I like the idea of playing Eldrazi Displacer in this deck. It gives you an out to stuff like Marit Lage and Emrakul, and breaks ground stalls in the mirror.
I really don't see why this deck can't just play 2+ Karakas and 3-4 Displacer as long as it is playing a playset of Caverns and, say, 2 or so Mox Diamond.
I like the GW build, but given its shittiness in the mirror (which is still highly relevant), I'm reconsidering my options. City of Traitors is probably better right now due to speed, but clashes with the color requirements of the GW build. That might change when the meta shifts more towards decks like S&T, Reanimator and friends. Since it still runs a number of Displacers, this particular build catched my interested, as it looks about the same as the thing I wanted to try out.
Losing the flexibility of the SB and World Breaker kinda sucks, but whatever works, works. Some of its SB choices still look very weird, though.
I think about -1 Endbringer +1 Karakas MD
+1-2 Karakas, cutting something SB
- 2 Oblivion Sower (unless I hear good arguments for its inclusion) +1 Endbringer + 1 Displacer (both are also good cards in the mirror, except more flexible everywhere else; more Karakas post-board helps the higher Displacer numbers, too)
and maybe some All is Dust as catch-all solution if I find the space.
I don't think you need to warp the deck too much. There's no reason to go all the way to splash two additional colors. I just think you can slot Displacer in as a 3-of or 4-of, play Karakas, and the deck might be better than the stock colorless list because Displacer does so much, and Karakas is always useful in Legacy.
It's a trade-off. How often can you play double Reshaper T2 from Eye + Sol Land? Because otherwise, it's just a glorified chump blocker more often than not. Displacer brings the same power for the same mana cost to the table, plus very powerful utility. I just don't know how to cram enough Karakas copies into the list since 1 Urborg seems nice in a mainly colorless list. 1 Karakas might be easy to justify to go up to 25 lands, but 2/26 lands is already getting iffy, at least for the MD configuration.
Edit: This would be the list I have in mind:
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
3 Eye of Ugin
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Karakas
4 Wasteland
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Endless One
2 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
2 Endbringer
2 Mox Diamond
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Thorn of Amethyst
3 Dismember
2 Umezawa's Jitte
Sideboard:
2 Karakas
1 Dismember
3 Faerie Macabre
1 Eldrazi Displacer
1 Endbringer
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 All is Dust
3 Warping Wail
This way, I get enough (semi-relevant) cards to side in vs Eldrazi when Chalice and Thorn are pretty much useless. Are 3 Macabres enough? I don't know, but it worked for Gerry Thompson, so there's that. I put in Wail since I still want ways to combat Elves and stuff. And Wail seems like the broadest hate one can apply that is also relevant in other matches.
I am pretty sure Harlan's team (NRG) was actually sourcing my playtest group's list. The sideboard graveyard hate was slightly different, but they arrived at a very similar maindeck. I was working with Paul Lynch and Michael Scheffenacker on refining the list, and they did a deck tech on the local Twitch stream (SnapCasters) the night that they both went 3-0-1, drawing with each other in the last round. You can check the stream for the deck tech, although the list they had there is out of date.
After that, they started fielding messages from lots of players about the list, including (apparently) a call from someone in Brazil trying to break the deck.
The maindeck differences were: we played 2 Endbringer, 4 Thorn, and 4 Wail; they played 3 Wail, 2 Dismember, 2 Trinisphere, an extra Jitte, and an extra Metamorph - changes our group was discussing in the week leading up to Philly. They also played an extra land in the third Factory, and swapped a City for an Eye.
The sideboard is also very close - we were messing around with Surgical Extraction, Faerie Macabre, and Pithing Needle for Lands hate, but were kicking around Leylines and Winter Orbs since they would let us still put Chalice on 1. It appears they found those answers sooner and were able to test them. They also played Ratchet Bomb where we had our 3 Dismembers, although Ratchet Bomb was a recent cut for us.
All in all, it seems clear they were basing it off of our list. The difference between Revokers + Jittes, and Moxen + Endbringers, is pretty stark. There's also much more similarity in the sideboards. It looks like GerryT's 2nd place list was closer to the SFM Shops list, though.
I'm busy at work tomorrow and then we have a weekly Legacy event tomorrow night, but I'm happy to answer questions people have. I can also try my hand at a primer, and I can talk to the team about possibly contributing to one. I'll also be more available later this week.
Roses are colorless.
Violets are colorless.
Everything is nothing.
Harlan and crew's list was actually from The Brainstorm Show's podcast. I sent them the list a week or two before the tournament, and each player changed 1-3 cards. Not that it matters too much, but it was a little frustrating that Kent Ketter did a deck tech with 74 cards of the list I sent them and did not mention the podcast. We have an episode on the deck at thebrainstormshow.com. -Wilson
Hey guys. Longtime lurker on this forum, time to get off my ass and start contributing. Thought I'd report in on my experience with a variation of the deck this weekend at the open. Played on nearly zero testing aside from a 3-1 FNM the night before, deviated from the colorless version, and ran into some match ups I didn't want to see with any version of this deck, but I figured despite the lackluster performance, I can give some feedback on some of the cards, etc.
Anyway, here's the list I ran:
Creatures - 20
3 Eldrazi Mimic
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Lodestone Golem
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Endbringer
Artifacts - 11
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Mox Diamond
3 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Trinisphere
Instants - 4
2 Dismember
2 Warping Wail
Land - 25
4 Ancient Tomb
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 City of Traitors
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Karakas
3 Wasteland
3 Eye of Ugin
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Caves of Koilos
Sideboard
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Mind Stone
2 Disenchant
3 Faerie Macabre
2 Pithing Needle
1 Warping Wail
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
1 Worship
Played against:
R1 - Combo MUD (super early blightsteel all three games) 1-2
R2 - Maverick 1-2 (yeah....not a good time)
R3 - Goblins 2-0 (way easier than I thought it would be)
R4 - Painter 2-1 (wins through early blood moons)
R5 - Burn 1-2 (never saw threats after locks were up game 3)
R6 - Grixis Omni-Tell Storm 1-2 (mulled a lot and died to an early omni/petals/grapeshot g3...)
R7 - Burn 2-0 (lock and smash)
R8 - no show
R9 - Food Chain 1-2 (of course I played against food chain to finish the day)
Off the bat, the more typical colorless version probably would have won me a few matches I didn't win just due to consistency/speed (namely MUD, the weird omni deck and food chain), but I really wanted to run a version that had more play to it and wasn't dead in the water to blood moon early. Displacer was great all day, but I was really expecting to run into more Miracles/Shardless/Delver/ANT/Elves/Sneak and Show/mirror/etc where I think it would have really shined, especially in conjunction with Thought-Knot. Given my mana and mox diamond set up, I never had any problems casting white spells when I needed to, though I did have to mulligan a lot due to openers with no lands for some reason. Lodestone performed pretty well also. It's nice having one of your bigger threats to trigger mimic in the face of T1 blood moon that doesn't require waste mana and also functions as an additional lock.
I lost game 3 to burn in R5 to a goblin guide that flipped 7 lands to my hand while I also drew 7 more on the subsequent turns while I had his spells past a first bolt on my mimic locked out, so I'm not really sweating that matchup. Amethyst and Chalice just go to town in those games. The R7 match against burn went according to plan and Endbringer can really just keep you afloat and safe while you're waiting for smasher/TKS/lodestone to show up and finish the job.
Obviously not the day I envisioned, I didn't play all that great, and the matchups were less than ideal, but the deck was fun and the games were quick which is a nice bonus since I typically play miracles =). Not sure I'll stay on this deck, but any questions, let me know.
Damn, I've been away from the thread (uni, etc.) and all of sudden we're here as one of the top contenders in the metagame. Sweet. For those looking to write a primer, feel free to use what I wrote some time ago here:
https://deathandtoolbox.wordpress.co...ldrazi-stompy/
And incorporate it. I also think the Primer should try and mention card choices/pros&cons from the splash builds (GW, RG, UW, MonoWhite, MonoBlue, maybe?), which may/may not be more relevant as the metagame progresses.
@Patrukenphat7 I was also pretty sad to see your credits get no mention. The Leylines, Traps and Contortions really stick out as being hallmarks of the list you elegantly outlined on the podcast. Your Eldrazi episode I also think should get some mention/link within the primer.
Anyway, now that we're moving into territory as a metagame staple I'd be happy to contribute to any housekeeping in terms of Primers etc., whoever's looking to do so is free to hit me up. Also expect a heavy feature in This Month in Legacy, for those who read it.
Greaves can be used to improve Endless One (aka a big dude that dies to decay) and Endbringer (upgrades to a "Planeswalker")
I am not sure about Winter Orb, i don't see the reason why i need it vs Control (already a good matchup - and better cards can be played at side), but maybe it works vs lands IF they don't get speed with Mox/Exploration (...)
Oblivion Sower seems to be a Mirror-Tech, you can abuse other Eldrazi Lands and block Smashers all day long - you can also try Duplicant or Wurmcoil Engine, but both (since no Eldrazi) can sometimes be slower.
Yeah - i think Displacer is a great tool to improve problematic situations BUT you need to fix the Mana for him (...), see my thoughts below:
-----------------------------------
I thought about the SCG performance and all the builds that are flying around here. We got a nice discussion (over 30 pages for "Development"!) and should already mentioned each angle of attack against Eldrazi - the meta will adapt: one way or another.
I will try the following ideas (a mix of a lot of builds) for my next Eldrazi runs:
Land (25)
4x Ancient Tomb
4x Cavern of Souls
4x Eldrazi Temple
4x Wasteland
3x City of Traitors
3x Eye of Ugin
2x Karakas
1x Plains
Most numbers are common and set in stone - personally i like 3 City/Eye to avoid more bad draws/starting hands. Since this build (see below) will also include Eldrazi Displacer, more "white" Mana is needed. Karakas is the perfect fit here, because it improves Sneak&Show, Reanimate and (to a minor degree) Lands. The single Plains (hey Basic!) can also be the more common Urborg, but first i wan't to max out the chance to cast Displacer. Playset Wasteland to complete the Tax-Elements, improve the Mirror (we learned that Eldrazi are weak vs Manadenial) and gives a way to fight port and other annoying lands. Without White you get 3 slots for Mishra or other stuff - but as i explained, this colorless build will try to fit in Displacer.
Creature (22)
4x Eldrazi Mimic
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
3x Eldrazi Displacer
3x Lodestone Golem
2x Phyrexian Metamorph
2x Endbringer
First we get the common colorless stuff: Playsets Mimic, Seer, Smasher - secondly not only the established Endbringer to control the Battlefield but also Displacer as a little brother (cc3 vs cc6). It is more or less the Slot from Matter Reshaper and i think Displacer (if the mana works) is the stronger one. That little Guy won me many games on its own and is a great way (against creatures) for a manasink. Now the uncommon slots: I will try Lodestone Golem, because (if you got the right lands) he is another good 4drop (which means Turn 2+) besides Thought-Knot Seer that can win Games on its own and brings some synergy with Thorn, Wasteland and will also trigger Mimic(!) as another 5-Power dude. I put him over Endless One, because he has more raw power for "only" 4 Mana. I also included a pair of Phyrexian Metamorph, because it will allow you to copy Seer, Smasher, Golem and Thorn and can also be abused with Displacer or simply copy annoying Stuff from your Opponent (Mirror?!).
Rest (13)
4x Chalice of the Void
3x Thorn of Amethyst
3x Dismember
2x Mox Diamond
1x Crucible of Worlds
Besides Chalice most colorless Eldrazi Builds want to run Thorn. I also included 3 since the build also contains 3 Lodestone Golem and Metamorphs to copy for more Tax if needed. Since Thorn isn't good against any matchups 3 should be good enough with the other cards in mind. Dismember is needed vs Mirror and Gofy (a problem we already discussed) so it seems to be Maindeck stuff which complete the Package of Displacer+Endbringer to control the field from the beginning till lategame. Mox isn't the best card, but i feel it is needed if you also want Displacer. It will also ensure that you can get rid of multiple Eye/City and allow you to ramp into T1/T2 plays if you can only start without Tomb/City. Two copies should avoid a bit that you draw multiple for bad topdecks/starting hands etc. Since the build don't need full color support, the number should be correct. Crucible for me is also an autoinclude in this build, it works well with Wastelands, City, Mox and is simply another compatible element with Thorn/Golem/Chalice. I don't see why i want Crucible only at Side, if one of the major problems for Eldrazi can be Manadenial and the common colorless builds also uses 3-4 Wastelands.
Sideboard (15)
4x Leyline of the Void
3x Ratchet Bomb
2x All Is Dust
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Warping Wail
2x Wastes
Not all is set in stone, but i tried to cover some weak spots. Leyline will catch Graveyard-Combos very hard (Turn 0, can't be countered, not easy to remove) and will also work against Lands/Loam to avoid recurring Wastelands. Sadly i must reduce Warping Wail (since the Maindeck is more "tap out" every turn) but i still like some copies at Side. Since the build contains Spells like Dismember/Displacer/Endbringer Main, you don't need much more Pointremoval. Wastes come in vs Moon and Manadenial (note: Miracle brew also with From the Ashes!), since the build don't run any Mana-Stones. I am not sure if All is Dust is needed in this build (otherwise a great Spell for Eldrazi!), maybe you can try a copy of here Ulamog/World Breaker, since Stuff like Moat/Bridge/Humility will be a thing once Eldrazi are full established - i for myself basically don't want to loose against that stuff. We can also talk about stuff like Jitte, Batterskull, Wurmcoil Engine, Oblivion Sower or Duplicant against the Mirror or other Decks with Big Dudes etc.
------
EDIT: @ChemicalBurns: Thanks for the link- and you are right, don't miss the color Splashes for further development.
TEAM MtG Berlin
Played again my weekly with almost the same list I used last week (on page 27)
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Eldrazi Mimic
4 Reality Smasher
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Endless One
3 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Endbringer
4 Chalice of the Void
2 Mox Diamond
2 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Warping Wail
2 Trinisphere
4 Ancient Tomb
3 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Wasteland
3 Cavern of Souls
2 Plains
1 Karakas
SB:
2 Thorn of Amethyst
2 Phyrexian Metamorph
3 Rest in Peace
2 Oblivion Ring
1 Dismember
1 Warping Wail
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Winter Orb
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 All is Dust
Went 2-2-0
R1: Storm lost 0:2
Both games were prety close, g1 lost due to misplay on my part, g2 was ridiculous, I had CotV @1 and @0, Trinisphere, and Thorn of Amethyst on the table..... Decay, Decay, Decay, Krosan Grip ruined my day..., anyway game was awesome and pretty close. Had troubles with land drops.
R2: Shardless BUG lost 0:2
g1 land screw
g2 mulligan and then land screw again!
Both games involved hand City, Eldrazi Temple and Mox, and then never saw another land, opposing Wasteland sealed the deal.
R3: UW Mentor control
g1 CotV @1 seal the deal, g2 land screw, g3 long lasting grindy matchup, Displacer saved the game and Endbringer took last chunks of life from my opponent (with Bridge on table).
-
R4: High Tide
g1 CotV @1 and he has no outs, g2 CotV @1 FoWed, second CotV @1 FoWed, third CotV @1 stick and Smashers finished game as supposed to.
I don't know if it is me, or deck, but its land drop consistency is somewhat weakest point, because last time I had land flood. Well in all honesty, this comes from long time TA player.
From the comments, white splash is something I want, because it just gave the deck many answers, namely flipped delvers, Emrakuls, Marit Lage etc. Next time I might consider Lodestone Golems from MD.Ghost suggestion, in place of Phyrexian Revoker as they underperformed.
Not sure about the Phyrexian Metamorph MD, as Mimics won't copy its p/t since it is blue.
Deck is really strong when it gets going, apart from those land screws.
Metamorph should work with Mimic.
706.2. When copying an object, the copy acquires the copiable values of the original object’s
characteristics and, for an object on the stack, choices made when casting or activating it (mode,
targets, the value of X, whether it was kicked, how it will affect multiple targets, and so on). The
“copiable values” are the values derived from the text printed on the object (that text being name,
mana cost, card type, subtype, supertype, expansion symbol, rules text, power, toughness, and/or
loyalty), as modified by other copy effects, by “as . . . enters the battlefield” and “as . . . is turned
face up” abilities that set characteristics, and by abilities that caused the object to be face down.
Other effects (including type-changing and text-changing effects), status, and counters are not
copied.
706.2a A copy acquires the color of the object it’s copying because that value is derived from its
mana cost. A copy acquires the abilities of the object it’s copying because those values are
derived from its rules text. A copy doesn’t wind up with two values of each ability (that is, it
doesn’t copy the object’s abilities and its rules text, then have that rules text define a new set of
abilities).
TEAM MtG Berlin
Went 3-0-1 at my local store (the draw was ID in round 4).
R1 - Miracles
Game 1 - Eldrazi rolls game 1 with Mimic, Thought Knot and Smashers.Sided in O Sower, Null Rod, All is Dust, Karn. Sided out 3 Thorn and Jitte.
Game 2 - Lots of cat and mouse. I have two Mimics and tap out to cast Endless for 4, rather than hold onto Warping Wail, he tops for Terminus. He stalls with his repeated Karakas, Venser, Clique shenanigans. However, Wasteland and Ulamog stop his bouncing tricks for me to take the game.
R2 - Miracles
Game 1 - Eldrazi rolls with Smashers, Endbringers, and other fatties. SB - same as before.
Game 2 - He beats me with repeated snapcasters for Swords (after removing Chalice). I All is Dust to wipe his board. Later he follows up with From the Ashes, killing all my lands. I don't recover in time.
Game 3 - Eldrazi rolling hand with Mimic, Thought Knot and Smashers.
R3 - DnT
Game 1 - Turn 1 Chalice for 1 turns off Swords. He has a hand with Stoneforge and other lands. Gets rolled quickly. Side in Tsabo's Web, Powder Keg, Spacial Contortion. Side out 3 Thorns.
Game 2 - I remember he swords my early Thought-Knot and eventually had 2 Serra Avengers. My Mimic sits there. Avengers beat me to 4 before I Eye of Ugin to get Ulamog. He didn't see that coming and Avengers were removed. I gain 10 for my trouble and stabilize after that with more Eye activations.
R4 - Elves
We draw. We play sample games and I beat him thoroughly. Game 1 - Chalice for 1 followed up by major beatings. Game 2 - Powder Keg turn 1 puts the breaks on an aggressive plan. I follow with Thought Knot which shuts his game down. We played about 6 games and I won 5, including situations where Warping Wail counters Natural Order or DRS.
4 Eldrazi Mimic
3 Phyrexian Revoker
3 Endless One
4 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Reality Smasher
3 Endbringer
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3 Warping Wail
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Thorn of Amethyst
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Ratchet Bomb
4 City of Traitors
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ancient Tomb
3 Eye of Ugin
4 Wasteland
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
SB
1 Spatial Contortion
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Oblivion Sower
2 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Powder Keg
1 Null Rod
3 Trinisphere
1 All is Dust
1 Dismember
1 Karn Liberated
1 Amber Prison
1 Tsabo's Web
4-0d my local legacy last night(well 3-0-1 but we played just to see how it would go.)
2-0 food chain- I just had the nuts both games even keeping in the dark game 1 a hand with eye, temple, sol, mimic, though knot, reality smasher dismember. G2 would have gone a bit differently had he used fierce empath for gurmag instead of tasigur(he thought he had mana to activate and return murderous cut) but I still had 2 back up reality smasher to close the game out
2-1 oops all spells- game 1 I lost before I even got to take a turn. Next game I blew him out with a chalice on 0 and curved into mimic and smasher. G3 I got him by t1 revomkng his 2 lotus petals and slowly beating with mimic and revoker
2-0 mirror- he was on Gerry t's list. Dismember was a champ here. Don't remember all the details bit him failing to crack his wasteland early didn't help. G2 I cast 1 dismember for 4 life and a second off of his urborg to take no damage
2-1 shardless- g1 was quick curved mimic into thought knot and top dexked endbringer, g2 an early goyf took it, g3 was more interactive and very close. A top deck smasher against his strix took it home.
I'm still running spirit guides and trinisphere, no reahapers and a 2/3 split of wasteland to factory. Also the meta was wierd last night. Got a bit more testing in on Saturday as well. Infect, DnT are both pretty tough matchups. I lost to infect with an active chalice on 1
Funny story, when trying to shut down two drops with chalice, don't cast mimic.
Last edited by ZEROorDIE; 03-01-2016 at 05:02 PM.
hey guys,
for the ones who play a gw version. It´s maybe a crazy thought, but how about "berserk". Not only our Endless one gets trample or tks etc. you can destroy any creature your opponent controls in your turn or end of turn for just 1 green mana. Could be worth thinking about. Just a crazy thought ...![]()
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