I agree. Im just toying with ideas. At some point I'm sure that my designs will not even be 4 Color loam variants anymore. Such a blurred line between Lands and a 4 Color Loam deck I suppose
Originally Posted by Richard Cheese
There's some interesting Punishing Fire/Young Pyromancer brewing over in Developing: http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...romancer/page4. I think that sort of idea might be along the lines of what you're toying with?
Went 1-2 tonight. Had a lot of fun though! Man legacy and this deck are both great. I probably should've been 2-1, but my death and taxes opponent had an early batterskull and he had a third port for my maze. I played my normal list except a scavenging ooze over the second goyf, toxic deluge in the board over perish, and 2 golgari charm over teeg and the side board decay. Deluge was really really good. After devastating my MUD OPPONENT for all of his lands he still hard cast a blightsteel and equipped greaves forcing me to chump with Kotr. I ripped a land and deluged for 11 to kill the blightsteel. Then game two he got chalice for 2 but I won with KOTR and a pile of bear tokens from grizzly gate which I boarded in over chalice. Lol.
I hope you got to Flashback that Grizzly Fate.
Unfortunately no :/ the bears killed him haha. I also played against tyrio on 43 lands. He ended up getting stage depths game one after I slaughter games his loam, and he finds tolaria west. I don't find any waste to interact. Game two he gets a ghost quarter lock on me and I scoop. Grizzly is my for fun local wish target. Probably like almost strictly worse than Wurm Harvest in most cases.
Do you agree with this board plan vs the MUD deck?
-4 Chalice of the Void
+1 Grizzly Fate
+1 Slaughter Games
+1 Dreadbore
+1 Devastating Dreams
I figured chalice is actually just a dead card vs him. Then I also figured I wanted my Hull Breach to actually wish for along with Loam, chainers, and deluge, so I brought in wish targets that are not dead, but ones that I wouldnt want to spend a turn wishing for. (note: at SCG ATL the Grizzly Fate was a Maelstrom Pulse).
If I'm playing Metalworker I'm bringing in Crypt against you or Crucibles to prevent you from Strip locking me. I may also take Trinisphere out against your deck also, especially on the draw. I'm not sure what Slaughter Games is good for, are you randomly naming his best man? E.g. Wurmcoil Engine or Steel Hellkite?
So you think keeping in Chalice to put it on 1 would have been better? I guess I didnt post anything about it, but after I Deluged His Blightsteel Away in G1 he slams a Metalworker and staff of domination and kills me. So I guess I was hoping to slaughtergames his Metalworker or something. He did bring in crypt but it didnt hurt me too badly. My natural reaction is to bring out chalices vs another chalice deck. And the only other options that I could think of were Thalia's because reverent silence, Golgari Charms, and Massacre seem terrible. Thalia I didnt want to bring in however because if he gets a lodestone after I make a Thalia, I might just lock myself out of the game. Which is why I brought in the 4 wish targets that I didnt think would be worth my time wishing for, but weren't completely dead. I mean I definitely might be wrong. That was just my thought process. It is just super awkward when boarding with the deck a lot of the time.
Hi :)
I played the 4 color loam deck that played jeff hoogland in the past, but with changes... but with the actually metagame I think that is not the great deck to play with a lot of nemesis and show decks.
I'm testing this list for GP paris:
1 marsh flats
4 verdant catacombs
2 bayou
2 scrubland
2 savannah
1 forest
1 swamp
2 tranquil thicket
2 barren moor
1 karakas
1 maze of ith
1 horizon canopy
1 treetop village
4 wasteland
3 dark confidant
3 knight of the reliquary
1 gaddock teeg
3 deathrite shaman
2 liliana of the veil
2 sylvan library
4 mox diamond
4 chalice of the void
3 abrupt decay
4 hymn to tourach
3 life from the loam
1 green sun’s zenith
2 engineered explosives
SIDEBOARD
4 ethersworn canonist
3 oblivion ring
2 thoughtseize
1 gaddock teeg
1 scavenging ooze
1 abrupt decay
2 golgari charm
1 maelstrom pulse
This list is similar to the 4 color loam, but is only 3 color loam (red is not good color to kill TNN) and I change:
· burning wishes for hymn to tourach (hymn on turn 1 is not bad, and discard for combo can do that we win more than burning wish)
· devastating dreams for engineered explosives (engineered is more versatile because we can cast that from 1 to 5 with the moxes, and we can destroy batterskull or jace with that! And explosives destroy TNN, devastating dreams is not good to kill TNN).
·punishing fire for deathrite shaman. Deathrite shaman is so good when we are playing with dredge and reanimator, remove the cards in the graveyards can do the tarmogoyf a small creature and the objectives of the snapcaster mage, in addition we can win time with TNN with the 2 lifes that can we win. And we can cast that with chalice of the void in play with the green sun's zenith.
2 grove of the burnwillows for 1 horizon canopy and 1 abrupt decay. Horizon canopy with loam is another land to draw extra cards, and we can find that with the Knight of the reliquary. The third abrupt decay is in main because we not play punishing fire and we need cards to destroy creatures (deathrite, delver, tarmo...) and other cards (sylvan library, liliana, jitte...)
The sideboard is focused to combo decks, because we have 4 ethersworn canonist, 2 thoughtseize, 1 more gaddock and 3 oblivion ring(show decks), that with cards in main I think that we can win combo decks.
Abrupt decay and maelstrom pulse are to kill creatures and cards in second and third games that we need destroy.
Golgari charm is another card to kill TNN, and is so good with elves, death and taxes, goblins...
scavenging ooze I don't know if is good or not. I'm thinking from this card xD.
What are you think about the deck? You think that can be competitive deck in gp paris? Or you would do changes in the list?
Please I need help with ideas and comments to improve the deck :D
Playing one drops in your Chalice of the Void deck is going to get you a bad time - regardless of how good DRS is.
~Jeff
I know that drs with chalice of the void is not the best, but not always we hace the chalice of the void in play. Drs is good t1 if we have not mox diamond+2 lands to play costs 2 and we can cast costs 3 in turn 2 or cost 2 and cycle.In addition, we can cast the drs with the green suns zenith with chalice in play.
Is the best cost1 that we can put, because the other option that I think is stp but is the worst with chalice.
Eh. I'd rather either be all in on chalice, or not. Like either play chalice with no 2 drops, or dont play chalice and play DRS and Thoughtseize as your disruption. I do agree however that the deck is not particularly amazing right now which is why I have not been playing it. Sneak attack is difficult to impossible to beat, I still have trouble with D&T if they have early batterskull or something, and TNN proved to be difficult to deal with since our big sweeper in the deck was damage based. Couple all of that with people in my local meta still running GY hate out the ass and yuck.
Disagree that Sneak and Show/D&T are bad match ups.
TNN puts too much stress on Burning Wish though.
I agree at least on the D&T portion. That isn't actually a bad MU, but I do have a lot of games where they just have a ton of mana denial and I never got to hit lands drops and died to Thalia or something. I dont think it is that bad of a MU, especially since Massacre was added to the wish board. As for SnS, show and tell isn't an issue. It is the quick sneak attack hands that really give me fits. Of course chalice can prevent them from sculpting their hand, but sometimes they just have it. Maybe my opponents are just luckier than I.
Sneak attack is not the worst MU from the deck, because karakas is good :) And if we can stopped 1 turn, we have the option to destroy the sneak. Omnitell decks are more difficult to win xD
Death and taxes, with devastating dreams, punishing fire, abrupt decay, massacre and toxic deluge is easy to win... I never lose with D&T deck.
TNN in decks that not play white... is more difficult.. because we need cast the massacre for 4 lands and it's not good. For this reason I have put the liliana's of the veil and the engineered explosives to kill that, because devastating dreams not kill TNN.
Would you do changes on my list? It's good idea remove red?
What do you think from my decklist?
Im still playing loam, but I made a lot of changes since TNN realese
Creatures
4 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Countryside Crusher
3 Dark Confidant
1 Scavenging Ooze
Spells
3 Life from the Loam
4 Burning Wish
2 Seismic Assault
1 Green Sun's Zenith
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Punishing Fire
1 Golgari Charm
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Mox Diamond
Lands
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Forest
2 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Fire-lit Thicket
2 Taiga
1 Badlands
1 Plateau
1 Savannah
1 Bayou
4 Wastelands
3 Tranquil Thicket
2 Forgotten Cave
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Skarrg, the Rage Pit
1 Karakas
SB
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Thoughtseize
1 Life from the Loam
1 Devastating Dreams
1 Massacre
1 Chainer's Edict
1 Hull Breach
1 Silence Reverence
2 Golgari Charm
Im still testing this version, but it has shown good results. Crusher + KOTR represents a huge pressure on the board. Skarrg let me to get over the little annoying TNN and Mother of Runes. Devastating dreams has turned bad lately with all UW TNN-blades... but golgari charm does a pretty good job in this MU.
Why not Wolf Run?
Since im running seismic assault, keeping lands in my hand is better than placing them into the field. But both options are good enough.
This is my version of Aggro Loam:
Lands:
2x Taiga
1x Forest
4x Wasteland
1x Mountain
2x Badlands
1x Savannah
2x Windswept Heath
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Plateau
1x Bojuka Bog
4x Wooded Foothills
1x Forgotten Cave
1x Volrath's Stronghold
3x Tranquil Thicket
1x Maze of Ith
Artefakte:
2x Engineered Explosives
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Mox Diamond
Creature:
4x Knight of the Reliquary
4x Countryside Crusher
4x Dark Confidant
Enchantment:
2x Seismic Assault
Instant:
3x Abrupt Decay
Socery:
3x Life from the Loam
4x Burning Wish
SB:
2x Leyline of the Void
1x Life From the Loam
1x Timely Reinforcements
1x Chainers's Edict
It is somthing between the Old School 3c (RGB) list and the 4c Knight Loam. I prefer to play Seismic Assault over Punishing Fire cause it can handle bigger Creatures and kill your opponent.
I play it at FNM and often go 2-1.
(sry for my bad English :P)
Been brewing a list for fun. I'll probably test it out on Wednesday.
Loam
4 Deathrite Shaman
3 Mox Diamond
4 Thoughtseize
3 Abrupt Decay
3 Life from the Loam
1 Dryad Arbor
2 Sylvan Library
3 Natural Order
1 Progenitus
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
2 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Eternal Witness
3 Knight of the reliquary
2 Darkblast
1 Unburial Rites
1 Crop Rotation
4 Wasteland
1 Maze of Ith
1 Thespian's Stage
1 Dark Depths
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
2 Bayou
1 Savannah
1 Scrubland
2 Forest
1 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Tranquil Thicket
1 Nantuko Monastery
I learned natural order is not that good without U... you will draw progenitus oftenly... scryb ranger could be good for depths stage combo
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