[Primer] Elves!

[Dice_Box]

Yea, I see the point. Might go down the Warcaller rote, want to test that.

Edit:
Is it just me, or does it feel like the changes in Meta over the past few months make this a harder deck to pilot? I am not saying it is not strong, just the increase in burn and discard has made this a deck that can be a challenge against a larger part of the Meta than it use to be.

Warcaller isn't GSZ'able. Or, well, it is, but it doesn't do any tasty pumping action without being hardcast.

Arr shit...

[Zombie]

Warcaller isn't GSZ'able. Or, well, it is, but it doesn't do any tasty pumping action without being hardcast.

[Lemnear]

Warcaller wasn't considered as a GSZ target by me tbh just as a SB 2-off if your meta demands. I doubt there is a economic way to battle Forked Bot and Punishing Fire with Elves aside Ooze

@meta:
It's no surprise the the meta finally adapts to the DRS-menace and starts playing more and more sweepers.



A lil update to the Miracles-Matchup:
Enjoyed blowing out one opponent with Realm Razer ;)

[Dice_Box]

Razer is fun, I forget you mentioned it to me, I think back in the old thread. With two Lands decks locally I run it sometimes just for the fun of it. If he had more defence I would run him more, but he is still fun to troll with. Just a pity he dies to Punishing Fire.

[Lemnear]

Trolling peeps with wacky cards is part of my local madness (aka SB flex-slots). Everyone leaves with a laugh and a Story to tell how their 1600$ miracles deck with T1 Top, T2 Counterbalance got blown by Realm Razer ;)

[Kayradis]

Im away from the internets for a couple hours and the whole thread goes to shit.

Damn.

haha.

Played yesterday to a 1-2 record. I really really really really like 2 Thorn/1 Thalia in the board. Didn't play against RUG so didn't board in the Meekstone.

I believe that the 2 Hoofs/1 Hoof + 1 Regal is up to the player's preference. I understand that we all work towards fine tuning the deck and we all believe in a better world where everybody loves each other, rainbows and shit. But goddamn guys. I understand that we can all be sometime Thruns (the last troll....see the pun there?) but post count is somewhat irrelevant at this point. I believe that this thread is fuelled by good elves players that all look forward to achieving new levels of awesomeness with the deck.

@Chrandersen:
I'm slowly falling towards bringing back force. I've played for a couple weeks with variations of 2 Hoofs, 1 Hoof - 1 Ruric Thar, 1 Hoof - 1 Ezuri, 1 Hoof - 1 Force, ect... and I'm well aware that the deck main goal is to Hoof stomp people as early as possible. Unfortunately, the worldwide meta is adapting to our green shenanigans and a lategame draw option (AKA R.Force) is getting more and more attractive. My meta here knows me for insane glimpse chain and stupid DRS Untap interactions. Im expecting a LOT of removal in the majority of the fair decks (yesterday a guy boarded in 6-8 mass removal [pyroclasm and friends] against me). That's a lot of fucking hate. Regal is resilient to bolt, make you gain stupid amount of life if Sworded, is a m*therf*cking wall against anything that is scary in legacy (Batterskull anyone?) and once the EtB trigger resolves, he's done all that we expected of him.


I was running 18 lands yesterday. I never been that flooded with the deck in my entire life.
Going back to 17 and bringing back 1 Multani's Acolyte. I love that card as a 1 of so much and now I miss it. Might even go to 2 of it.

Ill take notes and let you know.
60 people tournament tomorrow.
Gonna hoof people with a SWEEEEEEEEEEEEET MTGTHESOURCE.COM playmat!

-Gabe

[Lemnear]

Gabe, Regal Force doesn't solve the problem of getting your doods burned and therefore only drawing 2-3 cards. I'll rather push into the red-zone with a 8/8 haste or run Progenitus as NO-target if burn goes rampant in my meta

[Kayradis]

The thing is, our main way to put Hoofy-Doofy into play is NO.
The problem is, all our guys are dead and if that happens, our mana-producing engine OR the sac cost for NO can't be done.

So hardcast is out of the equation.

Im still toying with ideas.
Im spending too much time working in a military think-tank.
I'm debating getting a work group on that.
Dunno if its gonna get approved.

[th3 w1z4rd]

Warcaller isn't GSZ'able. Or, well, it is, but it doesn't do any tasty pumping action without being hardcast.

Wirewood Symbiote. :D

[Lemnear]

Wirewood Symbiote. :D

Tbh, the same can be said for Ezuri, but I'm sure we set sail to cute-pony-island somewhere

[Kayradis]

One day, in the wonderful world of MtG being owned by Hasbro, the My Little Pony franchise will do a cross over.

My expectations? Within 5 years we will have a My Little Pony block.
Just sayin.

[Lemnear]

One day, in the wonderful world of MtG being owned by Hasbro, the My Little Pony franchise will do a cross over.

My expectations? Within 5 years we will have a My Little Pony block.
Just sayin.

Right over my cold, dead body...




Ok, lets cut that crap...

[Kayradis]

That just went way too far...

Back to our little green dorks.

[Koby]

After thinking about the list I played last weekend, and the discussion over the last few pages I'm going to make changes to my list:

-1 Land to 17 lands (Agree with Kayradis and have also argued less lands is better)
-1 Craterhoof Behemoth
+1 Regal Force
+1 Elvish Archdruid (as team pump to help the man plan, and as a psuedo Cradle elf)

As for the argument that Hoof is better than Regal Force when Hoof is not lethal - it has no difference. In one aspect you're just attacking them down to low single digits. In the other, you're reloading your hand with tons of gas. Which would you rather have against a "land, Wrath you" plan which is being argued?

[nudon]

After thinking about the list I played last weekend, and the discussion over the last few pages I'm going to make changes to my list:

-1 Land to 17 lands (Agree with Kayradis and have also argued less lands is better)
-1 Craterhoof Behemoth
+1 Regal Force
+1 Elvish Archdruid (as team pump to help the man plan, and as a psuedo Cradle elf)

As for the argument that Hoof is better than Regal Force when Hoof is not lethal - it has no difference. In one aspect you're just attacking them down to low single digits. In the other, you're reloading your hand with tons of gas. Which would you rather have against a "land, Wrath you" plan which is being argued?

Koby, I was curious about how the slight differences in your deck performed at the event. Did the single llanowar pull its weight or do you think you'll eventually try to increase the birchlore count? Also, did you ever run into problems with wasteland by having only 1 bayou? I was thinking about dropping the second one to increase the number of fetches. As for the number of lands in the deck, I don't think it matters too much since it seems all of us are having success with 17-19 lands. Play-style and mulligan decisions factor more into this than probably given credit for.

[Koby]

Koby, I was curious about how the slight differences in your deck performed at the event. Did the single llanowar pull its weight or do you think you'll eventually try to increase the birchlore count? Also, did you ever run into problems with wasteland by having only 1 bayou? I was thinking about dropping the second one to increase the number of fetches. As for the number of lands in the deck, I don't think it matters too much since it seems all of us are having success with 17-19 lands. Play-style and mulligan decisions factor more into this than probably given credit for.

The singular Llanowar performed well the few times I opened with it. The Birchlore Rangers performed fine the few times I needed to use them to produce mana. I only ran 2 Birchlores and never felt like I wanted more while playing.

On the mana base:
I had a few unfortunate mulligans with no usable lands throughout the tournament. That's unavoidable with the configuration we're running (and I calculated a while back). It should occur about 15-20% of the time. Beyond that, I liked the 2 Forest 1 Bayou 1 Savannah configuration in practice. If I felt that in a given matchup I would be Wastelanded, I would fetch basic Forest. Bayou only really matters when you need to start using DRS every turn. It does slow you down a bit when you have multiple DRS out and draining life, but that seems to be a "first world problem" type where the game is stalled against a deck without Wastelands and your only recourse is to drain. Actively using Quirion Ranger/DRS on your turn then untap and reset for their turn seems to work just fine.

I definitely felt flooded most of the day with 18 lands. I also don't like having such a big reliance on 1 Dryad Arbor to get a turn 1 mana dork out. I may bump up Llanowar Elves to two in the deck, likely flexing Crop Rotation out of the deck again.

Like I've stated many times before, the core is solid and we're just tuning the last 5 or so slots for taste/metagame consideration. I certainly don't fault anyone for having good reasons for running more land, less Craterhoofs, more Birchlores, or extra utility elves/Regal Force.

[Lord_of_Rivendell]

@Lord_of_Rivendell - You aren't going to like this, but if Miracles is a huge meta presence for you, you might wanna move into Jund or BUG Control. If you just wanna beat it the times you see it once in awhile, then okay. We can talk about that. But if you will have to face it regularly and need a plan to beat it on a consistent basis, then you actually just want a whole new deck.

You're right . . . I don't like it. The truth sometimes hurts. But, with a sense of tenacity in the air, I like playing elves. And I like our deck. So, I trying to think of solutions, even if they are modest. I'm wondering if buying ourselves a little more time is a useful edge on Miracles. Specifically, I'm thinking of adding 3 Winter Orb to the sideboard. I've always been a big fan of the elf lock with Winter Orb and Mishra's Helix, but think the Helix is just too slow here. But a turn 2 or 3 WOrb will give us a few extra turns to go off, or so it seems.

[Dice_Box]

Root Maze can help that lock if you are not looking to overload on Fetches. Sometimes, if you must, moving back to a Mono green build might work out in your favor.

[danyul]

You're right . . . I don't like it. The truth sometimes hurts. But, with a sense of tenacity in the air, I like playing elves. And I like our deck. So, I trying to think of solutions, even if they are modest. I'm wondering if buying ourselves a little more time is a useful edge on Miracles. Specifically, I'm thinking of adding 3 Winter Orb to the sideboard. I've always been a big fan of the elf lock with Winter Orb and Mishra's Helix, but think the Helix is just too slow here. But a turn 2 or 3 WOrb will give us a few extra turns to go off, or so it seems.

I have also considered Winter Orb in the SB for this matchup. It helps against a few other matchups as well. I have yet to test it though. Let us know how it goes.

Oh, and I also picked up a few copies of Gloom with the intention of testing them against Miracles. You could give that a spin too.

[Kayradis]

Alright.
Tournament is firing in 4 hours approx.
Last minute(hours?) change

-17 Lands
-1 Hoof/1 Regal/1 Ruric Thar MB as NO Targets
-Running 4 Visionaries and 1 Multani's Acolyte.
Let's crush.