New player here, not following how from that hand you got to a T2 Tusk. Could you please explain the trick?Originally Posted by Navsi
Turn 1 Veteran.
Turn 2 Use Phyrexian Tower to sac Veteran, generate 2 black mana, search for 2 basics, use land played in turn 1, this equals 5 mana for a Swagtusk.
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Yeah, that would work, but how did he achieve T1 Veteran without green sources? (I assume, since he says 'I have a scry and two draw steps to find a green source').
That was the problem.
AH! He did not do it then, that was the objective, but did not happen...
Gotcha now.
Bingo!
Yeah. If I remember rightly I scried an Island to the bottom, and my draws were Plains, Brainstorm, Witness, Bayou, die to Emrakul.
@ Navsi:
Nice list and a few comments for what is worth:
- You should also try a 1-of Ishkanah. I have recently added that card into one of my BUG build and I find it very powerful as turning on "delirium" is easier when you have access to strixes.
- 3 equips are on the high end. I'm pretty much sure 2 would be perfect. I believe Jitte or Sword would have to go.
- I would play another walker (Garruk Relentless)
- I'm convinced that we should play some number of bouncing effects while playing blue. The incentive is real:
1) Protect one of your permanent
2) Turn on any late drawn Therapy
3) Let you re-use any ETB trigger
Good luck and have fun !
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
I think I would have mulliganed. It's a great hand if you get the green source but without that it's an auto lose. If you're curious on the math you were 49% to hit a green mana. So the way I see that hand, you're 49% to have a ~65% chance to win the game and 51% to lose the game. So that's 31.85% to win. On a mulligan to 6 (with the new scry rule) it's normally closer to 45% across the field, plus it's been my experience that Nic Fit mulligans really well.
And on that note, a random (possibly bad) thought I had. I've been trying to add more mana sources that impact the board more than just being 1 power. DRS is fantastic for this but beyond that I'm looking for more. Has anyone ever tried Elvish Spirit Guide? It's overcost as a creature but it's also an early green source and we can accept the card disadvantage easily enough. It even enables a T1 vet combo.
Ishkanah is okay but I don't want to replace Thragtusk (since it's so relevant against both Miracles and aggro strategies) and I don't think I want a second five drop.
I agree with you about equipment - I think I might end up dropping Jitte entirely or moving it to the sideboard.
Garruk seems okay, although since I'm in white I'd be tempted to play Sorin, Lord of Innistrad instead. Kiora is probably too easy to kill. I am very tempted to try out a single copy of new Tamiyo, since she is pretty good with a lot of the cards in the deck. I'm thinking of trying out a manland also, probably a Lumbering Falls or Creeping Tar Pit instead of the second Bayou.
I'm not convinced about bounce effects. The problem is that it isn't really worth a whole card, which means you want something that has other use also. JTMS also already does some of this work, in reusing ETBs and doing dumb things with Therapy. As far as other lategame bounce options go, Silumgar's Command is okay (but costs a lot of mana) and Repeal is okay but is never very impressive (particularly against anything with fatties).
I figured I'd keep it because my opponent was on Miracles and had snap kept a 7, so I was probably going to need an excellent hand to have any good odds, and going to 5 was unlikely to get me anywhere without some serious CA engines.
Beyond Dryad Arbor (zenith 0) and STE there is not really anything that is either impressive or just even more narrow. We could argue over BoP or Heirarch, but The first two options have slightly more interaction with the archetype. Preferably i like 6 à 7 dorks in some configuration. Like you mentioned, DRS is a fantastic card as it also helps fight (graveyard) combo and is solid in the grind.
With ESG you have a slight chance for a magical christmas opening, but the card does nothing beyond T1. Mox Diamond is probably a better card for that. Not that i'd want to play MoxD in NicFit anyway.
On another note, Punishing Fire just become more interesting now that DnT starts gaining more interest. Jund version is really nice vs Miracles. Just have to find that "extra" to battle Eldrazi. The last time i played Eldrazi with PFire NicFit the games where decided by Endbringer being answered. Other then that is is pretty doable. McPulse isn't enough and Toxic Deluge is kind of suicide. Dismember is the choice for most decks, but i find it kind of narrow for NicFit. Perhaps Murderous Cut. Damnation seems kind of drastic. Anyone have a suggetion?
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Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
I do.
I was working on an Abzan evolution build which was spoiled here a few weeks ago. The list made top4 on mtgtop8 which is not enough to draw any meaningful conclusions.
But the fact is that during testing against Drazi we had the upperhand thanks to:
- 4 path
- 2/3 decay
- 2 witness
- and 3 wall of blossoms
All these helped to make games last enough time so you had the mana to deed for 5 or 6 and take the game from there.
You just have to make your deck a little more "tankish".
I have elected a combo finish with yosei + recurring to help closing games. The build is still very raw but it crushes so hard Drazi and any midrange deck that it might be the route to take.
Well, at least I gave you some ideas:
- more tankish (wall of blossoms)
- or more rampish (sakura tribe for example)
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
This finish really intrigues me...perhaps because I picked up a signed Recurring Nightmare at GP Columbus and I haven't used it.
Also because the main reason I've dropped playing my SFM Nic Fit is because of how friggin grindy it was. Seemed like every single tournament I would spend a majority of my games going to time. I could control the board well, but it just took forever to get to a finish. Maybe with a simple finish like yours, things would go faster.
Do you use anything else that combos with Recurring Nightmare in particular? I could make some modo league attempts this week if I had something different to try.
Dont hope to win games quick with Yosei, that is not how it works. Still grindy af.
I find the GY builds too slowly for Murderous Cut. Even in a build like mine that's lower curve than average, between the 3 drops and Therapy/GSZ not going to the GY we don't build Delve fast enough.
Have you considered the new white edict? Blessed Alliance that's a card that I think has a lot of potential in general. It's live against almost every deck.
@Bobmans: Ghastly Demise could perhaps be a thing? With just 2 cards in the GY it can already kill half the creatures you'll face. The nonblack thing isn't necessarily a big problem in Legacy.
@ralf, brael. I do need to underline here that where talking Jund in this cass. Alhough your suggestions apply on general aswell.
Jund is holding games against Eldrazi surprisinly well. We do lack Plow's, but in return we gain Liliana. So there is your edict effect anyhow. But looking at Blessed Alliance and Eldrazi, the problem card here is Endbringer and more often then not it is not attacking.
If where talking Ghastly Demise, then that is an interesting option. Making point about MCut and Delve seems reasonable. So my worry is that the same can apply to Demise lacking cards to target Endbringer (and missing on Gurmag Angler). So Dismember still on the radar. All worth a try, but hoping to find a more-for-one out there to really be able to turn that game around (next to Deed).
Kagu-Tsuchi カグツチ (Jund NicFit)
Rhino's Abbondanza (Junk NicFit)
4c Aggro Loam
Another option could be splash white for PtE/StP? I mean, those're good enough to make me want to keep playing Abzan. On the other hand - I don't think the P. Fire Jund manabase can pull that off, so there goes that plan.
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=13219&d=277499&f=LE
So here is the list.
Tao is right, games are still grindy as fuck, unfortunately.
BUT, a Yosei + Recurring lock usually ends up with your opponent conceding on the spot or a turn later.
In that list, after more tests the following cards can be replaced:
- Birthing Pod
- Baloth
- Archon
- STP
Obviously, Horizon Canopy can be another savannah (even more with the below changes).
Here are the main changes we made to improve the clock:
- 2 Baloth -> 2 Rhino
- 1 Archon ->1 Sigarda
- 4 STP -> 4 Path
We are still testing a few cards to take Pod's slot:
-1 Pod -1 DRS => +1 Wall +1 Assault Formation
Assault is a really interesting card so far. It turns your walls into some freakin' beaters and it is a good mana sink. The problem is that it does not impact the board on its own.
-1 Pod => +1 Garruk Relentless
Garruk is also very nice. Tokens and/or a quick ultimate at some point can take over a game pretty quickly.
-1 Pod => +1 Anguished Unmaking/Vindicate or +1 Archon
Having the ability to destroy/exile something, with some recurring tools, makes up for some easy wins.
Finally the sideboard has been adjusted:
-2 HTT
-1 Wheel of Sun
+1 Thoughtseize
+2 Surgical extraction
Well that's where we are.
We aren't breaking the format, but this list is really enjoyable to play with *big time*.
Hope I gave you some ideas !
Legacy & Homebrew **ONLY**
Brown Stax
Rainbow SWAT
Dimir Mill
Morph my Ride
Wally Wallah
Corona Syndrome
How are the evolutions? I notice you didn't want more or less than 2 in your update. Does it make the deck work but you don't want to see it that often, or is still probationary in your mind?
Junk and Stoned Rhinos.
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