Plague is ok but it kills Bob too. Needle is fine. Phyrexian Revoker is awesome, giving them a taste of their own medicine.Originally Posted by Megadeus
I do well vs D and T, although I haven't faced a Crusader in a while. I find Toxic Deluge to be an awesome card. I totally recommend you play at least one in board.
What are Crusaders for? BUG Delver/Shardless BUG?
I guess? Also great versus opposing bskulls, and like nedleeds pointed out, it's a one man army versus miracles. Plus any time it gets to connect with equipment, it's GG
Went a hot 3-3 drop today at the open. I played like dog shit and deserved to lose. Beat dredge, lost to elves then miracles, Beat miracles abd esper blade, then lost to shardless. It was just a string of poor choices. The board felt fine. I was bringing in at least 4-7 cards every match up. I just didn't play well. Luckily team Tusk was well represented with 3 in the top 16
We all have days my last 2 events I ran a main board Jailer and Zealous persecution in anticipation of elves and dredge sort of as an answer game 1 more for value I worked in favor vs elves and my dredge opponent was running a 1 of chain of vapors main
Hi!
I am updating some of my older Legacy lists. I need some help and suggestions to a Deadguy Ale deck (see below). I would like it to be a most optimal deck with cards that are available today. I play in a semi-competive environment, all kinds of decks are represented in the Aggro, Control and Combo categories. Any help will be highly appreciated. Many thanks in advance!
Creature [12]
4 Dark Confidant
3 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Tombstalker
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
Instant [7]
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Zealous Persecution
Sorcery [11]
4 Hymn to Tourach
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Lingering Souls
Artifact [6]
1 Batterskull
2 Chrome Mox
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Umezawa's Jitte
Land [21]
2 Plains
4 Swamp
1 Arid Mesa
4 Marsh Flats
2 Scrubland
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Wasteland
Planeswalker [3]
3 Liliana of the Veil
60 cards
Sideboard:
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Enlightened Tutor
2 Mindbreak Trap
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Perish
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Humility
15 cards
Hi starchild, your decks looks fine, but i do have a few comments for you:
Firstly the only thing that looks really wrong Thalia's shouldn't be main deck. They are extremely good cards vs certain match ups but you tax more than 50% of your own deck with her. If you play her they belong in the sideboard for the combo matchup.
In the main board I further don't like the Tombstalkers, i don't think we fill our own graveyard that fast. But i have not tried the card myself.
Zealous Persecution in the main is also not very common, I personally play vindicate in this spot but that is my preference. Persecution does give you better game vs D&T, Elves, Mirror and helps vs TNN, unflipped delver and non-thresh gooses and randomly wins if combo goes off with empty the warrens. However in some matchup’s its basically a useless card, therefore I would cut at least 1, however this is probably a metagame call.
I think some number of thoughtseizes should be in the main board and I would advise Deathrite Shaman (with one Bayou main)
I personally also like the 4th Stoneforge with a 3th equipment since I think stoneforge is one of our strongest threats. But I’ve seen multiple lists running only 3 stoneforge since they think it is to slow, maybe I just like having a more controlish build. If you play this the 3th equipment should probably be Sword of Fire and Ice, but if there's no TNN in you meta you can pick something else, i used to play a 2nd jiite main.
Ur mana base could use a bit of work, play more duals if you have the money otherwise shock duals or isolated chapels (and cut the 2nd plains first, hands with plains + wasteland just suck), if you have money buy add a single karakas.
The sideboard looks ok, I don't like mind break trap that much, replace them with your thalia's. Add at least 1 Rest in peace, replacing either a Surgical Extraction or your one of spellbom. It just is the best graveyard hate out there.
I hope this helps! If you don’t agree please prove me wrong, I like to see alternative builds perform well!
Spirit Ale deck I built last night:
4 Mother of Runes
4 Dark Confidant
4 Stoneforge Mystic
3 Spirit of the Labyrinth
3 Mirran Crusader
1 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Thoughtseize
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Lingering Souls
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Vindicate
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sword of Fire & Ice
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Light & Shadow/Feast & Famine
4 Wasteland
4 Marsh Flats
3 Scrubland
2 Bloodstained Mire
2 Arid Mesa
2 Plains
2 Swamp
2 Mishra's Factory
1 Karakas
3 Rest in Peace
2 Perish
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Bitterblossom
1 Batterskull
1 Council's Judgement
Seeing a lot less Miracles/BUG at the LGS recently. Lots of Elves, lots of exotic decks (last week I played 12post, 4c cascade, and Tezz), lots of people testing TreasURe Cruise. So I'd like to bring some Spirit of the Labyrinths to monkey with Brainstorm, Glimpse, and Cruise. Perish/BB/O-ring out of the board for when I invariably play against RUG, Miracles, and S&S next week.
Undecided on a few slots: Vindicate, IOK, Souls, BB, Bskull, the extra sword. I feel like I need more Revoker effects in there, but I feel like Vindicate kills anything I want to revoke/needle while also being mainboard actual removal for creature decks. Missing Thalia for storm, obviously. Trying some Thalia-free builds for a while so I can play cool spells. Maybe I want Canonist over Mindcensor, but I just love mindcensor so much.
Going discard into spirit still seems like a fisting against Storm. I mean, hatebears are always welcome in the MU, but you definitely have game against storm even without Thalia.
I went to a 27 man tournament yesterday. Played for the first time since a year, so didn't expect much.
I wrote some stuff down, to avoid having to work on my thesis:
Played this:
14 Creatures
4x Stoneforge
4x Confi
4x Deathrite
2x Spirit of the Labyrinth
5 Artifact
2x Top
1x SofI
1x Jitte
1x Batterscull
19 other spells
4x StP
2x Vindicate
4x Lingering Souls
3x Liliana
3x Thoughtseize
3x Inquisition
22 Land
4x waste
8x fetch
4x Scrub
1x bayou
4x swamp
1x plains
Side
3x Perish
3x Enlightened Tutor
2x Revoker
2x Cannonist
1x Pithing Needle
1x Engineered Plague
1x Rest in Peace
1x Gravedigger's Cage
1x Ensnaring Bridge
First round Elves Lost 2-0
G1 win die rol
I keep a hand of 2 waste, 2 land, deathrite, lingering souls, sth, thinking that 2 wastes + Deathrite could just be a win.
My opponent plays out a basic forest and a deathrite, so there goes my plan.
At turn 3 he glimpses and put a bunch of elves into play (among which two heritage druid) so I figured the game was over.
In my turn I have 4 lingering souls tokens and a deathrite, i play stoneforge, fetching SofI thinking he provides the best clock, attacking him with the tokens and putting him to 12, figuring I can kill him in two more turns now.
Next turn he only put 2-3 more elves into play and passes the turn. I waste his red source (mistake) in his end step, afraid for what he might have added to his deck
In my turn I have 4 mana, draw a thoughtseize and have a Liliana in my hand, so I can choose to: play thoughtseize & play Liliana, or play SofI and Equip att putting him in kill range for next turn. I choose for the later since he hadn’t played anything relevant the last turn, figuring he has no business. I tap out, and attack him to 3.
He proceeds to topdeck a Cradle, and play the Behemoth that is in his hand. Owh how I wish I would just have thoughtseized last turn. Also not wasting his red source would have given me the one additional mana to follow the same line of play AND play the thoughseize. Since for some stupid reason I was afraid his red might mean he played lightning bold I wasted it.
G2 in: everything exept RiP
out: 4xLingering Souls, 1 SofI, 3 Liliana, 2 vindicates and 4 confi’s I believe.
I keep a hand with 2x Revoker, 4x land, thoughtseize. Thinking I can shut him down
I thoughtseize, seeing: 3 land, Deathrite, Heritage Druid, Natural Order, abrubt decay. So I pick the natural order
He plays Deathrite passes,
I play Revoker, naming deathrite
He decays my revoker, taps deathrite and plays druid.
I untap, draw a gravediggers cage and play revoker on druid figuring the only way I’m going to lose is glimpse into a shit load of elves, which I can stop by revokering the druid.
He attacks with his Druid, which I do not block and plays a draw a card elf and a deathrite
I proceed to draw land, he does deathrite activation
He attacks, so this time I trade my revoker with his druid (should have done the turn before I think)
His deathrites finish the game, and I draw nothing to stop it.
Two lines of play would have made a huge diference:
- Putting the second revoker on deathrite as well
- Thoughseizing the abrubt decay instead of the Natural order
- Siding in RiP would have helped…. Who thinks to sideboard this card vs elves?
- not keeping a 4 land hand?
Any advice here? Would you guys have played it differently?
Second Round Infect
G1 I quickly lose to poison
In: 3x Perish, 3x Tutor, 1x Engineered plague, 1x Pithing Needle
Out: 4x Lingering Souls, 2x Spirit of the Labyrinth, + sth?
I should have boarded in Canonist as well.
G2
I stop his early threats with wasteland StP and discard and close the game on the back of Liliana and Jitte. This game also involves a Spirit of the Labyrint trapping a Brainstorm in his hand the entire game.
G3
I open with though seize seeing 3x Glistening elf, pendlehaven Inkmoth land and blighted agent, taking the last. He plays all three glistening elfs in his first two turns and beats me to 4 poison with pendlehaven help. In my turn I get to play perish and I feel pretty good at this point. I have a enlightened tutor in hand to fetch and play engineered plague next turn to kill the inkmoth and think I have this match. He proceeds to topdeck an ivogate and kills me for exacties with inkmoth + pendlehave + invogate
Thoughts: Zealous Persecution would have been awesome in this match
0-2, can no longer make top 8 after my first two games, but continue to play anyway.
Third Round 12 Post, I saw her playing before so know what she was playing, have played against 12 post once before and I think it is a horrible machup.
Do not remember much of the first game, but she eventually gets a Primeval titan, who gets a Eye of Ulamog, which gets a Emrakul next turn, which gets harcast and I pick up my stuff.
Game 2
Out: 4 Lingering Souls, 2 Spirit of the Labyrinth, 1 Stoneforge, 1 SofI
In: 2 Revokers, 1 pithing needle, 3x Enlightened Tutor, 1 Ensnaring bridge
I open pretty well, and manage to beat her down to 5. She manages to get enough mana and finds a Titan, fetching 2 lands to get her some 12 lives. Expeditions map finds Eye of Ulamog, which she keeps in hand, so I cannot waste it. At one point she plays Ulamog. I kill it, and use both my deathrites to exile a land, and a instant to do 2 damage to her before she gets to reshuffle. (stupid!)
She gets to play a pithing needle on wasteland, find and play an emrakul trough eye of ulamog, and attack me for 15 sacking all my non-land permanents. I play a ensnaring bridge, but she uses eye of ulamog to find here one of Ulamog, the butcher and kills the bridge….. I should have exiled the Ulamog when I had the chance with my deathrites.
0-3
Fourth Round Reanimator
He’s a nice guy and since we’r both at 3 loses we don't play for anything anymore.
Game one was the best game of the entire day. I win the die roll and keep a hand with Deathrite, Wasteland, Spirit of the Labyrinth 2 more lands and a batterskull
I play deathrite. He plays a fetch, and passes.
I play spirit of the labyrinth. He picks up the card and reads it and says he has never had to play against it. I ask: resolves? He says: Sure.
I tap deathrite to exile my fetch and play inquisition. He asks: How does spirit work with brainstorm? I explain that he gets to draw one cards since it is my turn and then has to put two back, but could have just responded when the spirit was on the stack. But he’s fine with hiding two cards from my discard spell.
Next turn he show&tells. I put batterskull in play, he puts a grisslebrand into play. The whole table finds the board state pretty funny and I’m pretty happy with my Spirit. Next turn he attacks me for 7, I attack back for 7, gaining 4 life and StP his Grisslebrand in his upkeep. He says: I should have drawn that single card for 7 life in your turn! And picks up his stuff.
Game 2:
In: 3x Tutor, 1x RiP, 1x Gravedigger’s cage, 2x revoker, 1x peedle (I think)
Out: 4x Lingering Souls, 1x SFM, 1x Jitte, 2x vindicate,
He gets and early reanimated Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite. I discard his counters and put an ensnaring bridge into play and later play a SFM fetching SofI. He show&tells grislebrand, I Batterskull. Play equip with SofI but he draws 14 cards, brainstorms, and discards & exhumes a Tidespout Tyrant , plays a petal bouncing my bridge and I scoop
Game 3:
Keep: 3 land, deathrite, Spirit, Tutor, Stoneforge
Turn 1 deathrite, he turn one thoughseizes taking my spirit. He peedles my deathrite and I tutor a gravediggers cage to circumvent spellpierce. He does not find any business after that and I manage to win the game from that point.
Fifth Round Sneak&Show (with guru lands)
Game 1 he just does not find any way to go off and I win without having much disruption
Out: 4x Lingering Souls, 1x SFM, 1x Jitte, 1x confi
IN: 3x Enlightened Tutor, 2x Phyrexian Revoker, 1x Ensnaring Bridge, 1x pithing needle
Game 2 involved an openings hand with 3 thoughtseizes, That take 2 sneak attack and a through the breach. Followed by two revokers and a Liliana. He has only 1 blue source so I waste it. He draws a new one and I Liliana ult, splitting his land in Mountain + SoL land and Island. He picks the first pile.
Liliana keeps his hands size down, he manages to clear the board at three life with a pyroclasm, but it is too little too late for him.
2-3 end result, pretty bad but it was nice to play a tournament again.
There was a junk deck that went top 8, running no SFM, 4x Tidehollow Sculler , Abrubt decays and I believe knights of the reliquary. He said that he played against combo 3 matches and that the Tidehollow Sculler were really awesome and I should play some
Spirit of the labyrinth was quite cool, and in theory has utility in the BUG and RUG matches, which Revoker does not. In all cases I had spirit it did more work that the revokers so I think I will keep them. As a plus side it stops treasure cruise and Ancestral Vision, two cards that are quit brutal against us.
Liliana and Thoughtseize where MVP’s and performed well all day long.
Ensnaring bridge was disappointing since it was removed the two times I played it, but I still think that ensaring bridge + Liliana + Lingering souls + Jitte + Deathrite sounds like a good plan.
I noticed that I boarded out Lingering Souls every time since it is quite slow, however game one they were always good. Maybe I should not board them out in every match up?
Will play anther tournament next weekend, and one the weekend after that. Probably running pikula stoneblade again and hope that my performance will be a bit better.
Spirit of the Labyrinth have been quite a card tbh and cruise makes it even better. Hymn has been lacking for a while and cruise makes it even worse.
100% you drop Hymn immediately and switch to TS/IoK splits. It's terrible unless you run it in the side against combo where it'll still be the great 2-for-1 it always was.
My current list going forward is something like this:
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Dark Confidant
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Spirit of the Labyrinth
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Council's Judgment
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Reanimate
1 Unearth
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 Thoughtseize
3 Liliana of the Veil
3 Lingering Souls
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Marsh Flats
4 Wasteland
3 Scrubland
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Windswept Heath
1 Bayou
SB: 2 Zealous Persecution
SB: 2 Rest in Peace
SB: 3 Pithing Needle
SB: 2 Disenchant
SB: 2 Path to Exile
SB: 2 Perish
SB: 2 Open
I figure since we're one of the few decks that can play Spirit, might as well quad. It means Delver's removal has to go towards spirit, and if it's suited up, sometimes that won't be possible. I've moved to 6 1-cmc discard to grab whatever we need to. Souls is a great way to grind out the midgame since even if they've got lots of cards, unless they counter every spell, they're still in deep since the can't answer it, ten cards in hand or none. Unearth and Reanimate are there as spice I'm wanting to try, especially if you get something Decay'd or you nuke a creature, you can take it back. Feast and Famine is over Batterskull because we don't have Brainstorm, and we're going to have troubles with Goyfs anyway.
Sideboard is just a general smattering for right now.
-Matt
Unfortunately, I think due to the lack of large dudes in this deck, I think skull is almost necessary. Also I'm glad I'm not the only one with a love affair with unearth. I like the list though and may try it out. I haven't gotten to play much lately, but I do love quad spirit.
I'm glad evryone like spirit at the moment, i'll try to pick up a thirth on saterday, and remove a lingering souls.
It does make the deck even weaker to golgari charm effects though
I've tried unearth and although I like the card I felt it was not really playable. It sits dead in your hand to often and is bad when your guys get plowed. I think the only list in which it can be played is BR sligh with vexing devils etc.
I haven’t tried reanimate, it might be nice since you will lose at max 2 life from getting your own creature back and it is able to pick creatures out of your opponents graveyard.
Sword of feast and famine is good vs goyf and combo, and with the addition of 4 spirits main there are more bodies to be equiped. I personally will play the batterscull since I feel I need a big guy in the deck. but Sword of feast and famine does not sound bad.
Unearth never sits dead in your hand, it cycles.
Unearth (and Reanimate) are pretty spicy. The cycling option is very handy when you just need something that you don't have (discard, removal, a weapon). I've run Reanimate to better results (getting their Snapcaster, and snapping it back for their Stoneforge, also grabbed a Stinkweed Imp once, but I stopped running the card and never played it against Reanimator), but the life loss and lack of cycling are actual drawbacks.
With Delver getting the recent shot in the arm, I think Unearth could be a strong 1 or 2 of again. They so frequently Daze/Force/Bolt your guys, especially the DRS, and in this deck probably the Spirit of the Lab. Being able to Unearth it the next turn, and have it be Daze-proof could really set them back.
Killing then getting back their TNN is also mucho spicy.
-Matt
So I've played a few GPT trials for New Jersey, just falling short of getting the byes. Boo urns. Observations with the 2 new blue cards Dig Through Time and Treasure Cruise.
-Wow they are both sooooo annoying. It's much tougher for attrition like decks like ours to do well in this meta. MAJOR adjustments need to be made.
-I wasn't sure if those cards are a good idea in a deck that's already GY dependant. I was wrong. I played against Reanimator twice (same player twice). I beat it 2-0 and 2-1. He had Dig Through Time and it won a game vs me. I had a Nihil Spellbomb in play but was worried about popping it too early.
-Having said that about Delve cards being good even in decks that are already Heavily GY Dependant, I wouldn't recommend playing a deck like Reanimator or Dredge right now IMO. Reason being is I think one way people are going to combat decks like this is to hate on graveyards hard. Relic of Progenitus in particular could see an uptick in play.
-Tried 4 Thoughtseize main instead of usual 3. Didn't like it as it really really hurt. May put an Inquisition of Kozilek in its place.
-added a Nihil Spellbomb to the board. Saw it vs Reanimator. Which was obviously nice. Didn't see it vs BUG Delver.
- 4-1 record vs decks with Dig or Cruise. UR delver (1-0). BuG Delver (1-1) and Reanimator (2-0). Even though i've done ok so far...listening to ideas and probably gonna tweak something.
I thought about Spirit of the Labyrinth. But since we don't play stuff like Mother of Runes I don't know.... UR delver has Forked Bolt and BUG has Golgari Charm. We already have enough stuff that dies to it. May consider a Gaddock Teeg and/or a Chains of Mephistopheles. Or considering just hating on the Graveyard hard which I usually do anyway.
LOL, even thought about splashing blue for Notion Thief.
Feel that dig and cruise reduced alot of what decks that are viable in legacy and modern atm. Question is if they can even be combat good enough. Combating brainstorm has been working soso with Spirit. Card advantech is something blue did missout on in legacy. And both 8cc draw spells does it insanly well.
Relic should be better then Spellbomb if combating delve is the main purpose for it, deathrite does some work as well but chance of it staying alive is quite slim. Both cards can still be pitched to force when it requires it.
Haven't tested at all, but I'm on 6 1CC discard and 4 spirit right now. Hoping it is enough. Doubt it though. At least I'll never ever ever ever lose to combo again I guess. Might simply take out anti combo cards in the board for more things to fight fair
First, 6 1CC discard and SotL are not enough for combo IMO. SotL is *ok* against combo, but only if they had a slow/cantrip based hand.
IMO, Tidehollow Sculler may be better positioned than before as it doesn't feed (and can hit) delve cards. I'm trying some out this week in junk since a local player is big on them. I could see running Spirits though; it just feels unsafe with ZP and GC running around while Bob + Souls are in the deck. SotL may need to replace Souls; which feels wrong.
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