Gold Digger [UWr Delve Control]

[Kaslan]

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15162&iddeck=112516

the moat- Baneslayer Angel version finsihed 1st. the list is interesting

[klaus]

@SitTylerGalt & rest:
This deck looks sweet (though I'd definitely go with -1 SFM, -1 SCM + 2 Ponder).
Discussing this creature-heavy build in detail would beg for a distinct thread though (just like Miracles VS Stoneblade). So please keep it focussed on the (more or less) creature-less archetype here and feel free to start another thread in "N&D Decks".
Cheers!

[Spigore]

http://www.tcdecks.net/deck.php?id=15162&iddeck=112516

the moat- Baneslayer Angel version finsihed 1st. the list is interesting

Hi Kaslan,

Just FYI, this is Alphastryk's list finishing 1st place as he reported in post #24 of this thread.

[lambert101]

So far the 3 pyroclasm 2 supreme verdict 2 engineered explosives and 1 council's judgement have been awesome in a delver meta. The only concern I have is the 2 Stoneforge mystic main that potentially get hit by a wipe. For reference my list is the one from channel fireball's last article with the following 5 changes:

Out from channel fireball's list
1 counterspell
1 fire//Ice
1 misdirection
1 Preordain
2 Spell Pierce

My new selections:
3 pyroclasm
2 supreme verdict
1 Council's judgement

This list has come along way from my assemble the legion build. Man do I miss playing that card. Please let me know your thoughts on this more removal heavy list. Thanks.

[afedelejr]

I think this is good if your in a aggro heavy meta but im now sure I want so much removal in the main in a event like a GP. Yes delver is very present right now but there are so many decks in legacy and people live playing their pet decks so aore general main deck seems more appropriate. Just my 2 cents

[kiblast]

Alphastryk, what's the main reason behind 2 Pierces over Snares in the main? This deck doesn't apply pressure at all, Opponent can just wait 2 more turns and your pierces are easily avoided, any competent combo or control player will do that. Snares are much better, they have better targets and they are relevant until the game ends in about ANY matchup.

I also like Izzet charm in place of Misdirection for additional value/ utility. If you want a misdirection effect, I'm sure Swerve is way better considering you normally never tap out in your turn unless you are casting a win con… and you don't tourach yourself in the process.

Edit: here's where I am right now. Playing this on sunday.

Deck: Legacy Keeper

//Main
4 Ponder
2 Preordain
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Treasure Cruise
4 Brainstorm
4 Swords to Plowshares
3 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
4 Dig Through Time
4 Flooded Strand
2 Arid Mesa
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Karakas
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Council's Judgment
1 Izzet Charm
1 Moat
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Baneslayer Angel <---I switch this slot with Talrand often while testing. Still can't decide what's better although I might like Talrand better as with him I can avoid spot removals generating multiple tokens.
1 Engineered Explosives
2 Spell Snare

//Sideboard
2 Flusterstorm
1 Pithing Needle
1 Wear // Tear
1 Pyroclasm
2 Vendilion Clique
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Tormod's Crypt
1 Blue Elemental Blast
2 Kor Firewalker

[lambert101]

Yeah I am trying to hedge my bets against delver, elves, and DnT. Those 6 slots could honestly be anything. I noticed the more you play this deck your goals are trying to keep the board clean and your hand full. Other ideas I previously had included Keranos, Assemble the Legion, and Blood Moon main. Those provided to be powerful but slow. The pair of stoneforge mystic's took the place of Keranos and Assemble. Another idea would be to cut those 6 slots for 2 more Stoneforge Mystics, a Jitte, and 2 True-name as a more stoneforge build. Just trying to finalize those slots before GPNJ which I am playing this deck!

[Higgs]

I would so love this deck to be an established contender in the meta, I'm such a draw-go guy, but I still have my reservations about the current builds. I'm still watching it from a distance (as opposed to actually playing it) so my ponderings are purely theoretical, take them for what it is.
In modern magic I think a successful control deck needs two things:
* A lock (or inevitability)
* A combo kill to end the game on the spot once you have inevitability (or have defended yourself long enough) because there is no universal hard lock against Legacy.
In Miracles CounterTop is your lock and Entreat is your combo kill. In Control Lands the whole deck (and the sideboard) is focused on locking out decks and they have Marit lage as the combo kill. UB Tezz, Chalice and Bridges for the lock, Helm combo as the combo kill... etc. etc. I understand that the raw draw power of this deck along with its rogue status is providing it a huge advantage at the moment but I feel like these two things have to be introduced to the deck for it to be a lasting, established archetype.

[Chaam]

What do you guys think of taking this even more towards a vintage type deck? We can just run 4 Young Pyromancer as our win condition like the Vintage Gush Pyromancer deck does. Thoughts?

Would probably look like this:

Creatures (5)
4 Young Pyromancer
1 Snapcaster Mage

Sorceries (7)
4 Ponder
1 Preordain
1 Council's Judgement
1 Supreme Verdict

Instants (27)
4 Brainstorm
1 Lightning Bolt
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Spell Pierce
1 Flusterstorm
1 Pyroblast
4 Counterspell
1 Fire // Ice
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection
4 Dig Through Time

Lands (21)
4 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
2 Arid Mesa
3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Karakas

Sideboard (15)
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Path to Exile
1 Flusterstorm
1 Spell Pierce
1 Pithing Needle
1 Wear // Tear
1 Hydroblast
1 Pyroblast
1 Pyroclasm
1 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Containment Priest
1 Council's Judgement

[lambert101]

Another thought in the lock vain was to use the last six slots for a combination of 2 top and 3 counterbalance with a 1 of council's judgement.

[Megadeus]

Can you post your 60 preboard and postboard?


Right now my ideal 60 postboard looks like this:

3 jace

4 dig
2 cruise
4 brainstorm
4 ponder
2 preordain

4 fow
3 counterspell
3 pyroblast
1 reb

2 explosives
3 clique

4 cards ???

21 lands

can't figure out the last 4 slots, if I want it to be sfm + skull, spell pierces, or whatever :/

Swords to plowshares seems like a decent card. I hear it's pretty decent

[Higgs]

Another thought in the lock vain was to use the last six slots for a combination of 2 top and 3 counterbalance with a 1 of council's judgement.

A random thought; 3 Painter's Servant 3 Grindstone in the 6 flex spots. Easy to find both pieces with so much dig (or 'Dig' for that matter) and already have Academy Ruins for resiliency. On the downside, these cards don't do anything on their own.

[lambert101]

The painter idea would be funny. I honsetly need a lock or instant win combination with those slots. I would even be willing to make it 8 slots by cutting the 2 stoneforge mystic if necessary to create a lock control.

[Jables237]

A random thought; 3 Painter's Servant 3 Grindstone in the 6 flex spots. Easy to find both pieces with so much dig (or 'Dig' for that matter) and already have Academy Ruins for resiliency. On the downside, these cards don't do anything on their own.

Turns on REBs so we can run more. That seems fun. 1 mana counter/kill anything with a ton of draw.

[alphastryk]

While Pierce isn't great, you often need it early to protect your hand from discard or to stop early planeswalkers from the opponent. I can't think of something I would want Snare for. If people wait two turns to play around it, that seems generally good for us - we win almost any long games, and that gives us time to draw more answers. Remember - we want to aggressively trade 1-for-1 and then reload with delve spells.

Fire // Ice and Izzet Charm don't appeal to me - if I wanted removal at 2cmc I'd just move a Pyroclasm main (that might be what happens anyway).

Misdrection has been great for me - I'm tapping out pretty often early in games casting cantrips. Maybe we're just playing the deck very differently?

I've posted my maindeck a ton of times, so I'm not going to repost that again, but here's my 60 post-board vs Miracles: (not a lot of room do even do things differently, not sure how else you could board)

21 land
14 Cantips

3 Jace

1 Baneslayer
3 Clique

1 Verdict
2 EE
2 Pyroblast
1 REB
2 Pierce
3 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection
2 Flusterstorm

Pierce is important in keeping early Tops and Balances off the table, Flusterstorm and Pierce are good at making sure our Jace resolves & their Entreat does not.

It might even be right to have BEB in to fight REBs and Keranos, but that seems a bit suspect.

I'm not convinced you 'need' a lock or a combo kill to have a good deck. It feels great to get away from leaning so hard CB soft lock, which was often the worst part of Miracles for me.

This deck is much less mentally taxing to play, which is a huge upside in long tournments.

[Higgs]

The 60 I want to test first chance I get to play:

21x Lands

4x Dig through time
2x Treasure cruise
4x Brainstorm
4x Ponder
2x Preordain

4x Force of will
1x Misdirection
3x Counterspell
3x Pyroblast

4x Swords to plowshares
2x Supreme verdict

2x Jace, the mind sculptor
2x Grindstone
2x Painter's servant

The idea with the combo kill is I don't want to be a dog to stuff like 12-Post and I wouldn't want to drag games any longer than I should. Could be a terrible waste of slots but if we are already playing like a Vintage deck why not do it all the way right?

[martyrX]

Why do we want the likes of stoneforge or painter's servant in this deck? Why activate the enemy's removal? I want nothing on the board except for jace and then when the time is right, a wincon (or maybe only jace). I don't mind landing a clique, but he doesn't have to stay on the board. He can gain me life with stp or just die with the rest of the creatures to verdict and be dig fuel, or die as a blocker, or get bounced with karakas.

I always hated spell pierce in miracles (almost never ran it), but I find pierce is ok late game with this deck. Your hand is full of counters, plenty of the time i find that a counterspell + pierce or hardcast fow+pierce or even sometimes 2 X pierce gets the countering job done when you really need it.

I also find that this deck improves fow dramatically, you can use it and misdirection much more aggressively.

For now i want to find as many blue solutions as i can for the side if possible. Helping fow be effective and not having to fetch duals can be important.

Regarding kor firewalker and mary's little lamb, i think we need a solution that works vs jund and burn that is not decayable...i think i might give sphere of law a try.

[Zllig]

This deck is so crazy. I'm still not sure whether or not it's better than Miracles, but I really felt good when I played it last Friday. I went undefeated facing Bant Stoneblade, UWr Miracles, Sneak and Show, and UBr Tezzeret.

The list I played was very similar to alphastryk's since it seems pretty close to optimal to me.


3 Tundra
2 Volcanic Island
3 Island
2 Plains
1 Mountain
4 Flooded Strand
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
1 Academy Ruins

4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Engineered Explosives
1 Vedalken Shackles
1 Fire//Ice

4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection
2 Pyroblast
3 Counterspell
2 Spell Pierce

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
2 Preordain
1 Treasure Cruise
4 Dig Through Time

3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Keranos, God of Storms

Sideboard:
2 Supreme Verdict
1 Pyroclasm
1 Blood Mood
2 Tormod's Crypt
1 Wear // Tear
1 Circle of Protection: Red
3 Vendilion Clique
1 Red Elemental Blast
2 Flusterstorm
1 Pithing Needle

Sideboard was haphazardly thrown together since I was late for the event. I don't own a Moat, nor did anyone have one on them (What gives?!) so I figured I'd just play Keranos plus whatever looked most fun to me and that was Shackles. I didn't want to play Baneslayer without the Moat and I really like Keranos main in my meta even though I can see the obvious benefits of Baneslayer.

Round 1: Bant Stoneblade
These games were pretty uneventful, he never drew a Stoneforge but not having a sweeper in the main was making me sweat. However, when I resolved Shackles he scooped. The next game he scooped to my end of turn Dig Through Time plus a second Dig Through Time. That one felt real good. I really wished I had Moat in this match up, it would have been basically unbeatable.

Round 2: UWr Miracles (Rich Shay)
We play draw go for about 15 turns while I cantrip and make land drops and load my hand up with counterspells. I let him resolve a Top and for some reason he starts missing land drops. After about DI turns of doing nothing, I play a Jace and let him counter it and pass back. He tries to resolve his own but can't get through my hand of double Force of Will, Counterspell, Pierce and Pyroblast. He mutters something about me actually having all the counterspells and I tell him I don't have anything else in my deck. I resolve a Keranos the next turn and then a Jace, he spends all his turns digging for his single Council's Judgement and finally finds it. It was too late since I had dealt with 2 Jaces and 1 Entreat already and I had EE on 0 and was ready for the second Jace so he could never win. 40 minutes have passed and he concedes. He should have probably conceded when I had Jace/Keranos out since then I just played the don't die game in game 2 and turn 5 passed of turns with me having 1 card in my library after a Jace ult. The main deck EEs make this match up unbelievably easy, this was one of the matches where I was glad I had Keranos and not Baneslayer.

Round 3: Sneak and Show
I can't figure out what he's on as he's stuck on Volc and only casting Ponders. I get 1 Force in my hand and Ponder and see Counterspell, Island, Force of Will. I thought he was probably on UR delver with a bad hand so I took the Counterspell with the Island then Force. Turns out he goes land, petal, Show and Tell and I force, he forces back and I'm dead to an Emrakul. I guess I should have taken the second Force but I really wanted to be able to make my next land drop and leave Counterspell up. Games 2 and 3 I counter all his spells and kill him with a Jace and Clique respectively.

Round 4: UBr Tezzeret (Undomain on here)
We split, but play games for the extra pack. He keeps some weak hands since these were low stakes but I manage to beat him. If he had kept real hands I still don't think I was much of an underdog. Having Counterspell and Forces lets me stop his Walkers and main threats, while the main deck EEs let me get out of Chalice locks and prevent him from killing me directly with Thopter Foundry.

This deck is really tugging on my heart strings. I can't decide whether this is actually better than Miracles or not, and that's not the way I want to be thinking a few days before Jersey. I also don't think I can handle playing this deck for 10+ rounds, at least I know with Miracles that I have a win condition that usually wins in one swing. On the other hand cantripping is slightly easier than topping.

Edit - Forgot Fire//Ice in main deck

[AnziD]

I've posted my maindeck a ton of times, so I'm not going to repost that again, but here's my 60 post-board vs Miracles: (not a lot of room do even do things differently, not sure how else you could board)

21 land
14 Cantips

3 Jace

1 Baneslayer
3 Clique

1 Verdict
2 EE
2 Pyroblast
1 REB
2 Pierce
3 Counterspell
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection
2 Flusterstorm

So here are a couple of my thoughts:

1) I want more ways to kill a resolved Jace.
2) Pierce has surprising utility in that it can stop delve spells that are cast off of 4+ mana
3) What's the verdict for?

[lambert101]

How good is moat? I was looking at the deck and thinking man if I did not have all of these board wipes I could play moat main with some cliques. In that same vain is bainslayer worth it? Just trying to get ready for GPNJ.