That is probably the best advice anyone can give.Originally Posted by Esper3k
You save whatever you have just to fight this bloodmoon
Painter's the reason I have a null rod in my board. that and the look on player's faces when they SFM up a Jitte and I slam it down. Last night vs Death and Taxes I took out 2 Aether Vials and a Jitte all at the same time.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Last time I use Ultra Pros. The commentators got it wrong actually. I never had the checklist cards in at all. I don't know what the judges were talking about cuz I sure couldn't tell. I tried to stay focused and shrug it off to keep going but that type of thing can be pretty devastating mentally.
Hi guys,
today I played our local turney with 16 people and went 5:0 undefeated with the Team.
I played the standard list exept for 1 Pierce instead of the 4th FoW MD.
I expected Miracles, Bladedecks, Elves and some BGx decks like NicFit.
Sideboard was:
3 Golgari Charm
3 Disfigure
2 Spell Pierce
2 Null Rod
2 Grafdiggers Cage
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Force of Will
Null Rod was against Top, Explosive, Jitte, Swords & Batterskull (2 Storm player were there too and its great against LED & Petal).
My Games were as follow:
Round 1: Raffinity (Won 2:0 and Null Rod was BONKERS here)
Round 2: BR Reanimator (Won 2:1 the one loss was to 1st turn Unmask with a Griselbrand & in game 3 he scooped to my 1st turn cage because he has no outs for it)
Round 3: RUG Delver (Here I won 2:1 after a Wasteland war, really close and intensive games)
Round 4: Esper Deathblade (Here I won 2:0 quite easily)
Round 5: UWr Miracles (Here I won 2:0 after Hymning away a Sword + Snapy & put enough meat on the table & in the second game were null rod & some counter for his removal)
It was a good turney but I want to fit in 2 Maelstrom Pulse to the board , maybe cutting 1 Disfigure & 1 Clique/Null Rod/Charm.
I think Tombstalker is MD better than TNN because he's much faster and can block flyers like Delver/Cliques. After boarding I replace him with the 2 Cliques. Disfigure was great too because its cheap &handles a lot of creatures. Null Rod was great too, stoping Top, Explosives & equipment is great plus it helps against Storm. Cliques are also great, theyre just super flexible.
Top 4 were:
1. Team America
2. ANT
3. Miracles
4. NicFit
Greetings
Last edited by Manipulato; 03-22-2014 at 02:24 PM.
Currently playingEldrazi
Congrats! I'm definitely thinking 2 cages is the right number for this deck. The second null rod (compared to my SB only having one right now) also seems insane. It's a huge hoser in a meta filled with things like Stoneblade, D&T, Painter, etc.
I would agree that Pulse is very playable. It's a very important card in the Miracles Matchup, as I feel like JTMS is a huge problem for us.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
Thx, I was expecting 2 DnT and Rod is near to a blow out against them. Null Rod was great but I want to beat SFM/Midrange decks with Null Rod + Pulse and I think they work great together because one handles what the other does not. Null Rod is insane right now with all the Vials, Tops, Jittes, Swords and so on. Pulse is just sweet too, not only because of Jace, it hits Angel tokens too, and against SFM decks Batterskull is enemy number one plus its just a hardremoval for each oposing creature & Decay number 5+6. Just super flexible.
After boarding SFM decks have a hard time dealing with 2 Cliques 2 Null Rod AND 2 Pulse.
Playing less than 2 cages seems wrong to me because it is our "RIP" and shuts down some decks like Reanimator, TinFins, Dredge & Elves, sure Surgical handles P.Fire & Loam engine but I dont expect Lands in my meta & P. Fire is not the "You lose" card against us because we have Goyf & Stalker + 4 Wasteland 4 Shaman.
Currently playing
T8'd a Legacy tournament for a Mox Ruby this weekend (http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...Plus-much-more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) after finishing 9th (only X-1-1 not to T8) at the last one.
Here's my list:
4x Underground Sea
2x Bayou
1x Tropical Island
4x Wasteland
4x Verdant Catacombs
3x Polluted Delta
1x Misty Rainforest
4x Delver of Secrets
4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Tarmogoyf
2x True-Name Nemesis
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
4x Daze
3x Force of Will
3x Hymn to Tourach
2x Thoughtseize
3x Abrupt Decay
2x Disfigure
1x Liliana of the Veil
1x Sylvan Library
Sideboard:
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Dimir Charm (should probably be Envelop)
1x Dismember (I like the flexibility more than Disfigure)
1x Flusterstorm
1x Force of Will
2x Golgari Charm
1x Grafdigger's Cage (this could be another Surgical if you want)
1x Krosan Grip
1x Liliana of the Veil
1x Maelstrom Pulse (I haven't been very happy with this. Considering a Null Rod or Jitte or TNN here)
2x Spell Pierce
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Vendilion Clique
As you can see, the list I played is very similar to Phazonmutant's list. I prefer the 4th Daze in the main over Spell Pierce just because it helps to maximize our early disruption. I'm super greedy, so I'm playing 19 lands so I can fit the maindeck Sylvan Library in. The meta at these tournaments is fairly heavy in combo + Miracles, so I'm expecting to board out a land in most matchups anyways. The maindeck TNNs are again because of all the Miracles.
50ish players, 6 rounds of Swiss.
Round 1 - vs GBwr Nic Fit
One of our local players at the store I normally frequent, so we know what we're each on.
Game 1: I win the die roll and aggro him out with dudes and disruption. TNN seals the deal for me.
Game 2: He gets the scary Nic Fit opener of Cabal Therapy, Veteran Explorer / Flashback Therapy, start dropping big dudes. I stall the board with Goyf and TNN, but a Deed comes down and I'm wrecked.
Game 3: I have Thoughtseize and DRS, so I lead off with DRS because he's been usually leading off with Cabal Therapy to protect his Explorers from Daze (playing them T2). He changes game plans and jams down the Explorer T1 - awkward. My Thoughtseize shows Therapy, Deed, and a bunch of lands, so at least he doesn't have much business. I play Sylvan Library and the card advantage / selection allows me to keep him tempo'd out long enough to finish the job.
1-0 (2-1)
Round 2 - vs Team America
Game 1: I lose the die roll and after a few turns, we both find out we're playing the mirror. His list seems to be more of the stock list and while I get ahead on cards, he draws two TNN in a row to close the game out.
Game 2: I aggro him out with Tarmogoyfs, but he's got all the Wastelands. He has no cards in hand to my 4 (he's got 4 lands, to my 2 and Tarmogoyf) and draws Liliana. Ugh. Lili kills my Goyf and Wasteland keeps me off lands while Liliana eats my hand / dudes.
1-1 (2-3)
Round 3 - vs Mono B Goryo's Vengeance / Shallow Grave Reanimator
Game 1: I win the die roll and keep Deathrite Shaman, Thoughtseize, Sylvan Library, Disfigure, lands. I drop the DRS and he goes basic Swamp, Dark Ritual, Liliana of the Veil, kill your DRS. I think "Ok, we're against Pox", so I windmill slam down Sylvan Library. On his turn, he +1's Liliana and I throw away my Disfigure while he discards... Emrakul?!?! Ah crap. Trigger on the stack, Goryo's Vengeance on Emrakul, Annihilator 6 and 15 damage to my face. I actually draw a few more lands and try to make a game of it, but he Entombs, then Animate Dead's a Griselbrand and that's it.
Game 2: Hand disruption, countermagic, and Deathrite Shaman + Delver go the distance.
Game 3: He Thoughtseizes me, sees my Grafdigger's Cage and snap discards it, so I have to play fair. I cantrip into Deathrite Shaman and protect him from 2 Lilianas, which makes it almost impossible for him to win.
2-1 (4-4)
Round 4 - vs Junk
Another local player! (Many of us are running into each other since we were almost 20% of the field)
Game 1: I win the die roll and keep DRSx2, fetch land, 2x Wasteland, Ponder, and Daze. He Plows my first DRS, but i just play Waste his land and get out my second one. The second Wasteland + Daze keeps him off balance long enough for me to overrun him with threats.
Game 2: He goes first and gets a bunch of DRS out while I'm always a turn behind him.
Game 3: I Thoughtseize his DRS, seeing a hand with double Qasali Pridemage. Normally I'd be pretty happy, but I have Sylvan Library. Oh well, T2 Sylvan, Disfigure his T2 Pridemage, draw cards off of Sylvan, Hymn to Tourach and I'm just too far ahead on card advantage even when he kills my Sylvan with his second Pridemage.
3-1 (6-5)
Round 5 - vs Sneaky Show
Yet another local player!
Game 1: He wins the die roll and I mull to 4 (knowing what I'm facing) and have to keep a hand of Abrupt Decay, Disfigure, Wasteland, and fetch land. He goes T1: Island, T2: Gitaxian Probes me, laughs, drops Ancient Tomb, Show & Tell -> Griselbrand. I scoop.
Game 2: I open a pretty nuts hand with Force, Force, Brainstorm, Daze, lands. I Brainstorm into Daze, Liliana, land. On T2, he goes for it off of Island, Mountain, Lotus Petal and I Daze his Show & Tell. T3, he drops a Lotus Petal, goes for it again (missing his land drop), and I Daze yet again. Ouch. I draw Hymn right on time to strip the rest of his hand away and Liliana comes down with him having no cards in hand...
Game 3: I mull to 5 and think it's game over. My hand is Brainstorm, Brainstorm, three lands. He opens with Leyline of Sanctity and I think to myself that I might have a chance. Brainstorm finds Daze, DRS, and Tarmogoyf and we're off to the races. He misses his third land drop and I start beating down. He eventually gets to his third land and goes for the Show & Tell and he has Force for my Daze. I have 2 mana left and Brainstorm looking for any of my counter spells... and hit Spell Pierce & Surgical Extraction! Spell Pierce resolves and on his draw step, I Surgical away Show & Tell... including the one he just drew!
4-1 (8-6)
Round 6 - vs Miracles
A friend of mine so of course we have to play each other in our win-and-in round.
Game 1: We battle back and forth with him finding removal for my guys, but I also get down TNN and Sylvan Library so I'm able to keep up with his card advantage. We also both play like idiots and manage to each pick up 2 Warnings apiece in about 2 minutes. Yeesh. Sylvan Library keeps the flow of dudes going and he can't keep up.
Game 2: I T1 Thoughtseize, take his Spell Snare, T2 Sylvan Library, pay 8 life the next turn and he can't keep up with my flood of guys.
5-1 (10-6)
Top 8 - vs Death & Taxes
Yet another buddy of mine!
Game 1: I'm higher seed, so I choose to play. I aggro out on him with Delver, Tarmogoyf, and TNN. Yeah TNN is still really good vs those fair decks.
Game 2: We get in a stalemate where he has Meekstone out and Batterskull (dead Germ) + SoFI, but then gets Thalia out and she Voltron's up all over my face.
Game 3: He misses his T3 land drop and I Wasteland his Wasteland (he has a Plains for his other land). He did manage to cast 2 SFM so I know he has Batterskull + Jitte in hand. The game gets to a point where he has 6 cards in hand, a Mom, 1 plains, vs my 4 lands, flipped Delver, and I have a hand of Golgari Charm (he knows of it because of the Delver), Liliana, and Krosan Grip. I play Liliana and know that as soon as I play her, I made a mistake. Stuck, I -2 her and swing in, hoping he doesn't hit a land drop. He rips a Plains and slams down a Serra Avenger. I hold Delver back to block and of course he has StP and kills Liliana. He drops 2 more Serra Avengers and we actually end up having a very close game, but I think it would've gone much differently if I had waited to Golgari Charm the Mom away at the end of his turn, then dropped Liliana to kill his Avenger. Shows that I still need more practice with the deck!
5-2 (11-8)
Gratz to your finish, you drew a lot of Sylvans for a 1off ;-) I tried TNN a bit in the Stalker slot and we can really play him, especially because it ups the blue count for FoW which give a bit of consistence. At the moment I prefer Stalker but TNN is in my opinion the best replacing card for that slot. Im not sure about 19 lands but ok...Dimir charm seems really sweet to me! Having Envelop, Disfigure & some library trick all in 2 mana instant seems very flexible, I will give it a try.
What is the reason/experiences about Maelstrom Pulse? You were not very happy with it, why? How were Dimir Charm for you?
Greetings
Currently playing
Hah yeah Sylvan Library was a champ - it knows I love it so I guess it always gravitates to me!
My problem with Stalker was that it was often great in G1, but I ended up boarding it out most of the time against the white decks. TNN is less good G1 against the non-white decks, but can always stay in G2/3 against them though.
I liked Dimir Charm in theory, but in practice, often had a hard time finding stuff to cut to board it in. Against combo, while having the Envelop option was great if you're on the play, being on the draw and needing the Envelop on T1 (their T2) was something I've wished I've had.
Re: Maelstrom Pulse - I think it's the combination of 3 mana + Sorcery Speed. I'm already playing the Grip, so I have an answer to artifact/enchantments, Dismember gives me an answer to larger creatures, so I guess for me, I didn't feel the need for it as much. Also remember I'm playing three 3-drops in the main already, so every one I add in starts to feel more and more clunky to me.
Maelstrom pulse really isn't to answer enchantments or artifacts because you have decays and golgari charms. Outside of moat and humility (both not really played), what can't decay do?
What you really need pulse for is the catch all card where you have absolutely no answers for...like jace and other weird things that do not come up often, hence the 1 of.
And other than Jace, which we can still take care of with TNN, having an advanced board state, countermagic, or hand disruption, what do you need Pulse for?
Sure, it's nice to sometimes have a catchall, but it's not 100% necessary, especially if you'd rather have a card targeted more directly at specific matchups.
I actually don't feel pulse is all too necessary. I rather get something else in the sideboard like an extra liliana or a clique. or maybe even more countermagic
Manipulato well done,greetings to your legacy crew in munich !
Next time i'll join the party (i first have to get there somehow)
@creaturediscussion:
I'm not a fan of tombstalker right now because of all the jaces everywhere,it's just to easy for the opponent to get rid of the demon.
- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -
By "jaces everywhere" do you mean the rise of miracles? For me Tombstalker has been fine really, but then again my meta is unusually light on blade decks for an American shop and has one miracles player that's not always there.
In regards to Legacy:
Hi Sawatarix,
how I said before, TNN is a good option in the Stalker slot but my theory was if I play TNN MD he gets a bit worse in G2 & G3 because my oponents will hate him + I bring in my own Charms a lot, so it can produce stupid situations where I want to Charm the board but kill my own TNN, for example. Most of the time I board out 2 Stalker and bring in the 2 Cliques (less GYdepending & more flexible), if I would bring in 2 Cliques for 2 TNN it would be the same problem because both die to -1/-1 effects etc...Plus I really like the big fat flying asshole demonand he is just a lategame bomb and my oponents plowed Goyf or Delver before...
PS: Our gang was not from Munich, we were from Kempten (Allgäu), but no problem BAYERN DES SAMA MIA
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By the way, i have built a completely different team america and tested it against some buddys of my testing team (skilled players ).
The results were fine,i'm pretty satisfied with the list so far and
I also can imagine to bring the list to larger events like the bazaar of moxen.
Maybe the name Team America is not correct,should name it "canadian ******** with better creatures"
Here we go:
Deck: Team America by Kai Thiele (20.03.2014)
Counts : 60 main / 15 sideboard
Creatures:12
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Tarmogoyf
2 Tombstalker
Spells:29
4 Brainstorm
1 Disfigure
4 Ponder
3 Spell Pierce
4 Stifle
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Daze
2 Dismember
4 Force of Will
Lands:19
1 Bayou
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
2 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
4 Wasteland
Sideboard:15
***In progress so far***
It's basically bug delver without discard but stifles.
In the current metagame the wasteland/stifle package is very good but Rug's creatures were not good enough to seal the deal anymore after deathrite shaman and true name nemesis got printed.
The playstyle is also kinda different (similar to rug,reactive)
I'm still in the developing process,Feedback is appreciated :-)
- Team RUG-STAR Berlin -
I've often wished for a second Clique as well, but as always, sideboard space is so tight and it's a pain figuring out what to cut.
Isn't this card a 1 mana planeswalker, don't you want to max out on these. I am pretty sure this is the 2nd best creature ever, next to Stoneforge Mystic. Why only three?
I agree, anything but 4 seems like the wrong number in this deck. I think it's arguably better than stoneforge.
I have also been running stifles, but instead of cutting the discard package, I cut the dazes. I'm just not the biggest fan of daze. It serves a purpose, but I honestly haven't missed them much. I have 4 extra counters and a clique to come in vs combo so I don't really feel like I am not protected enough.
My list is:
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Tarmogoyf
1 Tombstalker
2 True-Name Nemesis
1 Liliana of the Veil
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
3 stifle
2 Disfigure
3 Force of Will
3 Hymn to Tourach
4 Ponder
1 Spell Pierce
2 Thoughtseize
2 Bayou
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Polluted Delta
2 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
4 Wasteland
SB:
1 Abrupt Decay
1 Envelop
1 Flusterstorm
1 Force of Will
2 Golgari Charm
1 Liliana of the Veil
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Spell Pierce
2 Null Rod
1 Sylvan Library
1 Vendilion Clique
2 Grafdigger's cage
I haven't found my preferred creature base as of yet. TNN seems so underwhelming without equipment, but it flat out wins games sometimes. I have recently cut one goyf for one tombstalker, and I like it so far. I really hate having graveyard hate shrink my creatures so I have one clique in the sideboard to come in for combo and decks with a lot of graveyard hate. I often want 2, but it's really awkward bringing in golgari charms and cliques at the same time.
Sawatarix list is way more tempo oriented than any other TA/BUG list, so 4 Daze ar a must (it would be like playing RUG without Daze). Sawatatix is a experienced bUrg Player/RUG Player, that should be a reason in playing only 3 DS and only 12 creatures
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