This is one of those cards that I look at and think, wow! ForI can target a card in the yard on turn one from my opponents deck at instant speed and never have to see it again the remainder of the game.
With a Ritual followed by a spell that demands countering played first (assumably FoW'd) I can now proceed to strip the other 3 FoWs clean from their deck. Goyf, Wasteland, Daze, Duress, all gone!
Then I look at all the decks here and don't see it listed anywhere. Rarely even talked about as a SB option. Here comes my question...Why?
Either it's the amateur in me that sees something that isn't there or it's what I like to refer to as a "Beer Goggle" card, looks fucking amazing until the next morning when you can see straight.
Last edited by Jander78; 09-04-2007 at 10:02 AM.
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
ohhh its very very good. First Turn Dark Rit, Hymn/Duress/Therapy then Extirpate whatever you want. I play them
Still looking for FBB Lightning Bolts. German or Korean is preferred. PM me if you have them
Originally Posted by Slay
Yeah? In Sui I assume or something else? It doesn't seem that prominent in Legacy. Standard I see it listed in Black decks more than Swamps! I just figured it was a case of having a limited card pool compared to us having full choice of range.
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
The card does have jobs to do, but it only fits certain decks. For example, control-decks can make good use of it by using it to eliminate recurring threats, but it's less amazing in Sui Black which often rather draws more threats or disruption. It's best when against recurring engines like Life from the Loam/manlands, Genesis or such and against single-minded combo-deck, while it's worthless against stuff like Goblins. Basically, it's a solid SB-slot if you can spare the space with lots of applications, but the decks it hit still haven't taken the format over by storm, soo...
Ah, that's it! Yet another reason to be well versed in the current meta. Something that won't really happen till I get out there.
Otherwise, taking the examples you've given as decks suitable for play in Legacy would this not be a solid choice in MBC or Pox SB?
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
I would argue that the card isn't good against Goblins, as in a deck like MBC or Pox you should be killing off/discarding the 2 major threats early: Lackey and Piledriver. Once you Extirpate either of these, the deck is basically devastated by the addition of fast and efficient creatures, or E. Plague, always a solid MBC choice against Goblins. If you see Goblins and little to no combo, I say run them both.
I wouldn't say it's an auto include though, as it depends on how many immediate answers you have to early pushes via Lackey, Piledriver and Warchief. If you've got more removal/disruption than they have copies of these three, I'd say Extirpate is worth the slots. It's basically a "win more" by making sure to remove the potential of game swingers being topdecked, once you've established enough removal/discard.
It also seems very viable against the various Thresh builds, you can take the damage/wipe spells from red versions, the removal spells and denial creatures against white versions, and the creatures + removal from either. Same goes for decks like Meathooks, especially if your lucky enough to hit a Crystalline Sliver through discard or sacked early on, so you can target the rest.
VS Landstill it's really your only way to get around the manlands, because they can recur via Loam or Crucible. Making your opponent sac them hardly keeps them away, and Pox effects will miss them unless they are very tight on mana. It can also severely put a stop to their major card draw spells, forcing them to miss out on the card advantage they desperately need. Same theory goes with Survival builds, killing off the chance of recurring creatures or silver bullets.
Pretty much if you are worried about any decks with recursion or use for specific cards in the graveyard, SB it. If you go up against a ton of control/aggro-control decks, SB it. If your meta seems to look way more aggro or (non graveyard based) combo oriented, though, it's probably not too good. Only playtesting and bringing it to the tournaments is going to tell you whether or not it really shines for you.
Extirpate is powerful enough to singlehandedly win you the mid-to-long game against control, midrange, and engine decks. That is, in itself, pretty amazing, and I'm a big fan of the card.
However, it means you have to care about the mid-to-long game in order to want Extirpate. Control and midrange decks, IMO, should almost always play 3 in the sideboard if able. Aggro and combo probably have no need of it at all. Aggro-control? It depends on how fast they kill; Fish or Funkbrew definitely want it, but something like GAGOMY is too fast to feel its power, despite playing 8 discard spells. More discard or LD would probably win more games.
YOU'RE GIVING ME A TIME MACHINE IN ORDER TO TREAT MY SLEEP DISORDER.
Thanks for clarifying all that everyone.
I guess Sui/RD kill quick enough and Ale has disruption/LD locked down so as not to need it's inclusion. I'm still building what I hope to be a good B/G Legacy Rack deck and had planned to include it in the SB, but was getting influenced by it's lack of presence in the format. That would be lack of confidence on my part. Bad habit.
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
Ringleader is a much better option to hit, as it is typically the card that will cause decks like MBC/Pox (and any other control deck) to lose moreso than a late topdecked Lackey/Piledriver. Goblin Matron is also a better target than those two in decks like that. Just saying.
Just double checking...You could always Wretch the targeted card being Extirpated thus saving the other 3, yes?
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
I think that Extirpate is the beneficiary of savage over hype. It was heralded as the end to Ichorid of all kind, Extended and Vintage Versions. It was being maindecked all over the place in any deck with just a hint of black.
No, Split Second prevents any activated responses.
no, split second is > greater than all.
edit:
damn, beat me too it.
Team Unicorn is too hetero for me.While this is close it's still wrong. Every one knows it's an orgy of unicorns.******s?
TeaM NOVA for life.
No, it's an activated ability and Extirpate has Split Second. But yea, Nihil hit the spot, every deck that cares about the mid- to lategame and plays black should probably pack a bunch of these somewhere. That includes decks like Landstill (and Xb variant...basically, WUb, Uwgb or UB) and indeed stuff like MBC. Decks like RecSur could also play it.
Oh for christs sake, I forgot about Split Second!
You guys help me not look (as) stupid when I go out and play agaisnt people other than my wife. I'll thank you in advance for that.
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
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Making you look not (as) stupid since 2003.
Wasn't that mainly because Ichorid itself was the overhyped deck in both formats to begin with?
And yes, Ringleader is a savage tempo advantage if you can get one into the yard to Extirpate. You basically put them on topdeck mode for the rest of the game, and nullify it's only non-Warchief hasted options. The main reason I left it out is because it was pretty obvious a "hit if seen" thing :D
HA! You make shirts like that, I wanna cut!
In painting, you have unlimited power. You have the ability to move mountains. You can bend rivers.
The card is incredibly narrow and really only effective against Ichorid. Don't even argue that it's good against Cephalid Breakfast, because you won't be able to play Extirpate after Abeyance. Furthermore, decks running a suite of black disruption spells already do well against Cephalid Breakfast (like Red Death).
I disagree with this statement. The sui matchup (ex. Red Death) against breakfast is pretty painful. They have aether vial to negate your land destruction and none of the combo pieces get hit by duress, although hymn is pretty good against them. Also worldly tutor gets around things like cabal therapy, etc. Again once they started to use tarmogoyf that deck is a beating for death. Being able to hit a combo piece (or a tarmogoyf) post board with hymn or therapy and then getting rid of it permanently has some merit. Obviously it is pretty hard to play extirpate once they abeyance you, but I don't think the card is that narrow. It also really helps in decks like landstill for the control mirror and stops a lot of random yard recursion decks. I duno, the card might be a bit narrow, but not too narrow for the board of a lot of decks that use black. People hyped it and then bashed it. The consensus is somewhere in between.
they haunt minds...
You're right, I forgot about Tarmogoyf, I was thinking of Breakfast before Tarmo-tech. Though Obfuscate Freely and Machinus did lose to some awful black decks at GenCon Champs.
I'm beginning to think the haters are mostly correct in bashing Extirpate. I don't like it in the Landstill mirror because it doesn't advance your goals in that matchup. Maybe you get to tag a Wasteland, but you still need to win the match. Maybe you get to tag a Force of Will, but you still need to win the match. It won't stop opposing Soldier tokens, Angel tokens, Mishra's Factories in play, Nantuko Monasteries in play, or Faerie Conclaves in play. Compare it to Haunting Echoes which is absolutely better in the Landstill mirror (but may not be the perfect choice) because it damn near decks your opponent, just about turns off their Crucible of Worlds, and can remove all copies of up to a dozen key cards. Now that will do more to further your goals in the Landstill mirror than Extirpate.
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