I've seen this here over and over again. People asking/using for someone's exact 75. Why are you guys over and over again copy pasting someone's list? I mean why aren't you just find your own list? It doesn't make much sense copying someone's list because their list are fitted on their playstyle and preference. So just sit down and build your own list which fits for your own playstyle. And if you're just to lazy to build your own one, then you have not understood this game imo. Just my 2 cents.
Hello,
For a German tournement I would sugest to leave moat out of you Sideboard and prepare for Combo and Control Decks. If you want something against creatures I sugest Humility since its deals with the most problematic creatures but in General both are just to clunky to play.Zodiac_Dragon
I prepare my deck for a local tourment on next saturday.
What do you guys think: Is Moat a valid option for the SB in the current Meta? If so: What card should I replace with it? (Using Ein's list) 3. Clique? CJ?
This is easy. The reason why people are coping the list is that with some minor adjustments it is the best list you can get for the given deck. The current Miracles list is incredibly consistent and as such there is not much room to improve. So as a result if you want to play the best possible list you copy it becaue chances are high that you selfbrewed list is worse than the published ones.index
I've seen this here over and over again. People asking/using for someone's exact 75. Why are you guys over and over again copy pasting someone's list? I mean why aren't you just find your own list? It doesn't make much sense copying someone's list because their list are fitted on their playstyle and preference. So just sit down and build your own list which fits for your own playstyle. And if you're just to lazy to build your own one, then you have not understood this game imo.
Btw after testing I sugest to play 3 digs not only 2.. Also3 Snap Casters are not needed. They are to clunky at the start and a a bad topdeck if you just played dig the turn before.
Best regards Teveshszat
Because not everyone can devote a large amount of time to testing and sometimes a stock list can provide someone who plays infrequently a tuned option with less effort? I know I'd rather have a proven list than something I theorycrafted, and I copied successful lists for a long time as a way to really understand how the deck works and to appreciate the value of any options I have in deck construction.Originally Posted by index
If I'm OK with knowing that I'm not the best player, why add an unnecessary step to the already steep learning curve of the deck?
EDIT: (Adding to post to avoid double-posting)
For anybody trying a sideboard Cavern of Souls in the legendary build - what do you think of playing a Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir out of the board? Previously I found it too slow to matter against most decks in the format, but right now it seems the number of Miracles and OmniTell decks is pretty high. Against the mirror you can resolve your Jace without contest and turn every counterspell into Last Word, against Omni if you use Cavern to cast it they are forced to Cunning Wish on the spot or during their main phase to get Wipe Away (which might not even work if you've set up Counterbalance lock), and against Shardless BUG it can shut down Cascade and is difficult to kill outside of Liliana of the Veil and Maelstrom Pulse. The downside to it obviously being that it costs a lot of mana, and you can cast more generically powerful spells at that point on the curve.
Last edited by winglerw28; 04-29-2015 at 11:37 AM.
OK here's a weird one; does anyone know the Stax matchup well? I'm in a league and my next match is against a really weird brew running Trinisphere/Smokestack/Chalices, but also Nyx-Fleece Ram and a Stoneforge package with no Jitte and 3 Batterskulls? I can post a decklist if anyone wants to see it, but it's such an odd setup I'm not really sure whether to treat it like a Stoneblade deck or a Prison deck.
It depends on the build. His sounds like it might be an easier matchup for miracles. A local guy here plays it with 4 Haunted Platemail, elspeth and Manlands as the win cons and I am like 0-6 vs it.
EDIT: and he has maindeck armegeddons.
I disagree, so much. I'm actually certain Ein (as well as Tomás) disagree, considering they stated they'd rather go +1 snapcaster than -1.
Dig is bad on the starthand, where as Snapcaster is fine. If it comes to that, you can even flashback your Digs with Snapcaster.
Found it, the closest analogy is the list Caleb Durward 4-0'd a daily with a few weeks ago (seen here: http://www.twitch.tv/calebdmtg/v/4025872?t=2h52m36s).
I'd like to make this list but I only have 2x Clique right now.
What would you replace the 3rd Clique with? Another Pyroblast? Counterspell? 4th StP? DTT?
Pretty sweet UW only version featuring Back to Basics: http://southfloridamagic.com/legacy-top-8-results/
Not having access to the blasts doesn't seem great, nor does the lack of Ponder, but still a very interesting list. B2B, while not as much of a lock as Blood Moon, can just steal a game.
It's South Florida, based on the coverage, that local meta has plenty of MUD and Post decks (might be related to the number of dual lands available in that area), and BtB just wreck them. Like you've mentioned, there are other Miracles decks in the Top 8 do have Red Blast effect cards; how horrible of a pilot do you have to be in South Florida, with you running Red Blast effects in your 75 and yet you still lost to another pilot who doesn't have the access?
How they beat that BUG Delver deck in the finals is beyond me. There are so many cards we care about in G1. They even have Time Walk in the sideboard.
EDIT: The 3rd Clique is probably best as a Snapcaster.
I'm playing 4 Dig/2 Snaps BTW. I've also cut Entreat the Angels. We'll see how confidant I am about this whole thing when I either do or do not have a box of Modern Masters 2 this Sunday.
The conspiracy goes deeper than you might think.Can I pay you for not posting in this thread?
More questions! VS Esper Stoneblade, is Clique better than Flusterstorm? I know if we see Lingering Souls that Clique is just bad, but what if we don't?
Pros of Fluster:
Counters Discard
Counters DTT
Fights against their Flusterstorms
Pros of VC:
Pressures their walkers
Disrupts their hand
A la Philipp:
"Vendilion Clique does not line up well against Lingering Souls at all and also cannot deal with the real threats of the lategame: a creature + Sword of Fire and Ice or True-Name Nemesis. You could insist on keeping Vendilion Cliques instead of maybe one Entreat the Angels and a Counterspell and try to take over the game earlier than normal, but I would advise sticking to the eight cards that I mentioned before simply because Clique's strength lies in the ability to deal with their Jace, the Mind Sculptor, but those are already somewhat negated by the Red Elemental Blasts that are coming in."
Vs Esperblade Clique are very hard choise imho.
If we play Clique in EOT, after Liliana resolved...well...this is godd stuff...
But Clique suffer Souls...
Imho this is dependant by the number of Blast effect we have in sideboard.
If we have 2 Blast effect, maybe one Clique can help us vs Jace (and Lili)...If we play 3 Blast effect maybe we don't need Clique...and Flusterstorm is good.
Being able to run Lingering Souls seems like one of the main reasons to run Esper, as opposed to UWR or straight UW. As you say, Clique is really good at EOT against a Liliana, or in response to a Stoneforge activation, but both of those are relatively early-game plays from Esper, so you'd have to run out your Clique on turn 3-4, straight into Souls, at which point it's basically blanked. I think the longer the game goes, the more advantaged Miracles is, so jamming an early Clique seems to be the opposite of that plan. I wouldn't bring them in in this matchup unless I was running a Karakas to recur them with.
Is Enchantress really that bad of a MU for us? It's been a deck I would love to own on the side when I get bored of Miracles so I was browsing their primer and they say Miracles is a very favorable MU for them.
It's not. It's pretty much a trolling deck in the sense that its late-game can crush Miracles because it runs 59 bad cards and an Emrakul. It's only a problem for Miracles when multiple cards that has the name Enchantress in them have resolved. One is only cycling, doesn't do anything if they're forced to put down confinement.
1. Stop anything that has Enchantress in the card name from resolving.
2. Don't get blown out by Choke.
3. Don't drag the game to late game, Enchantress might just have 15 Mana and find Emrakul.
LOL. This is like the best "funny but true" MU analysis I've ever read. Reminds of why my friend who loves playing Enchantress sometimes calls it a deck full of "bad enchantments". Good job, seriously
In regards to Legacy:
Lol. Last time I played vs Enchantress they drew 3 enduring ideals in a row... Only so many times I was able to counter it. Then all of my spells became 1/1 birds a la dovescape. I did miracle entreat for like, 9 tokens though. Not quite as powerful as I'd like when they get to make 7 / turn.LOL. This is like the best "funny but true" MU analysis I've ever read. Reminds of why my friend who loves playing Enchantress sometimes calls it a deck full of "bad enchantments". Good job, seriously
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
If you are not playing a mountain, it doesn't matter what your 4 non-white fetch-lands are right? 4 Scalding tarn seems industry standard but I'm thinking that it does not really matter since you will only be using the Island half of your tarns. Would it be better to play some deltas to get around needle/extraction, or will an informed opponent see the delta and then aggressively wasteland your volcs since they know you don't have a mountain? Or are the margins for all of this stuff too small and I'm wasting my energy thinking about it?
It doesn't REALLY matter per say, but it depends on how you like to play the early game. One of my favourite lines is tarn -> fetch -> island -> ponder, as it leaves the array of decks I could be playing very large, and helps to hide information from my opponent. So, it really depends on what decks are in the metagame, and what T1 / T2 plays you have in your deck.
They banned Top, so now I play Grixis Delver.
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