I've just picked up this deck, and have been going over the sideboard choices. I built my list referencing the discussion from this thread and the most recent Top 16 list (15th Place from SCG Providence)
I'm getting ready to take it to a local event next week, and I think I'm happy with most of my choices, except for one. The SCG list I linked plays a Bloodghast in the sideboard, which at first glance seems nice against removal heavy decks, but I've been thinking a Grave Titan might be a better fight for the slot. Am I missing anything with that assessment?
Originally Posted by GalacticHitchHiker
hi guys! Considering a list like the one linked here ^ , i'd ask to some of you what would be your side-in/side-out against these matchups:
- UW
- elves
- ant
- bant (nemesis)
- patriot (nemesis)
I'm asking this cause i was used to play with a list without Petals (and with more creatures, also 2x hapless researcher), and now i'm a bit disoriented in game 2 and 3 cause of sideboard choiches. Are Petals something to cut after side? or not?
Please i need some help on these points, expecially for reducing the testing time
Hello Pochy. I would side as following against elves:
-1 TS, -2 daze, -1 Animate dead for +2 City, +2 S&T
Reasoning behind this: Daze & TS loose value on the draw & they will probably bring in ooze & therapy or TS. Siding as such makes you less vulnerable to GYhate and speeds up your combo.
Against ANT: -2 daze, -1 Tidespout for +1 Duress, +1 FS, +1 Coffin Purge
Just my 5 cents
thanks for the suggestions guys :)
so i should never cuts petals?
so against UW, should i side in only inkwell? or maybe also other things? i think there would be some very powerful cards against UW (needle on karakas/sensei for example)
considering this as a sideboard example:
3 Pithing Needle
1 Inkwell Leviathan
1 Ashen Rider
1 Bloodghast
1 Coffin Purge
1 Echoing Truth
1 Flusterstorm
1 Wipe Away
1 Duress
2 Show and Tell
2 City of Traitors
If i watch to the macth, i can see Needle, leviathan, fluster, duress, show&tell very useful, but that wuold be a +8 cards, maybe to much for finding something to cut for them. Probably 4 daze, 1 elesh, 1 ponder, 1 exhume, and one more if we are on the draw? ... and if we are on the play?
thanks in advice
Re: Lotus Petal - The way I see it, since Reanimator is not a combo deck that wins immediately (vs say Storm or Omnitell), waiting longer generally does not help us. Lotus Petals speed us up and allow us to go off potentially on T1 or T2 with greater consistency, so I would never cut them.
Against UW, I would not bring in Pithing Needle. Generally, they're going to be only running Karakas as a 1-of, so it's not that likely they'll see it early enough to matter. More likely what you'll have to deal with is RIP, so bounce / Show & Tell needs to come in against them.
Speaking of Show & Tell, has anyone else been not very happy with it? I don't like how it pulls our deck in two opposite directions with Careful Study wanting us to dump creatures from our hands while S&T wants us to keep them in our hands.
@pochy: I second Esper3k statements.
@Esper3k: I felt the same about S&T and now it can be found only in my side as a 3-of. In this way it is less luckster because when I side them in I also side some careful study out.
Ignorance is strength
This is my exact thought of Show and Tell in the deck. I hate it in the main deck, I feel its presence in the deck forces you to make bad plays/keep bad hands. I think it's perfectly fine in games 2 and 3 because I generally am boarding out some amount of the graveyard part of the combo to fit in anti-hate and Show and Tells. But the existence of Deathrite Shaman sort of warrants it. Not only because it's graveyard hate on its own, but generally a deck with Deathrite Shaman can also threaten you with Abrupt Decay which essentially counters Animate Dead, which is what would replace Show and Tell in the main.
So I see us having two options, one is ignore Deathrite Shaman and Abrupt Decay, and play Animate Deads in the main again. This gives us the strongest possible maindeck configuration and we should be able to most other decks quite easily. I can see this being a real option going forward short term with Jund and Shardless BUG seeing less play. It all kind of depends on how much Deathblade resurges in the upcoming months.
The other option is just keep the Show and Tells in the main to play against maindeck hate. We have a slightly weaker deck, but a little more versatility and aren't automatically dead to an early Deathrite/Scavenging Ooze. I'm personally in favor with having the stronger main deck. The reason we play Lotus Petal is to speed the deck up, but what good is that if our deck is disjointed? It's not like we can't beat an active Deathrite anyway. It just takes a little sculpting. Ooze is much harder to beat, but luckily there are less decks playing it in the main right now and just as few Green Sun Zeniths.
I've personally been going back to testing Izzet Charm in place of the Show & Tells. I'm in love with the idea on paper, but am still trying to decide how I like it in practice.
As I see it:
Pros: all 3 modes are great for us
Cons: Weakens our manabase since it requires us to play red
Would you mind sharing your list? I'm curious to see what your mana base looks like. I've never tested with red due to my lack of red duals. But I don't hate the idea of Izzet Charm, mostly I just don't like that adding red doesn't do much outside of the charms though.
If you are playing red for Izzet Charm I think there is an interesting card to put in the side. I know it has been discussed here a long time ago, but the card flies under the radar again. I'm talking about stronghold gambit (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Ca...iverseid=21357) Has anyone ever played with this?
Current maindeck I'm fiddling around with:
// Lands
4 [B] Underground Sea
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [5E] Swamp (1)
1 [ZEN] Island (4a)
1 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
2 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [B] Volcanic Island
1 [R] Badlands
// Creatures
1 [ZEN] Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 [NPH] Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
4 [AVR] Griselbrand
1 [M11] Grave Titan
1 [NPH] Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
// Spells
4 [AL] Force of Will
4 [ARC] Reanimate
4 [5E] Brainstorm
4 [OD] Entomb
4 [BRB] Exhume
4 [OD] Careful Study
4 [V09] Lotus Petal
4 [DD2] Daze
2 [B] Animate Dead
2 [RTR] Izzet Charm
1 [M12] Ponder
A few notes:
1) After playing Reanimator for awhile, I found that I really hated Thoughtseize / Duress as a protection spell. My problem with it was that I was having too many games where I'd want to go off... but couldn't do it if I cast a Thoughtseize that turn. So, I'm playing around with a 4 Daze configuration. I even had a 1-of Misdirection at one point but with the point I'm going to make in part 2, I had to cut it.
2) With the Izzet Charms, that gives me 10 "dump something in the yard" spells, which made me want to up the Reanimation spells as well, thus the 2-of Animate Dead, giving me 10 of each. With the 6 Careful Study effects, I'm testing 8 fatties instead of the standard 7. I'd like to go up to 3 Izzet Charms, but I don't want to cut any Careful Study (because it's part of the key to going off on T1 or T2). I'd also love to fit a second Ponder in there (again, I used to have 2 in earlier lists I've been playing) and that second Animate Dead may eventually go back to becoming a Ponder.
This list aims to go off on T1 or T2 with either FoW or Daze as protection. Playing more Dazes also helps with the blue card count for FoW (which hurts when we're playing all these black reanimation spells on top of black hand disruption).
I have been fighting S&T for the longest time. I finally relented and put 1 in the main and 3 in the side, as a stubborn acceptance to all the lists running 2 and 2 having success at large events. And even in game 2 when all 4 are in, I feel no more capable than before. In game 1 i feel the surprise and speed is our main strength, and sacrificing that to counter hate is fine, but only as much as is required of us.
I tried a sideboard of bounce and discard to preempt or subvert the hate brought in against us, and feel like I had just as much success then as now. I can only conclude that I am a mediocre player and that S&T isn't as necessary as other would lead you to believe.
I think Stronghold Gambit is a very neat card, but not sure that it's good for Reanimator unless you're playing a super discard heavy list?
The only matchup I can really think of where I'd bring in Show & Tell is against Jund style decks where they don't really tax our manabase and don't really have countermagic (ie, their only real way to interact is through hand disruption & yard hate). Of course, Show & Tell does make their hand disruption and REBs better...
I see people having issues with deathrite shaman and the like,
I've always run a near similar sideboard which changed with the meta, however I prefered to use a well-timed entomb or chain of vapor to solve a lot of issues. ( same goes for discard and the other disruption you are running)
However there's 1 card that can be used against a multitude of annoying things:
Disfigure
It's cheap, on color, kills the majority of hatebears and most importantly instant speed.
For those of you cutting SnT from the maindeck for cards like Izzet charm, something I've been experimenting with and loving since GP Denver is Echoing Truth mainboard, It is not as obviously versatile as Izzet charm but it does keep our mana base stronger while dealing with troublesome non-creature, non-land permanents as well as token hoards.
I picked this deck up a few months ago and proceeded to 0-3 drop at Grand Prix DC.
Then I went home and practiced for a few weeks.
Tonight I won a 17 player local event and earned a minty Revised Bayou.
4 Polluted Delta
1 Flooded Strand
3 Scalding Tarn
1 Bloodstained Mire
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
1 Swamp
1 Island
3 Griselbrand
1 Grave Titan
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Tidespout Tyrant
1 Elesh-Norn, Grand Cenobite
4 Entomb
3 Thoughtseize
4 Brainstorm
1 Ponder
2 Izzet Charm
3 Careful Study
4 Force of Will
3 Daze
4 Lotus Petal
4 Reanimate
4 Exhume
2 Animate Dead
-side-
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Pithing Needle
2 Red Elemental Blast
2 Dark Ritual
1 Flusterstorm
4 Show and Tell
1 Massacre
1 Chancellor of the Annex
1 Inkwell Leviathan
I played against
Dredge - win
Elves - win
Jund - win
Pox - loss
UWR Delver - loss
UWR Delver - win
High Tide - win
Jund - win
Access to Izzet Charm and REB is powerful, but I'm still not sure if making the deck weaker to wastelands is worth it.
Grave Titan main was super impressive all day. 10 power across 3 bodies, only costing 6 mana (6 life for Reanimate) made it a real winner.
I also think Engineered Explosives is a must, and Chancellor of the Annex's pseudo-Daze ability won me 2 games.
Congratulations on the finish. Regarding your list: What conditions warrant bringing in the Dark Rituals? As well at the Chancellor. Having only a single Massacre and EE, relying on card filter to find them, how successful were you?
Thanks.
Hey guys,
I've been playing tin fins reanimator for awhile now, and after a few bad runs I'm thinking of switching to regular reanimator. Questions
1. What do you think makes normal reanimator more consistent then tin fins? Or do you think they are the same?
2. Against the tier decks now do you just get grizzelbees everytime or what matches still warrant Iyona? Death and Taxes?
3. I've been reading about the red splash. I like the idea of running basics. Lots of tempo in my area. How great is it?
Thanks for your time
Won the Dutch legacy nationals (89 people?) yesterday with Reanimator. Much of it can be attributed to my pairings though, Affinity, Goblins and triple Elves is somewhat unusual. I had not touched the deck before, and I'm sure my play was sloppy, but the deck certainly does some broken things.
My pairings:
Affinity 2-1 (lost a game to tezz ultimate which was fast enough because of a spell pierce)
Goblins 2-0
Death Blade 1-2 (seems like a fairly weak MU, this match did feel winnable though)
Elves 2-1 (lost a game to DRS)
Elves 2-1 (lost a game because of him playing ooze after I needled DRS, turned out he tapped non-elves for Heritage Druid though)
Elves 2-0
UWR ID
-
UWR 2-1 (lost g1, might have won if I had delayed all plays by a turn)
R Painter 2-0
Finals opponent had dropped (we split prices), would have been BUG or TES
My list:
4 Griselbrand
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Tidespout Tyrant
4 Force of Will
3 Thoughtseize
2 Daze
4 Brainstorm
4 Careful Study
3 Ponder
4 Entomb
4 Reanimate
3 Exhume
1 Animate Dead
2 Show and Tell
3 Lotus Petal
4 Polluted Delta
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Verdant Catacombs
4 Underground Sea
2 Island
2 Swamp
Sideboard
2 City of Traitors
2 Show and Tell
1 Ashen Rider
1 Blazing Archon
3 Pithing Needle
2 Echoing Truth
2 Flusterstorm
2 Duress
37th GP Ams'11 | 80th GP Stras '13 | 5th BoM Paris '13 | 12th GP Lille '15
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