[Primer] R/G Lands

[Dice_Box]

Bummer.

Hate that match-up.

[Chatto]

Aaaah too late to watch, I will take a look later this week.

Played a small tournament today. There were 20 people. The list:

RGCL

Spells (16)
4 Crop Rotation
4 Punishing Fire
4 Life from the Loam
4 Gamble

Other Spells (10)
2 Manabond
4 Exploration
4 Mox Diamond

Lands (34)
1 Forest
1 Karakas
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Glacial Chasm
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
2 Tranquil Thicket
2 Taiga
3 Maze of Ith
3 Dark Depths
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Grove of the Burnwillows

Sideboard (15)
1 Boseiju, Who Shelters All
1 Bojuka Bog
2 Choke
3 Trinisphere
4 Sphere of Resistance
4 Krosan Grip

The rounds:

R1 Jamie (12th at GP Lille) with ANT, 1-2 L

Not much to say. Jamie told me he kept a good hand when facing Burn or Goblins, for we know eachother for some time now, and I have played against him with those two decks. Imagine his surprise Against all odds I win the first game. In game two and three he shows he knows how to play ANT. I made big error by not siding in Bog, and unfortunately did not see any hate. I did draw a 3Sphere, which he took with Duress.

R2 Tim with 4c Delver. 1-2 L.

Here's a interesting scenario: he has two Delvers, Shaman, some cantrips, and instants/ sorceries in the GY. I have the combo assembled, together with some lands: Waste, Taiga among others. I'm on eight, he has to kill me or will face Marit Lage. He goes all in, I make a token, he plays Submerge... Too eager, not paying attention cost me the game.

R3 Jordy with Shardless Bug, 2-1(?) W

Not much to say, other than playing thight was what won me the game. It was rather amusing giving him 10+ life with Grove.

R4 Balthasar with DnT, 1-0-1 W

Game one ends rather quickly, game two goes on and on: he has RiP in play, so I decide to slow-roll this one. He manage to get me to six, I make a Witch, he plows, aaaaand we start all over again. I do manage to get RiP off the board, play Tabernacle, two Maze, and Port to keep his mana/ creatures in check. He slowly eats my lifetotal away. We go to time, I make a Witch, he plows again. Aaaaand back to square one, and 26 life. I'm able to assemble the combo, but as we are already out of time, it's a draw.

Balthasar played the new taxing pony Vryn Wingmare, which is a pretty annoying card. Still, having acces to a lot of mana, and him not drawing Port or Waste made me not worry to much. But it should be dealt with right away.

R5 Niek with Shardless Bug, 2-0 W

Game one brings me Manabond, LftL, and Wasteland. Needless to say he never got to keep lands, and he concedes rather quickly. Not knowing what he is playing ( I only saw Bayou, and U-Sea, so had a hunch) I only board some K-Grips. Game two takes a bit longer. I play it safe, not knowing what he's up to. I manage to safely keep LftL running (having Thicket as an emergency-brake), despite the fact of a Shaman online. He then procedes to build up pressure through creatures and Waste. I manage to waste one Waste. I then Loam back a DD, play it to bait a second Waste later in the game, which he quickly removes from the game with Shaman. Unknown to Niek at that point, I already had a second DD in hand. Just when he thinks he has the game, I play DD, and at the end of his turn...

So... 3-2, good enough for 7th place. Unfortunately, there's only a T4. Still, felt good to play the deck, and while I'm not there yet the deck starts to feel more familiar.

[barcode]

I was very surprised to see David Long's sideboard choices on SCG coverage for his Temur Delver match. I always cut my Crop Rotations because Delver plays so much countermagic that having Rotation countered sets you so far behind (and it's probably unrecoverable).

Do other people leave Crop Rotation in their deck in that matchup? My sideboard plan is:

-3 Crop Rotation
-1 Manabond (I only play 1)

+2 Chalice of the Void
+1 Choke
+1 Trinisphere

If I suspect equipment or a Relic of Progenitus or Sulfuric Vortex that I have to deal with I cut Glacial Chasm for a K-Grip.

[Chatto]

I was very surprised to see David Long's sideboard choices on SCG coverage for his Temur Delver match. I always cut my Crop Rotations because Delver plays so much countermagic that having Rotation countered sets you so far behind (and it's probably unrecoverable).

Do other people leave Crop Rotation in their deck in that matchup? My sideboard plan is:

-3 Crop Rotation
-1 Manabond (I only play 1)

+2 Chalice of the Void
+1 Choke
+1 Trinisphere

If I suspect equipment or a Relic of Progenitus or Sulfuric Vortex that I have to deal with I cut Glacial Chasm for a K-Grip.

I always keep CR in. Yesterday I only boarded +2 Choke, -2 Manabond. Sometimes I will take out -2 Tranquil Thicket, and -1 Karakas for +3 K-Grip.

I really never considered taking CR out.

EDIT: thinking about it, I have no idea what Timur Delver is, hahaha. I was reffering to 4c Delver.

[Crimhead]

I always cut my Crop Rotations because Delver plays so much countermagic that having Rotation countered sets you so far behind (and it's probably unrecoverable).

Do other people leave Crop Rotation in their deck in that matchup? My sideboard plan is:

Most of Delver's counter-magic is the soft, taxing sort which we can play around. When they have no lands at all they can only play force (and we can almost always recover against a landless Delver opponent). They can't even cast Force without land when there is a Sphere up!

I think I've only lost one match to Thresh, and I screwed it up. You can probably board however you want (within reason).

[UnsungHero]

Lands just rocked Grixis Delver 2-0 on camera in some rather quick games. I believe lands may be in the t8 of SCGDC.

[barcode]

Lands just rocked Grixis Delver 2-0 on camera in some rather quick games. I believe lands may be in the t8 of SCGDC.

Damn! I was hoping it would slide under the radar before Champs!

[Sibelius]

Good afternoon,

Both Daryl Ayers and David Long had Molten Vortex in their sideboards. Do we have any data on how those cards performed? I'm assuming they were testing a replacement for Seismic Assault in the Bloodmoon matchups, with the upside of it being an easier to cast removal spell when we need a fifth Pfire.

They were also both playing a 4th Dark Depths rather than what I have come to think of as the standard three. Is this because we need to increase the chance of naturally drawing the combo vs miracles going long and having a combo opener vs fast combo game 1 ? I like a Boseiju out of the side to accompany the Chokes if I am very worried about Miracles.

Is four fetchlands now the norm? Even with 3 I have found I often get to the point very early where I have nothing to fetch for. (as did David when he cracked his fetch with the Taigas in the grave and the forest on the board. He looked so sad I wanted to give him a hug through the screen ) I understand they are there to ensure Green on turn one. But is the chance of mulligan increased so much by swapping that 4th fetch for a useful mana producer or utility land like Ghost quarter or even Horizon canopy (if we want to maintain green count) ?

Sphere of resistance seems to have left the sideboard as well. I agree totally with 4 trinisphere. It is a beating against omni and amazing if we get the time to land it vs storm. I am also aware of the slight nonbo with Sphere and Trinisphere.

Cheers in advance for some hopefully good discussion.

[barcode]

I can't fathom playing fewer than three Tiagas. Watching one Ayers trying to Punishing Fire down creatures and lacking red sources was a sad thing indeed.

I saw the Molten Vortex in action on camera and it wasn't impressive, it could have been a factor of his Loams being extracted or just getting overwhelmed by tokens. Overall I wasn't super impressed by the showering. It gets under countermagic more easily than Seismic Assault but I don't think Seismic Assault or Molten Vortex would have been good in that game.

[Whitefaces]

Does anyone know what happened in the T8 match vs Shaheen? Why did Daryl scoop?

[supremePINEAPPLE]

I can't fathom playing fewer than three Tiagas. Watching one Ayers trying to Punishing Fire down creatures and lacking red sources was a sad thing indeed.

I saw the Molten Vortex in action on camera and it wasn't impressive, it could have been a factor of his Loams being extracted or just getting overwhelmed by tokens. Overall I wasn't super impressed by the showering. It gets under countermagic more easily than Seismic Assault but I don't think Seismic Assault or Molten Vortex would have been good in that game.

I've been on three taigas for a long time now and I haven't ever wanted to go back. It makes closing out games with punishing fire a bit more realistic as well as preventing feel bad moments like David Long had when he tried to fetch with his forest in play and both taigas in the bin. I think the third taiga is way better than the fourth fetch and would like to hear some opposing view points since it's not even close for me personally.

[Chatto]

Now I'm curious: what does your manabase look like?

Regarding 3Sphere vs SoR: I have a lot of competent Storm-plagers in my meta. 3 Sphere is just too slow. I do see the appeal of dropping SoR.

[Dice_Box]

Playing with a 3 Dual base, mine looks like this:

1 Forest
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
3 Fetches
3 Taiga
1 Tranquil Thicket
4 Mox

I feel like when hedging against Storm you need speed. If your dropping Spheres for 3spheres, add Chalices.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

I'm playing the same as dice except with an additional tranquil which I'm guessing is in the place of a utility land (I'm running bog and karakas in the side right now).

[Crimhead]

I think the third taiga is way better than the fourth fetch and would like to hear some opposing view points since it's not even close for me personally.

The benefit of the fourth fetch over a third Taiga is that we can fetch our basic vs a Moon deck. I'm not saying this makes it better overall; we have to weight the pros and cons.

The density of Moon decks in your meta should be the biggest deciding factor I think.

[barcode]

Now I'm curious: what does your manabase look like?

Regarding 3Sphere vs SoR: I have a lot of competent Storm-plagers in my meta. 3 Sphere is just too slow. I do see the appeal of dropping SoR.

My mana producers:

4 Mox Diamond
3 Fetches
3 Taiga
1 Forest
3 Tranquil Thicket
4 Wasteland
4 Thespian's Stage
4 Rishadan Port
4 Grove of the Burnwillows
1 Bojuka Bog (hey, it makes mana)
1 Karakas

I will never play fewer than 3 Taigas.

[Dice_Box]

You can say we have hit the stage with a bang now, people want to ban us:

http://www.starcitygames.com/article...Solutions.html

(Yes, that list is playing a playset of Tabernacle.)

[barcode]

You can say we have hit the stage with a bang now, people want to ban us:

http://www.starcitygames.com/article...Solutions.html

(Yes, that list is playing a playset of Tabernacle.)

I can't take what he says seriously; I've seen him commentating in the booth.

[supremePINEAPPLE]

The benefit of the fourth fetch over a third Taiga is that we can fetch our basic vs a Moon deck. I'm not saying this makes it better overall; we have to weight the pros and cons.

The density of Moon decks in your meta should be the biggest deciding factor I think.

I sort of meant beyond the obvious. Thanks for explaining blood moon though...

[lavafrogg]

Another lands top 8... still under the radar?