That's really unfortunate. I was looking forward to playing with GSZ and the toolbox feel of KotR definitely appealed to me as well.Originally Posted by screallix
DnT is very boring imo. No card draw, very linear. But that's depending on what you want. Maverick just makes fun. It isn't T1 but you get rewarded for playing it a long time and getting experience. Let's wait how the meta changes.
Wait, doesn't this mean that siege rhino main deck become much more attractive? BG coming back? Can't decay, trample over tnn, can fight most goys, races pretty hard at 4 mana seems like this new meta favors us. Plus, with swiftspear, red will still be around. I believe there were several SCG top 8 before cruise.
I'm going to run mainboard Sigarda now because Liliana is going to have a comeback. Hexproof, flyer and I can't be forced to Sac, seems ideal.
If Miracles does become #1 again, then elves is a bad choice. The Top + Counterbalance lock is back breaking for them.
Except Elves was still a DTB the entire time Miracles was pounding the format. The only way it'll change is if people can manage their sideboards/Teegs properly across the format to hate it out.
Elves running Abrupt Decay / Krosan Grips so counterbalance isnt hard to break - there is other scary card in Miracles vs Elves - Terminus.
I think its time to back to Punishing Maverick while Liliana & Shardless back on action.
I think it's too soon to tell exactly what the best decks will be as I suspect other cards and decks may impact the format that we can not yet fathom. Maverick is a perfectly fine choice for a deck to play in Legacy as Maverick will always have a fighting chance with any deck in the room. I predict that the raw power level of Treasure Cruise leaving the format, and UR delver leaving the format, Punishing Maverick will be a great choice to pilot in the future.
Don't forget Elves also got Reclamation Sage a little while back. Elves can now just GSZ to break the countertop-lock. It might be time to put it back in the maindeck. Terminus is still brutal though. But Miracles can still be a bitch for Elves, yeah.
Maverick will likely still be a fine deck. I think the inclusion of the DD combo has really given it an edge. Delver is still going to exist in the format.
Miracles became a better deck because the rest of the format lost Cruise and it got to keep DTT, as did Sneak and Omni. So, what does this mean? Teeg. Maverick is one of the few decks that gets to run Teeg Safekeeper lock, so you've got a distinct advantage there.
As for Rhino, you could be playing him, but I think Knight is your horse here. There are better Rhino decks (Nic Fit), and I think y'all should be fine 20/20'ing people.
UR Cruise can be a tricky matchup since you can attrition them then lose to topdeck Cruise. The Delver decks will be RUG which was still a player last week, but BUG will come back. Hymn isn't terribly good against a deck where everything is a bear and they can't get rid of the 20/20.
TL: DR Maverick stays being fine, just like always. You just have to tune to bits for your meta.
I will say this: If you think you've got enough Teegs, add 2 more then ask again.
This might be a place to start:
4 Knight of the Reliquary
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Qasali Pridemage
1 Birds of Paradise
2 Noble Hierarch
2 Deathrite Shaman
1 Scryb Ranger
1 Sylvan Safekeeper
1 Gaddock Teeg
4 Mother of Runes
1 Courser of Kruphix
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Sigarda, Host of Herons
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Sylvan Library
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Windswept Heath
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Forest
1 Plains
3 Savannah
1 Bayou
1 Scrubland
1 Dark Depths
1 Thespian's Stage
4 Wasteland
1 Karakas
2 Krosan Grip
2 Gaddock Teeg
2 Carpet of Flowers
2 Zealous Persecution
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Pithing Needle
3 Thoughtseize
-Matt
I'm letting my Noob flag fly here but what's the Teeg Safekeeper lock?
Sylvan Safekeeper can sacrifice lands to protect Gaddock Teeg. Since Miracles' only removal spell to remove a Teeg is either Karakas (not played much in winning lists) or STP, you can keep him forever. They would have to have more Plows in one turn than you have lands. Terminus, Entreat, Jace, EE, DTT are all off when Teeg is in play.
Just make sure you don't attack when they have mana open. Snapcaster is a hell of an ambush viper.
Got it, thanks!
Remember narrow answer which many times can occur, specially after sideboard - Pyroclasm and Council's Judgement - we can't stop that so there are two ways:
- Don't overextend and be prepared for assamble second teeg
- Rush if you suppose that he doesn't have it
But I already run three!
These are the trump cards that continue to haunt me. More specifically, Council's Judgement kills me. I've had games where I locked the table under Mom + Teeg + something else ----> CJ kills Teeg ---> Terminus on my upkeep --> GG.
As far as I know, nothing stops this from occurring unless I also have Revokers out. Revoker sucked against a lot of the TC field. We'll see how the meta shifts. People are also telling me to reconsider Spirit of the Laybrinths. Maybe have "all the bears" post-board?
Post-TC meta: Miracles
-4 STP
-1 Thalia (#4)
+1 Teeg (#2)
+2 Spirit
+2 flex [revoker, k-grip, pridemage, sword X&Y]
@sdematt:
I've squared off against Dig Through Time only once or twice (vs. UWx control) and it's honestly the most ridiculous card drawing/filter. If Miracles starts picking that card up in bulk, I'm screwed.
If you're playing against Miracles players who are not running at least 1-2 of that card, they're doing it wrong.
You can use mother of Runes to protect Teeg from Pyroclasm if you get it, or just Equip SOFI. Unforts, Council's Judgment does good work and there's nothing we can do. Thats why creating an EOT 20/20 is also good :)
-Matt
Slaughter Games. Completely shuts down Miracles because you can just call Entreat the Angels and make sure you stay ontop of Jace. I know that's not the answer you're looking for as we don't play both black and red, but being able to strip away their wincon with a "cannot be countered" attached to it feels very good to resolve. I've been messing around with Nic Fit in smaller weekday tournaments and boy I wish I could find a way to jam that card into our deck.
I personally don't like the dark depths combo in our deck. People on this thread have complained that having dryad arbor in your opening hand is the worst. Dark Depths is even more so. Also, with our deck I feel like we can lose to ourselves if we get the wrong mana configuration and this further increases the chances of that happening. To each their own. The best part about this deck is that there really is no "Stock List". You can add your own flare and tweak the deck to better battle your specific meta.
A strange topic which I thought I would bring up. A friend and I were talking about Meddling Mage and how he really should have been G/W. Blue having access to a hate bear in it's color just doesn't seem right.
Last edited by DudeItsCorey; 01-21-2015 at 12:46 PM.
It's not hard to running Punishing Version with Shaman's and 1 Bayou, also as I said before Engineered Explosives also keep in check EtA.
While I like EE, it's worse against miracles than it looks. Holding 2-mana open all the time to catch EoT angels slows you down quite a bit, in a deck that can't afford to over-extend and has equips.
I'd suggest Deed. My Nic Fit days tell me that it's pretty good for miracles since they have to extend enough for you to Pop it, or they have to win via Jace.
On a more general note--which of these is better as a sideboard card at an SCGOpen type event? (Big + Relatively Unknown Meta)
Engineered Explosives
Toxic Deluge
Pernicious Deed
(Assume the SB already runs 2 Zealous Persecutions and 2 Abrupt Decay with 4 Pridemages in the 75)
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