you keep in all your punishing fires?Originally Posted by Dice_Box
I assume for Young Pyromancer, but not sure if you need all 4? It might just be better to leave the Tabernacle in and side out all the fires. Or leave in 2 fires, hard to tell.
To be honest, I hate being swarmed. I guess I could cut two for the other Spheres. In hindsight I like that.
On reflection, I think I would cut only one. I sometimes have horrible luck with my Dredges and I do like having more Fires to hit.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
So if I am playing David Longs 9th place list from this weekend this is what I am doing
+4 Trinisphere
+3 Sphere of Resistance
+1 Choke
+4 Krosan Grip
+1 Dark Depths
-4 Punsihing Fire
-3 Maze of Ith
-2 Wasteland
-2 Life from the Loam
-1 Glacial Chasm
-1 Manabond
Here are my thoughts. You basically die in two ways.
1st: A resolved Show and Tell into whatever. Great players with Show and Tell into Omni into Omni and kill you with whatever sequence cards they have available. If you have a 3sphere you should hold it to place that off the S&T and hope to K-grip the Omni next turn or make Lage and race which is the why the move to the 4 3sphere in the most updated lists for this weekend. The show and tell line is what is what is going to kill you the most, like 80 present of the time and its really hard for this deck to interact with consistently. Cards like P-Fire, Loam, Wasteland don't have any impact here and they create more inconsistency with what your game plan is hence why they get trimmed or cut.
2nd: young Pyromancer if they bring it in. I don't think most Omni players won't bring this in because they show and tell plan is so good in this matchup and creature are notoriously bad against us but if they do you can race, 3sphere slows them down and Young doesn't doesn't interact with Marit Lage. I leave a Taberancle to hedge if this is there strategy with because with the 4 Gamble and 4 Crop rotation you can always find it if you need it and those cards have other applications in the match-up this maximizes what you game plan which is to disrupt and make a Lage token.
** this was edited to clarify some points.
You know, it's only now I am starting to see how little I think about cutting Glacial Chasm. Humm. I might need to reflect on my style of play.
Thanks for the write up.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles...ted-2015-06-29
1 mana seismic assault that costs 1 red to activate. I'm not currently looking for that effect but I'm definitely trying this over seismic assault the next time I want to play with that style of card.
Have you seen this? now every land you hold is a Punishing Fire?...
It's like Loaming back PF
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/cards/ma...-molten-vortex
I think it will help make Aggro Loam more playable. Not sure if it has a real home with this deck because it is so mana intensive. Its much better then Siesmic Assault for the people still playing that.
Yep. Seen it. Like it. Adding it to the Primer in the next hour or two.
For those interested:
The three red on Assault is prohibitive without Moon down. But if someone drops a Moon you have all the mana you need to feed this thing. Outside of that, it grants you a much easier and faster effect on the table. It might cost more over time yes, but its far far easier to get on the table and that is something I think will make all the difference here.
Edit:
I forgot to charge my laptop. Will edit tomorrow after I put my tax return in.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
-3 Maze of Ith
-1 Tabernacle
-4 Punishing Fire
-1 Glacial Chasm
-1 Wasteland
-1 Manabond (down to 0)
-1 Bojuka Bog
-1 Life from the Loam
-1 Dark Depths
+2 Red elemental blast
+4 sphere of resistance
+4 krosan grip
+3 goblin rabblemaster
+1 trinisphere
This is my current plan. I need to test more.
♀
Assuming M-Blue:
- 1 Tabernacle
- 1 Chasm
- 2 Waste
- 2 Bond
- 3 Maze
- 3 P-Fire
+ 2 Choke
+ 2 3sphere
+ 4 K-Grip
+ 4 SoR
"Be it ever so crumbled, there's no place like home."
RGCL (GQ)
Youtube-playlist dedicated to RGCL
Regarding Molten Vortex.Yep. Seen it. Like it. Adding it to the Primer in the next hour or two.
For those interested:
The three red on Assault is prohibitive without Moon down. But if someone drops a Moon you have all the mana you need to feed this thing. Outside of that, it grants you a much easier and faster effect on the table. It might cost more over time yes, but its far far easier to get on the table and that is something I think will make all the difference here.
Edit:
I forgot to charge my laptop. Will edit tomorrow after I put my tax return in.
1. Getting it down early doesn't matter as you will only be boarding it in vs decks that intend to Bloodmoon.
2. If you do get it down early 4/10 of your Red sources give them life so the rate on this is significantly worse without Bloodmoon in play.
3. Seismic Assault costs 3. This is incredibly relevant when one of the 4 decks that can possibly bring Bloodmoon in vs us runs Counterbalance.
Remember Assault is a sideboard card and therefore this new effect has to better in respects to the board.
On the topic of boarding against Omnitell:
Yesterday, I played against Omnitell in a little Legacy event. This is how I boarded:
-1 Tabernacle
-1 Glacial Chasm
-3 Maze of Ith
-3 Punishing Fire (playing thirty-five lands and three Fires instead of thirty-four lands and four Fires)
-3 Wasteland
-1 Life from the Loam
-2 Manabond (I think it is correct to board out Manabond in every matchup.)
+4 Krosan Grip
+4 Sphere of Resistance
+3 Chalice of the Void (played Chalice instead of Thorn or Trinisphere; still have mixed feelings about it)
+2 Choke
+1 Dark Depths (running three mainboard)
Lost the first game. Won the second with a first turn, uncountered Chalice on one. Lost the third game on a mull to five (although a combination of Krosan Grip in hand and a Karakas on board stalled the game long enough to give me a vain hope of winning).
In the future, I think I would only board in two Krosan Grip, since it really only slows the game. It isn't a lock or anything. Since he'd seen my hand with a Git Probe, my opponent simply kept cantripping until he found a second Omniscience to play off of the one he put on the battlefield with Show and Tell. Chalice was certainly awesome, but when I really wanted it to shine (against two Miracles matchups later in the tournament), it didn't. Choke I never saw, so I'm not certain how good it would have been.
In the same tournament, I faced a Painted Stone deck (winning the second game on the back of Chalice but still losing the match), and then two Miracles matchups, the first of which went to a draw after an overlong first game, and the second of which I conceded after winning the first game and losing the second with about ten minutes left for the third. I wanted to go home. I saw Chalice in all the boarded games in the two Miracles matchups, yet the boarded games were the ones I lost. I primarily chose Chalice over Thorn of Amethyst since I thought it had some application against Miracles, but it actually felt really lackluster. Will probably switch those to Trinispheres. Overall, a horrible room yesterday for Lands. Of the eight people there, two were playing Painted Stone, one was playing Storm, two were playing Miracles, one was on Omnitell, and the seventh was on Dreadstill. Ugh.
On Molten Vortex:
While I actually think it is better than Seismic Assault (costing one mana means it gets under Legacy's various counterspells a lot easier, and the one mana activation cost is almost a non-issue), I still think it doesn't warrant a space in the board for the simple fact that you don't want to board into graveyard-reliant cards when your opponent is at the same time boarding into graveyard-hate cards. Doing so just makes their boarding decisions better. Primeval Titan or Oracle of Mul Daya seem like much better choices, though of course they have little application against Blood Moon decks (which we're likely to lose against even with Molten Vortex or Seismic Assault). Hammer of Purphoros actually seems more viable too, since the sacrificed land turns into a creature that the opponent probably has to deal with instead of just two damage.
On Molten Vortex:
We might want to give this card a try in the maindeck, as x1 or x2 (for testing). Pre-board it is great against Miracle, against DRS, against D&T, and even against Planeswalkers. It's also another wincon, or a piece of control, and can also work without Loam (especially against Miracle). Actually, it's great against almost every non-combo deck. Anyway, I want to try this card maindeck and I will do it.
Hence, my question for you guys is: what should we take out (x2) to play this in the 60/61 (assuming we're playing a DavidLong-esque list, without any color-splash)?
It would probably makes sense to go to "only" 3 P.fire. Could we try to take some Crop Rotation out (assuming we're playing 4)? Or even the Manabounds?
IN:
+ 2 Molten Vortex
OUT:
- 0/1/2 Manabound
- 0/1 Crop Rotation
- 0/1 Punishing Fire
(These are maindeck changes, I'm not talking about sideboarding here!)
What would be your in/out for this?
So is the deck you're playing, Molten Vortex seems unnecessary in fair matchups.
And as Sibelius pointed out earlier in the thread, vs miracles (which is the only 'fair' MU you remotely care about preboard) the 1CMC vs 3CMC is very relevant.
I see it exclusively as a sideboard card that would be used in the same way Assault is. It's just also a touch more flexible thanks to its CMC. Against Miracles, I would rather other cards.
It is better to ask and look stupid then keep your mouth shut and remain so.
I hope your afterlife is filled with eternal torment.
Fuck. Which one of my quotes do I drop for this?
Seems like Miracles is actually a pretty good matchup for this deck if you play Trinisphere and Choke in the sideboard. I was watching David Long just man-handle a Miracles player the other day at the Premiere IQ with that combination. I was initially surprised to see him bring in the Trinispheres vs. Miracles as I pegged it purely as combo-hate, but it locks them out of the game in combination with Ports, Wastelands, and the Choke.
The first game versus Miracles can take awhile. Counterbalance with 2 on top of the deck seems like the worst thing that can happen.
"Everything is better topless"
So you're saying that the replacement cards for Molten Vortex maindeck are better than Vortex. You are probably right. But still, as I said, I'd want to try it as a maindeck option, so...which cards would you guys take out for 2 Vortex MD? Because that was the main point of my post, and I would like to hear the opinion of others Land players about that!
I don't think it's better than either, but for testing purposes I can see a P Fire and Crop being reasonable cuts as the deck still functions the same with one less of each.So you're saying that the replacement cards for Molten Vortex maindeck are better than Vortex. You are probably right. But still, as I said, I'd want to try it as a maindeck option, so...which cards would you guys take out for 2 Vortex MD? Because that was the main point of my post, and I would like to hear the opinion of others Land players about that!
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