect hand to go off, and I knew he didnt have a force/MB Trap (which he sided in over force for some reason). It may not be the right thing to do, but realistically what would be the point in not going off? With no can trips in hand if he rips a thoughtseize and takes my Tutor, then now Im sitting pretty with nothing. I understand that not all of the info is provided (my notes that I take are very minimal, but Ad Nauseum from 19 life probably gets there at least 90% Of the time. In all of the goldfishing and games that I have played previously I have NEVER fizzled, so in my mind why not win that turn? All I had to do was hit one of my 6 tutors left in the deck to win.
Turn three could have also went like this:land drop, Brainstorm(put ad Nauseum, then b wish on top)>Probe paying two life and drawing b wish>Dark Ritual>Infernal Tutor(find LED)>Chrome Mox(imprint duress)>LED>LED>Burning Wish(using black floating and Gemstone Mine) while cracking LEDs for six black>Iggy>LED>LED>Infernal Tutor,crack LEDs for black and red>Burning Wish>Tendrils for 28 life.
What if your opponent is doing 3-6 damage a turn with any old aggro deck? A third turn Ad Nauseum won't get there then.
Ad Nauseum is random, but Ill-Gotten Gains is not. Ad Nauseum will not be an option every game you play in either. Ill-Gotten Gains, Past in Flames, and Diminishing Returns are in the sideboard for a reason guys. You guys should practice more with the other engines of the deck.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Reply With Quote