[Deck] WUr Wafo/Cuneo Draw-Go Control

[Davran]

UBx Fae could be a thing. Turn 1 Thoughtseize, turn 2 Bitterblossom can be super annoying for us. We don't have any good answer to a resolved Bitterblossom maindeck, other than to hope we can burn them out due to their fetchland/shockland/Thoughtseize/Bitterblossom lifeloss. Postboard, I have 2 Wear//Tear, so I feel a bit better.

Does this increase the value of Spell Snare in the main deck? It's mostly speculation right now since there is no list to metagame against...but I have to assume any Fae deck will be running the full boat of Spellstutter Sprite and at least 3 Bitterblossom...both of which cost 2. Snare dodges their own Snare (i.e. if they wait until turn 3 to have Snare backup in case we Leak).

Of course it's all moot if they just Thoughtseize first...but they can't have it all the time, can they?

As for the sideboard - I'm not ready to ditch my Celestial Purge yet...so that's another side-in vs. the blossom.

[Arsenal]

I maindeck 3 Spell Snare already, and I don't think I'll go to 4 as I have additional counters post-board plus 2 copies of Wear/Tear. Celestial Purge is another decent card to consider in the meta right now, although it really, really shined in the Jund matchup (hit Bob, Lili, Raving Ravine, Huntmaster/Chandra, etc)

[JPoJohnson]

1) Because they must have Green. DRS could be cast from Swamp.
2) Birds -> Lili isn't a deck.

Birds->Lili wasn't a deck. WASN'T a deck. I promise that people are shifting their decks and they like the early ramp provided by DRS and chucking a different weenie into the deck in his slot will be what some people do. Overgrown Tomb -> Noble Hierarch -> T2 Lili is quite a feasible play and I plan on seeing it. So should you.

[Arsenal]

If that's what the BGx are going to do, that's fair. A turn 1 BoP/Hierarch --> turn 2 Liliana in exchange for them topdecking a mostly worthless BoP/Hierarch on turn 10 is fair. With DRS, they had the explosive starts PLUS the mid-late game threat all in one package. Far too efficient for Modern.

Also, the fact that BoP and Hierarch can't touch graveyards is HUGE. So if that's the plan, good. I'll eat a few turn 2 Lilianas and now I'll have my Snapcaster targets unmolested, that's a fair exchange. Personally, I believe going -4 DRS, +2 Grim Lavamancer, +1 land, +1 IoK is the way to go for Jund. Grim's Shock can serve as a pseudo-DRS in the mid-late game when BGx is traditionally in topdeck mode, and because he hits creatures, he doubles as removal for Pestermites, the anticipated Faerie legion, etc. He really looks well positioned now that DRS is gone and Fae is likely to see a major uptick in play (whether it sustains after the initial rush... idk).

[YamiJoey]

Birds->Lili wasn't a deck. WASN'T a deck. I promise that people are shifting their decks and they like the early ramp provided by DRS and chucking a different weenie into the deck in his slot will be what some people do. Overgrown Tomb -> Noble Hierarch -> T2 Lili is quite a feasible play and I plan on seeing it. So should you.

DEAL. That deck sounds fucking horrendous. I cannot wait to face it.

Spell Snare keeps around the same value for now. We'll see less Rock, but more Fae, and it's good against both. We will probably see Bitter Bob as some kind of Suicide Black deck or something, and possibly Esper somethingorother. (Bob/Blossom/Rev seems like a deck.) It could go up in value, but for now I'm keepingnit as a board card, and only looking into maining it if my meta changes or if the format becomes heavy on 2-drops. I don't really react to my own meta much, I play the deck I feel would be good for a PTQ etc. and fight for my FNM's and stuff. It allows to you test against a field of bad MU's a lot of the time, which is both exciting and useful.

Lavaman is an excellent shout. I expect to see more of that, and expect my Electrolyzes to get me even more value.

[Arsenal]

If Fae becomes a thing, I cannot wait to see the look on my opponent's face when I Electrolyze his board away... then do it against with Snapcaster.

[YamiJoey]

Electrolyzing only their guys is asking to get blown out by a Scion. Take your +1 and protection against Scion and be happy.

We should play Thundermaw somewhere. It's good in every match.

[Davran]

Electrolyzing only their guys is asking to get blown out by a Scion. Take your +1 and protection against Scion and be happy.

We should play Thundermaw somewhere. It's good in every match.

Yeah, I think I'm going to find space for at least one Tundermaw in my board. Seems quite good vs. Bitterblossom, and UB tokens if that's a thing now.

[Arsenal]

Lots of people had a 1-of Batterskull in the SB, could just be Thundermaw if Fae does become a thing. Will it though, longterm?

[YamiJoey]

Bitterblossom is the most powerful card in the format. It will become a thing and short of a banning stay there. Fae is incredible without BB.

I'm maining my Thundermaw. There is literally no MU I don't want one. Against aggro it allows you to push for victory after stabilising so that they can't develop a hand and board to make a comeback, against Tron it lets you kill Karns and once against swing in for victory when you finally manage to stabilise because every topdeck could cost you the game there. Against Control it's a random Hasty bomb, and against Fae it is a 5-mana 5/5 Flying Haste Wrath.

I really liked Stormbreath Dragon too, but now that Fae is back Thundermaw takes it. Which is a shame.

[n0mad]

Bitterblossom is the most powerful card in the format. It will become a thing and short of a banning stay there. Fae is incredible without BB.

I'm maining my Thundermaw. There is literally no MU I don't want one. Against aggro it allows you to push for victory after stabilising so that they can't develop a hand and board to make a comeback, against Tron it lets you kill Karns and once against swing in for victory when you finally manage to stabilise because every topdeck could cost you the game there. Against Control it's a random Hasty bomb, and against Fae it is a 5-mana 5/5 Flying Haste Wrath.

I really liked Stormbreath Dragon too, but now that Fae is back Thundermaw takes it. Which is a shame.

i like the idea of Thundermaw vs Fae, but if you include it do you also have to include cavern of souls?

[YamiJoey]

i like the idea of Thundermaw vs Fae, but if you include it do you also have to include cavern of souls?

I'll just play well instead, that's cool .

[Davran]

This is the list I'm going to trot out for FNM tonight. I assume the meta will consist of burn, UR, twin, tron, affinity, and maybe some form of fae. There might also be a zoo deck or two running around. Any suggestions would be welcome.

Main:
4 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique

4 Lightning Bolt
3 Path to Exile
2 Spell Snare
2 Lightning Helix
3 Mana Leak
1 Think Twice
3 Electrolyze
2 Sphinx's Revelation
4 Cryptic Command

2 Supreme Verdict

1 Ajani Vengeant
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant

3 Arid Mesa
4 Celestial Colonnade
1 Glacial Fortress
2 Hallowed Fountain
2 Island
1 Mountain
1 Plains
1 Sacred Foundry
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Steam Vents
2 Sulfur Falls
3 Tectonic Edge

Sideboard:
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Wear // Tear
2 Celestial Purge
1 Combust
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Counterflux
2 Sowing Salt
1 Batterskull
1 Thundermaw Hellkite

[Arsenal]

If Zoo becomes a thing, EE is going to be the biggest blowout versus them. Soooo many 1 drop creatures that you can blow up as soon as your 2nd turn. Good I hope Zoo becomes a thing.

[nodahero]

Your list looks fairly stock. I may hedge a bit and up the Spellsnare count. Turn two Blossom on the play is probably good game if it lands G1.

Additionally, with DRS gone perhaps we should consider Rune Snag more heavily in this variant given the slower and more methodical game plan. I am PRESUMING that the uptick in graveyard decks will spike for like 2 weeks so we would get splash damage but after that I think Rune Snag will become more powerful.

PS If Zoo really does become a thing I am betting it will be more akin to Kibler's big zoo from years past. I don't think low curve zoo will be prominent for the exact reason you suggest.

[Arsenal]

Big Zoo (Zoo in general) is rather unimpressive. The only card that truly matters versus us is Domri Rade, but that can really apply to any of the planeswalkers. If they don't have Domri, they just play into our 1-for-1 game until it's turn 11 and we just win. Big Zoo also lacks reach, so I don't feel in danger when I tap out to Think Twice/Electrolyze/Sphinx's Revelation/flashback Snapcaster.

[Davran]

If Zoo becomes a thing, EE is going to be the biggest blowout versus them. Soooo many 1 drop creatures that you can blow up as soon as your 2nd turn. Good I hope Zoo becomes a thing.

I played UW Tron "back in the day", and this was a fun thing to do for sure. It was even more fun to follow up with Timely Reinforcements after they spent the following turn casting something irrelevant since it often erased a large portion of the damage they did and provided plenty of time to Elesh Norn them right out of the game.

Speaking of Elesh Norn...is that a reasonable consideration for us? 7 mana is hardly a drawback with this deck, and Fae in particular would likely have all sorts of problems dealing with it. It's also not dead vs. Zoo and whatever other aggro decks pop up in the metagame (i.e. some version of Junk with Lingering Souls?)

[Timber]

I realize that 5 cmc is tough, but what about Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir? If you can resolve him and protect him (both not easy to do) he wrecks both Faeries and the tempo and popular control version of this deck.

He worked really well for Ben Stark at Worlds in game 3 when he drew him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCmJY5AlBEY (Game 3 starts around 54 minutes)

Thoughts?

[nodahero]

I think Mr. T is a viable singleton out of the board because as you said if you land him in the right matches you can just walk away with the game. I don't think that is the case though with Fae... If you would win with him, I bet you would also win from that situation without him save for Cryptic blow outs.

[Davran]

So I played the list above last night at FNM to a rather unimpressive finish. A few thoughts:

1. I play tested and then played against a zoo deck featuring Nacatl and Knight of the Reliquary. The match up seems to be heavily in our favor. They can get off to a pretty aggressive start, but we have enough removal that we can generally claw back. Supreme Verdict is a huge blowout vs the match. The only time I ever felt relatively threatened was if/when he was able to resolve a Knight as that is by far the hardest card for us to beat. Look for Combust out of the sidebord, and be careful not to get blown out by Sejiri Steppe off of Knight.

2. I also play tested and played against UB Fae. Unlike Zoo, this match up seemed nigh unwinnable. We don't present any sort of clock, so all he had to do was wait around until he had enough lands to have Blossom/Mistbind with counter backup. He has more counters than we do too. The Thundermaw Hellkite plan isn't all that stellar either because they've generally got a cryptic for it, and have enough of a clock to put us under some serious pressure if we choose to wait. My sideboard hate was irrelevant in every game as a result of Inquisition, Thoughtseize and/or Vendilion Clique. Electrolyze was fine, though if they manage to resolve a Blossom we're pretty boned since Mistbind can just champion that instead.

I played a few games against Fae after the tournament with a UWR tempo build (Remand, Geist, Figure of Destiny, Delver), which was much much better. I never felt out of control during those games as he was forced to answer each and every threat I played, quickly running him out of cards. The only out he had to a resolved Geist was double blocking, but with the Bolts and Electrolyzes that plan wasn't all that great either.

In short, if Fae becomes the new deck to beat in the format I'm not sure this archetype can survive without some serious tweaking.