Originally Posted by Finn
I agree. It's shitty they aren't giving you props. But he might have forgotten it started as a list online. Easy to do if he got the deck from a friend.
Was there a D&T thread that existed before this current one?
Belcher, RUG Delver, Death & Taxes, Colorless Eldrazi, Goblins
Fuck you
Whenever someone asks me about the deck, I say a guy in Florida developed the deck to the point he felt comfortable sharing it and it grew from there into the several iterations that it now supports by a guy named Finn on The Source and I give them the website and tell them to check out the primer and if it's under the Decks to Beat or Established at the time.
I'm sorry that you aren't getting credit for the creation/innovation that your baby has done for the Legacy format. It sucks not getting the credit when you're obviously the innovator. Anyone who knows their stuff knows YOU brought this deck forth from love and commitment to making it great. There have been other champions of the deck, but I don't think anyone has been as passionate about it than you.
You have my props for bringing to light one of my favorite decks that I've ever had the privilege to play. Heck it even won me a Black Lotus the first time I ever played the deck! At Jupiter Games back when it was the best place to play in the North East... Proceeded to sell it back to the store for a lot of the deck foil, so I've retained the value (3 Karakas, 3 MPR Wastelands, 1 Guru Plains for the friend who lent me the entire 75, 4 Foil SFM, etc.)
Cockatrice: EMFry
@Finn
Sure seems shitty for others to take credit for DnT, but it's the story Tomas has said many times. It's more than likely his friend took your deck and took credit for it without telling him. That said, it sure would be nice if people actually credited you for it. The evidence is quite clearly there. The closest I've ever seen you to being directly credited for it was Ari Lax's segment on the "Inside the Deck" segment on DnT, even though the narrator ignored that and went with "no one knows who designed the first DnT deck"... absolute horseshit.
In any case, everytime Sean and I (cohost on our podcast) play DnT at sanctioned events, we always write "Finn" as the deck's designer. It's sort of like with classic cars. Your 2+2 Mustang looks to the layman no different than a GT350 Fastback, but those in the know what time it is, and I think everyone here is in the same boat.
I really like 3 and have even been testing 4. Sometimes you just need a removal spell, and even if you're going to 5-6 you're going to have games where you don't draw them. 7-8 and you now get to side into a Jund deck when you feel like it. I also take out Thalia more and more when I'm playing these games - you don't need to tempo them out, you just kill literally every threat they play.
Infect is a bad matchup, but one that can actually be turned into a totally fine matchup with your sideboard - which is generally not true for bad matchups. Path is usually fantastic against Eldrazi, though going deep on it does make you a bit softer to Chalice.
Also really like having 3 Path vs:
All Delver
Lands (protection from a fast combo without giving them 20 life)
Mirror (feels unfair to have 2x the removal)
Reanimator
Burn
I feel like that's enough of the field that it's really not that hard to justify using 3 SB spots for it.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/t...eath-and-taxes
Iatee, Thomas knows. I must suck at using the search feature on this site because I can not turn up any results. But he and I have spoken about it on this very thread or possibly Salvation's. We just hadn't in years.
Thing is, he likes being associated with the deck and it is apparently against the narrative that the deck's origins have nothing to do with him.
Anyway, thanks for letting me vent, fellas.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Marungo, I am so pleased you had a good experience with THC - especially against BUG. I was unable to see her effect except during tests. Congratulations on your placing.
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
"Politicians are like diapers. They should be changed often and for the same reason."
"Governing is too important to be left to people as silly as politicians."
"Politicians were mostly people who'd had too little morals and ethics to stay lawyers."
I think this is what you were referring to:
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/t...page=186#c4664
Ugh, it's painful to read that excerpt from that article. It's just straight up lying. Very dishonest and bad mannered. I would've grown tired from legacy did I not stumble upon D&T that I enjoyed playing so much and still do, and you deserve a lot of the credit for that.
New Thalia plus Crackdown was hard for RUG Delver to beat lastnight.
New to the deck but went 3-1 at a local.
Beat Enchantress ( Port is good ), NicFit, and RUG Delver. Lost to shardless who drew 4 decay plus Deluges .
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Soldier Stompy
List for Reference:http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/07-05-16-imperial-taxes/
I was wondering what your thoughts on Grand Abolisher in Imperial Taxes was? I tried many other things in the slot and nothing really has worked well. The reason I chose Abolisher is that it can be fetched with Recruiter as well as be cast off of Cavern on Human like many other things in the deck. It also has the added benefit of not dying immediately to Dread of Night. In legacy, I think Abolisher's ability is really strong because it prevents your opponent from doing most things on your turn, which slows down many decks by a lot.
So, What are all your thoughts?
It seems pretty narrow. Okay against Miracles, but most of the Delver counterspells we care about are going to be t1 or t2 FoW / Daze. And making the opponent's removal sorcery speed isn't worth a card.
If you want a tutorable flex 2 drop, I'd say the following are the only ones powerful enough (and with broad enough application) to deserve consideration:
Relic-Warder
Containment Priest (meta call)
Ethersworn Canonist (meta call)
Kor Skyfisher (this card is no joke and I think everyone should play it)
I really like Kor Skyfisher for it being an evasive beater with decent stats that you can rather carelessly tutor up with Imperial Recruiter, since you'll probably be abl to bounce it anway. It's one of the first threats I go for whenever the board state and matchup don't make a more definite answer or threat necessary.
I also love the one-of Fiendslayer Paladin I decided to run mainboard a few weeks ago. I've had it dominate Lands, Punishing Rock, Burn, and RUG Delver since then.
Tournament report with Imperial Taxes: https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/c...nament_report/
My friend plays D&T and I was wondering how the new Thalia was working for you guys. I played the deck in a locals and didn't see her all tournament. I was trying 1 or 2 main (can't really remember) . In theory, it should be busted. The only thing I see wrong would be her cost. 3 mana is a lot outside of vial, and she could take up a whole turn.
Deck I'm working towards: http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/02-05-16-miracles/
http://www.thrabenuniversity.com/?p=466
Here are my condensed thoughts on THC. It's probably nothing new to most of you, as I and others have already pretty much discussed everything in here or on MtG:S to some degree.
Seems pretty much in line with what I expected. She's a brutal haymaker and having a bunch of dorks to power her out T2 should be great. Not to mention the Exalted triggers in Maverick. Who's going to block 5/4 first strike? Not many. Those decks also have some outs to the problems you outlined - KOTR, big Oozes and the like. GWx Heretic sounds really lovely atm.
Phil, enjoying your site.
Re: THC fitting better into something with accel, sure that is ideal. In the long run though, she will probably still find her home in D+T primarily simply because she fits in perfectly with what this deck wants to do, and D+T is clearly well-positioned in the meta to take advantage of her utility.
More on that; let us not forget that this deck does not need to win in a landslide. The caveat of course, is that you are going to die to Elves and Sneak Attack and Reality Smasher from time to time before you get to three mana. I am happy to give a few of those away in exchange for the all the wins we get from having so many angles of disruption all in the same deck.
Also, my testing feels light against Miracles and Eldrazi. Anyone have data on how THC impacts those matchups?
--PandaKing, I hope this conversation has answered your questions in some fashion.
"Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."
"Politicians are like diapers. They should be changed often and for the same reason."
"Governing is too important to be left to people as silly as politicians."
"Politicians were mostly people who'd had too little morals and ethics to stay lawyers."
Whats your guys opinions on containment priest vs hallowed moonlight? Moonlight hits entreat the angels and only last a turn while priest blocks up our vials indefinitely?
Priest can be vialed in, so you wont have to have 2 mana open. The fact that it shuts down afterwards is irrelevant for me, since most decks you want to play it against ,after priest enters the battefield, you are so far ahead it should be ok to finish the game.
I'm primarily a dirty Infect player, but I run me some DnT on occasion. I tried a pretty stock list with 2x THC in the 3 CMC Flex slots (along with 2x Mirran Crusader) at a 70 person Win a Mox event in Atlanta a few weeks ago. I played Eldrazi 2x during the event and she was pretty good, especially when you are on the play, she can be really devastating against them. Honestly, the best part about her I found was that when you get the flavor-fail combo of her and her other self, nothing in the Drazi deck can attack you. 5 power First strike is a beating. Also, any of the equipment on her makes her impossible to single block, even with Reality Smasher, which IMO is a big deal. It seems we can usually hold parity against all but the Eldrazi nut hand, and having a creature that can attack safely with a SoFI or Jitte is pretty baller.
I agree with Finn's assessment that she will almost certainly become a mainstay of the deck in some capacity. She seems to fill a role much like Mirran Crusader, but against different decks. Crusader obviously being better against Rock decks (not to say THC is a slouch in those matchups), and THC being better against Drazi and various combo decks (Storm, Dredge, Sneak and Show). Long term, I bet we see her a bunch as she just fits so well with the deck's gameplan.
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