Hello,
yes Rug Delver is a even matchup i feel. The matchups i mostly had problems with is merfolk, tin fins and elves. Especially tin fins is a deck i don't have an answer for... except of Mindbreak Trap. I also thought of putting 4 surgical extraction in maindeck since cards like Wasteland and FoW are such a mess vs 12post. Your thoughts on SE?
Edit: Also i would like some links to coverage of 12Post since i hardly find some myself. I watched some Murata, Rudolph and that guy in providence games but otherwise I can't find.
Pretty sure Abrupt Decay is the go-to card for the sb. Just fixing the rest of the deck to work well with the jostled mana.
Read the thread. We talk plenty about surgical.Originally Posted by losernoob
Thanks for the answers. Abrupt Decay for what specific card? And the black mana = Bojuka? Or will the deck change the manabase? I also ordered 2 x Drop of honey, 3 mindbreak trap and 2 crucible of worlds, partly sideboard and partly main. I know this has been discussed before but times change and thats why the answers from a year ago maybe wouldn't be the same today. Btw. sorry for my english i am not native american or englishman.
Bojuka Bog is mainly used for its Enter the Battlefield effect. Having it main-deck completely hoses Dredge.
Rock Lee is actually in the middle of testing a new build in order to combat his local metagame. Abrupt Decay might have been a catch-all solution to the deck's problem cards, but I'm not entirely sure yet until we see his latest list.
Hi there,
i've been playing with this deck for months lately and i think if you keep going on testing with this, you'll resolve most of the problems you're talking about. RUG is a tough deck, but the secret to beat it soundly is to constantly deploy your resources (lands) while doing almost nothing. That deck preys on early plays since it's filled with dazes and spell pierces, which will become more and more useless as long as you can keep the game going on. Remember to always use your maps and fetches when they are tapped out OR (if you can't) during their upkeep, in hope to slow them playing their threats. I found bojuka very helpful here shrinking mongooses and tarmogoyfs (remember you can copy it with Vesuva if needed). Your strongest play is always Show and Tell, just consider that a good RUG player will side Submerge against you, keep it in mind before fetching for a worthless tropical instead of a basic island.
Against tin fins, pithing needle is your best maindeck answer if you run it, just naming Griselbrand almost kills their deck. Also, crop rotating into Bojuka bog in response to a reanimate effect often is a huge blowout for them. Post-sb, obviously bring all the combo hate you can (i personally side out show and tell because i don't want to see them dropping their big demon for free).
About elves, i really don't think the actual builds are a big issue for turbo eldrazi. There was a time when they played Emrakul at the top of the curve, but now most players prefere the more castable and Natural Order tutorable Craterhoof Behemoth, which absolutely does nothing against a well-timed Crop Rotation into Glacial Chasm. They run no wastelands at all and little to no disruption, so keeping hands with a couple of lands and a Crop Rotation is often enough to guarantee you the victory. Post-sb, bring in your combo hate, even Flusterstorms, because forcing them to pay 2 additional mana for their Glimpse of Nature is often enough to shrink their combo.
Thanks for the advice its really helping me since i am a pretty new player to this game. In the last match vs elves I did exactly what u said rotating a chasm when that behemoth came but sacrificing 2 lands is pretty much i feel. I managed to show and tell Kozilek when i had to sac chasm due to lifeproblems and when i attacked he still had like 5 creatures left :D
I'm not sure if I keep needle in deck since Lee also has not a single one in his list on the front. But testing all kind of possible builds will do the best in my situation i guess... As I said i am very new, just TF seemed to me like unbeatable but yeah that move with crop - bog will solve some of the problems.
List I've been testing. I'll have more feedback after my weekly playtest tournament on Tuesday. If your meta has Dredge-galore, which mine does not, maindeck the bog, and SB a 3rd Show & Tell. I personally feel that MD bog is a mistake in the current global meta, so keep that in mind. I would personally consider Bog on the main not as a substitute for one of the 26 lands, but rather as one of your utility slots (repeal, Show & tell, venser, glen elendra).
// Lands
4 [MR] Cloudpost
1 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
4 [TSP] Vesuva
4 [SOM] Glimmerpost
4 [R] Tropical Island
1 [M12] Island (4)
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [IA] Glacial Chasm
4 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
1 [U] Underground Sea
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
// Creatures
4 [M12] Primeval Titan
1 [ROE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 [ROE] Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 [ROE] Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
3 [FUT] Venser, Shaper Savant
2 [EVE] Glen Elendra Archmage
// Spells
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [UL] Crop Rotation
3 [ZEN] Expedition Map
4 [IA] Brainstorm
2 [ME4] Candelabra of Tawnos
3 [GP] Repeal
2 [US] Show and Tell
// Sideboard
SB: 3 [CMD] Flusterstorm
SB: 4 [ZEN] Mindbreak Trap
SB: 1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
SB: 3 [ME] Force of Will
SB: 4 [RTR] Abrupt Decay
Last edited by Rock Lee; 07-15-2013 at 02:38 PM.
Rock, how does your recent list fare against delvers since it's lacking the tools that made these matchups rather easy? Mainly the last Repeal, Show and Tells and mass removal.
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This is why Abrupt Decay is in the SB.
The only non-abrupt decay-able creature they have can be bogged into oblivion.
Last edited by Rock Lee; 07-17-2013 at 02:26 PM.
Interesting list! But why did you take out Tabernacle? I think that is the first list I have seen that has no Tabernacle in it.
I'm guessing here, but it's a meta call for Rock - if there's no Storm/Belcher, and everything's Midrange, then I'm pretty sure that Tabernacle isn't the best call.
What this guy said. Additionally, abrupt decay helps with the only swarm aggro deck that gets hurt by tabernacle, that being goblins. With the heavy anti-storm cards in the SB and maindeck x5 endgame multi-counters, the storm matchup becomes less dangerous by far. You can still keep in chasm if you fear empty the warrens vs storm, and of course you keep it in against belcher.
Went 12-4 at the SCG invitational with Eldrazi being my legacy choice. 6-2 in standard and 6-2 in legacy. Losses were to esper and bug both having absurd draws.
I ended up in 12th as one of the possible X-4's that had a chance to get in to top 8. Still walked away with 1,000$, more than a SCG Open top 4. The deck shows its merit yet again. Used the aforementioned list. Trying something different for today's Open.
My favorite part of SCG invitationals are the many artists they have on-site. 6 artists to do alterations is fantastic. After this I will have all-modded creatures and I'm starting my mana base. Exciting!
What were your match ups and the decklist? :)
We're having another major tournament coming this August 4. As of the moment 12 post is shelved because of the meta.
In the invitational I beat Ichorid, Shardless, Shardless, Esper, Zoo/burn, Affinity. Lost to Esper, BUG.
I'm tuning my sideboard for the Minneapolis Open this weekend, and I think I need two slots for the Show & Tell matchup. I'm running my mono green build that did well at a 120-man side event in Vegas (the list is a few pages back on my tournament report). Right now, I'm debating between (a) Primeval Titan x2 (b) Spine of Ish Sah x2 or (c) 1x of each.
Spine of Ish Sah is obviously better against an Omniscience. I already bring K-Grips in, but they can cast Emrakul before I get priority to use it, unlike Spine. Spine, however, is very narrow. I can't think of another matchup I'd bring it in aside from Miracles, which is already an auto-win.
Primeval Titan grabs Karakas, then poses a huge threat. I can also bring it in for dead cards in more matchups, although making GG early is still often rough unless I have a Candelabra out. The biggest downside, of course, is that it does nothing vs Omniscience.
Right now, I'm leaning towards the 1/1 split to hedge my bets. But maybe I'm better off going all in vs one SnT archetype or the other (Titan for Sneak & Show, Spine for OmniTell). Thoughts?
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Nice! We will be waiting for your report :) I wish we have those big ass events here in the Philippines. 1,000 USD wow!
I likely won't write a report for the invitational. The whole event is a blur to me. I remember the games I lost, but if you asked me to recount 16 rounds a week ago on memory, even I'm not that good.
In other news though, I won my weekly 5$ entry event with a prize of 150$ yesterday. Huzzah!
Here's the list I ran:
// Lands
4 [MR] Cloudpost
1 [WWK] Eye of Ugin
4 [TSP] Vesuva
4 [SOM] Glimmerpost
4 [R] Tropical Island
1 [LG] Karakas
1 [IA] Glacial Chasm
1 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
1 [WWK] Bojuka Bog
2 [ON] Polluted Delta
2 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 [RTR] Island (4)
// Creatures
4 [M12] Primeval Titan
1 [ROE] Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 [ROE] Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1 [ROE] Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
3 [FUT] Venser, Shaper Savant
2 [ZEN] Oracle of Mul Daya
// Spells
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [UL] Crop Rotation
3 [ZEN] Expedition Map
4 [IA] Brainstorm
2 [ME4] Candelabra of Tawnos
3 [GP] Repeal
2 [US] Show and Tell
// Sideboard
SB: 2 [US] Show and Tell
SB: 4 [CMD] Flusterstorm
SB: 4 [ZEN] Mindbreak Trap
SB: 3 [ME] Force of Will
SB: 2 [CMD] Oblivion Stone
I have since changed it "of course," but not significantly. I like oracle right now. Gives you that appropriate rebound effect, dodges most forms of removal in the matchups you care about, or in the very least with proper setup, gets you two lands deeper. My SB change was -1 Show & Tell, 1+ Venser, Shaper Savant. I love Venser. I want his planeswalker babies.
::EDIT:: I also am currently doing testing/math/logic behind a 61 card maindeck and a 14 card sideboard.
Last edited by Rock Lee; 07-31-2013 at 02:29 PM.
So did Abrupt Decay not stick or is your local meta significantly different enough from Star City Games Opens to not warrant its use for this tournament? Regardless, congratulations on the win!
Also, I assume the logic for a 61/14 split is so that you could go to a 60/15 split game 2 & 3, but generally what would you pull from the main board that you couldn't just replace with something from the sideboard, and why not just aim for the reverse with game one have 60/15 and then go 61/14 games 2 & 3?
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