Holy shit you are retarded.Originally Posted by bruizar
Team Hammafist-We don't take kindly to those who don't take kindly."Got any trade boogas?"
This is the list I'm most content with now:
4x Deathrite Shaman --Mana dork
4x Sylvan Safekeeper --Token protector (maybe switch these for Simic charm to also make your lands hexproof)
3x Snapcaster Mage
11x
4x Brainstorm
3x Ponder
4x Force of Will
3x Counterspell
3x Spell Pierce
4x Stifle
4x Crop Rotation
2x Life from the Loam
27x
3x Dark Depths
2x Thespian's Stage
3x Wasteland
4x Misty Rainforest
4x Scalding Tarn
3x Tropical Island
1x Underground Sea
2x Island
22x
SB not decided yet but thinking about something like:
3x Surgical Extraction
3x Carpet of Flowers --Mana Accelerator=faster combo enabler
2x Ground Seal --Against DRS, Surgical Extraction (Need to change mainboard DRS into BoP when playing ground seal)
3x Pithing Needle --Wasteland/Karakas/Jace etc..
2x Engineered Explosives -- Against aggro/tokens
2x Phyrexian Dreadnought/Gilded Drake -- Alt Combo/Combo Stealer
Maybe petrified fields can be considered somewhere against wasteland or instead use Simic Charms.
if you draw the parts to your combo, you will have wasted cards... but thats typically not an issue, because you have your combo and you are going to win.
since crop rotation replaces the land you don't need 5 lands, so im not really sure i understand what you are talking about
turn 3 you have 3 tropical islands in play, and at the end of their turn you cast crop rotation, sacrifice 1 tropical island to get a thespian stage. on your 4th turn you drop a dark depths, tap your 2 remaining tropical islands, and your stage to make the 20/20 and win.....
Play 4 Card Blind!
Currently Playing
Legacy: Dark Depths
EDH: 5-Color Hermit Druid
Currently Brewing: [Deck] Sadistic Sacrament / Chalice NO Eldrazi
why cards are so expensive...hoarders
Right, thanks for your constructive feedback. Since this site isn't moderated at all I'll lower my standards to yours and wish that you just delete your account and life.
edit:
Goodluck getting owned by Blood Moon / Ensnaring Bridge / Repeal / Swords to Plowshares / Diabolic Edict / Echoing Truth / Venser, Shaper Savant / Waterfront Bouncer or a quick pithing needle shithead.
If you crop rotate for a one-of Sejiri Steppe you can get around swords/path/jace bounce/everything that kills the actual token besides an edict.
Haha thanks for the laugh man. Pointing out cards that hurt a strategy is fun! You forgot Wasteland
Just because cards that are good against a combo exist, does not mean that said combo cannot be overpowered. Every card you mentioned can be either answered or played around in one way or another.
Team Hammafist-We don't take kindly to those who don't take kindly."Got any trade boogas?"
half of these cards arnt played in legacy and many of them not widely played at all....
Waterfront Bouncer - are u fucking serious
Diabolic Edict - people still play this...maybe they dont know about liliana....
pithing needle - if people played this survival wouldnt have gotten banned
Repeal - is this even played in modern?
the rest are found in the same deck - miracles / stone blade
....so i'll take one bad matchup which isnt even that bad to crush the format!
Play 4 Card Blind!
Currently Playing
Legacy: Dark Depths
EDH: 5-Color Hermit Druid
Currently Brewing: [Deck] Sadistic Sacrament / Chalice NO Eldrazi
why cards are so expensive...hoarders
which is a merfolk, will get played if dark depths goes anywhere. THE MERFOLK VERSION OF STINGSCOURGER. also, spreading seas in that deck.
Will get played over other removal because liliana is sorcery speed thus can't do anything against eot marit late. Could also be far // away.Diabolic Edict - people still play this...maybe they dont know about liliana....
People do play this, it didnt work against survival because they would activate for harmonic sliver in response you idiot. Also, fauna shaman.pithing needle - if people played this survival wouldnt have gotten banned
Err, this is a legacy forum. Also, dark depths is banned in modern you scrub.Repeal - is this even played in modern?
blood moon: UR painter, Imperial painter, red mud variants, UWr, dragon stompy. p.s. blood moon also kills jund and other death rite shaman dependent decks.the rest are found in the same deck - miracles / stone blade
....so i'll take one bad matchup which isnt even that bad to crush the format!
ensnaring bridge - mud variants / stax variants / UR painter variants
Swords to Plowshares - 80% of the format
echoing truth - finds a spot in decks like high tide and show and tell variants
Dark Depths will be so ubiquitous that maindeck answers will find its way into the top tier decks. This is why you can't fuck around with your cute crop rotation shenanigans and rely solely on dark depths.
IF you do go that route, go for artificer's intuition since you can grab explosives to deal with bridge, needle and blood . and even then, for the love of god, run some creatures / jace / ttezzeret.
You go crush the format dude. Omniscience is faster, Sneak Attack kills you, TES and other storm variants are faster, belcher is faster elves is faster, blade decks destroy you, miracle decks destroy you, deathrite shaman decks run a playset of wastelands always, RUG runs stifle and wasteland and submerge (since you run crap rotation), death&taxes runs plowshares, karakas, mangara and mom+flyer, maverick runs wastelands, maze of ith, their own dark depths, swords to plowshares, karakas and knight of the reliquary / weathered wayfarer, pox runs sinkhole, smallpox, wasteland so you won't even get up to the mana to activate your thespian stage even if you do get to keep your combo painter decks run blood moon or ensnaring bridge. I can go on for ever. Even fucking enchantress runs spreading seas / elephant grass / solitary confinement / humility. A dedicated marit lage deck didnt even work in extended, they played thopter foundry next to it.
Last edited by bruizar; 06-02-2013 at 05:43 AM.
While I agree that a dedicated Depths/Stage deck is not the best use of this combo, I really don't think a dedicated deck will be as bad as you think it is, bruizar. How easy is it to deal with a one turn clock, really? Even if the opponent runs Swords or something, he HAS to have it when you make the token while you have no protection. It's also much harder to deal with EOT, and even worse if you can pull off the combo more than once after it's been answered. I'm sure you're aware that Vault Key is still a really ubiquitous combo in Vintage, even with all the maindeck Grudges, Repeals, Decays, and other hate cards. Even if you were right, and it ended up being a terrible and eventually unplayable concept, I'd rather have people be encouraged to find the best build of this deck ASAP.
It's good that you refer to vintage because I think that this will indeed be played like time vault / voltaic key. In vintage, you do not have dedicated vault key decks (probably because you would end up decking yourself and because it is restricted, but still). You see vault/key played ALONGSIDE other win conditions such as Jace and dark confidant. Vaultkey gets shoved into most of the decks that can support it because its only 2 cards and you are running tinker / demonic tutor / vampiric tutor anyway.
My stance is that I think it is best when put in existing decks, such as 43-lands, a deck using artificer's intuition, turbo eldrazi, maverick, or a deck using intuition + loam. I do encourage people to search for the best dedicated deck, I'm simply trying to address the pitfalls that people must take into account because otherwise the attempt will needlessly fail.
In many cases, Dark Depths works like high tide in that it HAS to wait for its land drops (nonbasics instead of basics though). That is a serious drawback that people must consider since this means you will never have a faster goldfish than some of the more streamlined combo decks. The combo approach is therefore, by definition either subpar compared to belcher/tendrils based decks, or it is in fact, combo/control.
edit: I'm not hating on the combo. I actually have a vested interest in the performance of the card since I have a stack of foil dark depths here. I'll be testing dark depths out in MUD myself, hopefully to good results.
Did any of you thought about tha fact, that Marit Lage can be blocked by flying creatures? Lingering Souls, Bitterblossom, Flyer with Volrath's Stronghold. Good Luck attacking 20 Turns while your opponent draws live cards, while you keep drawing obsolete combo pieces.
No. You're the actual only first one ever. It also dies to StP and, clearly I'm the only one who thought of that, and that makes decks bad. Glad we had this discussion.
Why post on a deck forum just to troll. Let people discuss a deck of their interest... go away.
I am experimenting with the combo in a BG pox-list.
The list isn't focused on establishing the combo as fast as possible, but plays the slow disruptive game of a poxdeck, with the combo as a killcondition.
The list keeps cursed scroll and nether spirit, as alternate killconditions.
So far I like it very much because:
- pox is a very disruptive shell, that protects the combo.
- it already runs life from the loam to recur wasteland and your own smallpoxed lands
- it already has a focus on lands (manlands, wasteland, sometimes tabernacle, bojuka bog, cabal pit, ...) as these are cards that break the symmetry of (small)pox through life from the loam, and tutorpieces like crop rotation become multifunctional in this deck.
- the other way around, pox makes good use of the combo. In a poxdeck there is little room for finishers (usually nether spirit, the rack, cursed scroll or mishra's factory), and often these are insufficient to win the game, after heavily disrupring the opponent. The combo improves this.
This is the list im testing:
4 wasteland
2 dark depths
2 thespian's stage
3 urborg, tomb of yawgmoth
4 bayou
4 verdant catacombs
2 bloodstained mire
1 cabal pit
4 swamp
2 crop rotation
2 thoughtseize
4 inquisition of kozilek
4 innocent blood
2 dismember
2 sensei's divining top
2 cursed scroll
2 life from the loam
4 smallpox
4 abrupt decay
2 hymn to tourach
3 liliana of the veil
1 nether spirit
Sideboard:
4 cabal therapy
1 dryad Arbor
2 surgical extraction
2 extirpate
1 bojuka bog
2 maelstrom pulse
2 pernicious deed
1 night of souls betrayal
Dark Depths and Thespian's Stage have taken the place of 4x mishra's factory.
So far, the list has performed quite good.
The intention is to disrupt the opponent until you are in topdeck mode, where you take control with Liliana of the Veil or Sensei's divining top, or to combo out. It performs very well against decks that run around 16 creatures, as it runs enough creaturekill to reliably kill everything that's played (Aggro BUG, Jund, RUG). The combo improves the matchup against combodecks, as you have a fast way to kill before they combo off.
It performs less against decks with many creatures like goblins or Maverick, of decks with card advantage (like shardless BUG).
I haven't tested against stoneblade or UW Miracle.
I did encounter problems with cards that are played mainboard and weren't mentioned in this thread I think:
Jace the Mindsculptor and Liliana of the Veil.
They are problematic because they can bounce or sac the combo turn after turn, and this deck isn't geared towards removing them (especially Jace, since he's decay-proof). Maelstrom pulse is in the sideboard to help this problem a bit.
@Ingo T
Use Sage at end of turn to generate token all plainwalkers can be used only on sorcery speed..- problem resolved.
So simple, I should have thought of it myself... thanx
sorry guys, but vesuva in't a good replacement/abbianation to thespian stage?? ETB triggers and no mana is wasted in combo, delicious with crop rotation! did i miss something'?
Vesuva would enter the battlefield with the 10 counters on it, it doesn't work.
Hahaha... I mean, this post is probably banworthy and not productive and all that, but it made me laugh anyway. Shine on, you crazy, soon-to-be-banned diamond.
I'm starting to think this is a side-plan in another deck rather than a combo to dedicate your deck to as well. It's not so much that it Dies To Removal(TM), it's just that most decks will have an out because it's vulnerable to a wide range of things. You can't rely on steamrolling certain decks like Charbelcher or Omnitell can. However, this is a fantastic "oops I win" in a deck that is doing something else until the shields go down and you are able to combo out.
after goldfishing some of the options and playing against some other decks, depths needs to be placed in a very controled deck such as landstill or counterbalance since they are the most "controlling" decks that exist.
Play 4 Card Blind!
Currently Playing
Legacy: Dark Depths
EDH: 5-Color Hermit Druid
Currently Brewing: [Deck] Sadistic Sacrament / Chalice NO Eldrazi
why cards are so expensive...hoarders
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