You might want to read those two again..Originally Posted by hungryLIKEALION
Heeeey, wakka wakka!
Well, that's why I posted here before trying to play this in a tournament. ;p
Ad Nauseam is not wishable with Burning Wish (it's sadly an instant). That's one of the reasons for Infernal Tutor/Diminishing Returns in the sideboard.
As far as tweaks to the list, until we get UR fetches from Zen, you should probably be running Bayou/Scrubland and 0 Trop/Tundra. Not being able to fetch out a given color is really awkward, probably more awkward than mulling a hand because you can't cast Brainstorm/Ponder. For testing this won't matter (just test with the UR fetches), but it will matter for events for the next couple weeks. As mentioned before, I cut 1 Mire, 1 Volc, and the Island (although I'm on the fence about this) for 2-3 City of Brass. This helps the color problems dramatically and doesn't seem to be that big of a deal in the lifeloss department. I don't know if I'll keep this change post-Zen.
You need 4 SDT. It's the best way to abuse SDT and its abusable itself after Ad Nauseam (for extra storm or to draw into Mystical Tutor's target without UU. Randomly, it's an alternate storm engine with two of them (and a lot of mana, although IGG helps this) with a Tendrils in hand. If you are set on having a 2nd chant effect in the maindeck, I recommend a second Silence. You're never using it for kicker and Divert does see play in some Merfolk and Thresh sideboards as an anti-Zoo card. Getting hit by splash hate for style is just poor. The added ability to Infernal Tutor for a second copy is solid. As for your sideboard, you might try out Diminishing Returns in the slot that Ad Nauseam occupied. There is a small risk that you'll RFG your remaining three win conditions, but I seriously doubt you ever encounter that scenario.
I really like NLS. Of all the storm decks I've played in Legacy, it feels like this one best makes use of its available resources. Everything has multiple uses and I feel like it really lets me outplay my opponents.
BZK! - Storm Boards
Been there, tried that, still casting Doomsday.
Drawing my deck for 0 mana since 2013.
Yeah, I'm really enjoying this deck. The reason I like playing storm in vintage is because it always feels like a puzzle you have to solve. This deck very much has that same feel. Compared to ANT where it's just "Can I cast Ad Nauseam? No? K." Also, I love SDT in this deck, I am going up to four on it. I'm not going to play this deck in a tournament until around christmas probably, but I'm very excited to begin practicing with it.
So this is the list I'm looking at now.
// Lands
1 [A] Bayou
1 [B] Badlands
1 [A] Underground Sea
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
4 [ON] Bloodstained Mire
1 [U] Volcanic Island
1 [B] Scrubland
2 [6E] City of Brass
// Spells
1 [WL] Doomsday
4 [6E] Mystical Tutor
1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
1 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
3 [JU] Burning Wish
2 [MR] Chrome Mox
1 [ALA] Ad Nauseam
1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
1 [TE] Meditate
4 [FNM] Brainstorm
2 [M10] Ponder
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
4 [A] Dark Ritual
3 [TO] Cabal Ritual
4 [US] Duress
1 [M10] Silence
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [WL] Doomsday
SB: 1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
SB: 1 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
SB: 1 [TSP] Empty the Warrens
SB: 1 [LRW] Thoughtseize
SB: 1 [NE] Reverent Silence
SB: 3 [SC] Xantid Swarm
SB: 1 [CS] Deathmark
SB: 1 [US] Meltdown
SB: 1 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 1 [OV] Infernal Contract
SB: 1 [VI] Helm of Awakening
SB: 1 [TSP] Grapeshot
I also have a few more questions.
How do people feel about playing more than one infernal tutor main? Is it considered unnecessary? Also, do I need to play 4 ponders, or is two okay? I'm not set on running two chant effects main, so I'll cut down to just the silence. Also, is Helm/Grapeshot still considered a good SB option? I think I want to play with it for a bit in the SB to see how often I use it, but is it considered no longer neccesary now? I'm just curious because I saw a lot of lists seem to have cut it now.
Helm-shot was used to get around silly hate-bears. You can make a dday stack that wins through teeg, or meddling mage on tendrils with it. Hell, you can make it win with a canonist on the table as a pass the turn pile!
This, is however not at all mandatory as you can just put a deathmark in the dday pile and call it a day. Now that you are running burning wishes md you want the deathmark in the sb anyways. (the lists with helm-shot were, I think, the plain doomsday fetchland tendrils decks.)
Let me remind you though, before canonist was printed the grapeshot itself was a perfectly fine answer to hatebears in TES (it has wishes).
And no, you don't need 4 ponders, 2-3 is perfect I think.
2 Infernals is under no circumstances necessary, but the second copy is the loosest slot in the deck. Other options for that slot are:
3rd ponder, 3rd cabal ritual, a protection spell (thoughtseize, extirpate, chant).
And out of those, I think 5 protection spells md is plenty enough, third ponder unnecessary and the cabal rit just plain excessive. So I run the infernal there for now, as it is the most versatile. Getting another duress, rit etc and keeping my threat density higher.
I don't know which one is the best, or if there is something even better, but imo the infernal just adds more to the deck than the third copies of ponder/c.rit.
EDIT: please do apply for the storm boards, there is a thread there for this deck. We are now polluting a thread with talk about another deck :(
Last edited by deviant; 09-24-2009 at 10:16 PM.
Sorry. I made an account on Storm Boards, I'll go finish the application now. Sorry FT thread!
So, tomorrow I'm going to a tourney, and i wanted to bring FT. The curious fact is the version which I'm actually going to bring.
I read the thread a bit, and stuck in the 2-IGG version, the "old" FT list w/ Street wraiths. Don't know why, but i feel it's lots of fun to play; I'm a bit unsure of its competitiveness due to the lack of AdNauseam though, which is a no brainer when you want to win fast ad easy. But i hate Chrome Moxes so much that this doesn't allow me to play AN either
Joking apart, I love the crazy sinergy between Wraith and Mysticals, even if i'm not really sure if i know the whole pack of tricks it can be abused with (of course i know that it comboes well with catrips too, fuels CRit's threshold very well, and it's a beast as a free cantrip w/Mystical when recurred via IGG, but i feel i'm still missing something). I know it may sound anachronistic if we stare at all the evolution this deck has gone through reaching 6-chant ANT, but this version really charms me.
The question is: is it really worth to play it in an aggro-control environment, mainly made of Merfolks, CanThresh, Bants, Goblins, Faerie-esque decks and fewer like DStompy,Stax, Black-based ones,? My concern is the fact that Relic Of Progenitus actually becomes a relevant card if sided in, because , well, it stops our (only) good storm engine, and going off "naturally" (cards+Tendrils) is for sure way more difficult. Of course I have an alt plan which consists of the ol' good EtW, but that's the classic card which against aggro-control may guarantee chances to win if cast turn 1-2 maximum, then between Merfolks, Monks, and Goyfs becomes quite shitty. I also tried the double tendrils configuration, but unfortunately it seemed that the 2nd Tedrils was redundant and often stuck in my hand and made Infernal tutor shit too.
For reference, here's the precise list I'd like to play:
1 [R] Tundra
1 [A] Scrubland
2 [A] Underground Sea
1 [UG] Island
1 [B] Volcanic Island
1 [PT] Swamp (2)
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
// Creatures
4 [FUT] Street Wraith
// Spells
2 [PS] Orim's Chant
1 [TSP] Wipe Away
3 [LRW] Ponder
1 [TSP] Empty the Warrens
2 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
4 [B] Dark Ritual
1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
4 [MM] Brainstorm
4 [MI] Mystical Tutor
2 [M10] Silence
1 [FUT] Pact of Negation--> Meta call, and really good combined w/chants. I'd never cut it out, it steals so may wins against tempo decks.
4 [TO] Cabal Ritual
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
4 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
// Sideboard
SB: 2 [ON] Chain of Vapor-->Hate bears, Pillar, against creature-based aggro decks with permanent hate.
SB: 3 [ZEN] Spell Pierce-->Mainly discard, Artifacts.dec Ontheplay, and perhaps also against control decks ala Landstill.
SB: 1 [PS] Orim's Chant-->Further protection against CanThresh, Faeries.
SB: 2 [TSP] Wipe Away--->Counterbalance.
SB: 1 [DS] Echoing Truth-->Ichorid, Artifact, Random utility.
SB: 2 [10E] Hurkyl's Recall-->The usual artifacts.
SB: 1 [TSP] Empty the Warrens-->It could be good against Countertop and Threshold if unexpected, but i fear EE.
SB: 2 [FUT] Slaughter Pact-->Hate bears. Cursecatcher?
1-Open
I'd like some advices if you played this list (not too much time ago, i mean
Another big one missing in the sb is Pyroblast, but i didn't want to add a fourth color (the Volc is just for ETW); against Merfolk i would tend to ramp some mana (avoiding daze effects ad mana denial) and try to go for a chant-pact protected win. EtW should go out, in favor of a bounce spell or an additional chant.
So, if anyone can help me in gaining me information about the sb strategies, i would really appreciate it. Plus, aswer this question: in a meta such the one i described above, can it be worth to play this over 6-chant AdN? I like the possibility to Alt-Win, and it makes me feel safer to know that i can go off even at 1 life, and that i don't play shit like Chrome Mox. But still, having played ANT i really miss those moments where i could just make chant, DRit, DRit, AdNauseam, plus only 5 protection spells, although all the cantrip ad tutoring engine, perplex me a bit. If it were NLS which has an amazing threat density, i could have understood it, but here the real engine is made out only of 4 ITs and 2 Iggs. Should i try a Draw4? I feel Cruel Bargain/If.Cotract is somehow meh because it depends on a draw4 and this deck loses life very fast, and i really dunno about Meditate.
Ah, i have tried Doomsday (pure version and hybrid) too, but 4 SDTs just don't match my playstyle that much. I like it a bit faster
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Avatar of kicks_422's creation and property
honestly if your goint to be playing an older iggy style FT, one md death wish is nuts. it also allows you to play silly things like serenity in your sideboard which just beats things like d.stompy/stax. as well as allowing you to get that last chant effect you need. random bounce spell for hate bears. a tendrils out of the board if something happend to your 1 of tendrils md. emidln and i both tried many differenc cards in that slot. where i believe you have pact of negation? everything from abeyance,grim tutor,infernal contract,meditate,extra bounce spell, second tendrils. and death wish was by far more useful than the rest...that is until emidln found a goofy little dollar rare called doomsday...but thats another story and pretty much a bad idea if you're playing street wraith instead of top.
I've had a lot of requests for this decklist, so here goes:
// DDFT Summer 2k10
4 Burning Wish
3 Doomsday
2 Lim-Dul's Vault
1 Infernal Tutor
4 Brainstorm
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Duress
2 Thoughtseize
1 Wipe Away
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Shelldock Isle
1 Meditate
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
1 Tendrils of Agony
4 Dark Ritual
2 Cabal Ritual
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Polluted Delta
2 Scalding Tarn
1 Bloodstained Mire
2 Underground SEa
2 Volcanic Island
1 Badlands
1 Tropical Island
1 Bayou
1 Island
1 Swamp
SB: 1 Tendrils of Agony
SB: 1 Empty the Warrens
SB: 1 Doomsday
SB: 1 Infernal Tutor
SB: 1 Ill-Gotten Gains
SB: 1 Infernal Contract
SB: 1 Thoughtseize
SB: 1 Deathmark
sB: 1 Pulverize
SB: 3 Xantid Swarm
SB: 3 Carpet of Flowers
The only thing I'm currently unhappy with is my inability to play a 17 card sideboard. Infernal Contract might get cut for a Pyroclasm, but I really like Burning Wish to function as a draw spell after Doomsday.
It's worth noting that this list has three primary modes of attack:
(1) Ill-Gotten Gains into Tendrils via Doomsday, Burning Wish, or Infernal Tutor
(2) Doomsday into Tendrils
(3) Doomsday into Emrakul
Some arguable cards for inclusion:
Cloud of Faeries as a 1-of enables these two extremely useful piles:
SDT in play, 2 cards, 1U post-Doomsday
Brainstorm
LED
Shelldock Isle
Cloud of Faeries
Emrakul
You SDT into Brainstorm, Brainstorm with 1 floating into SDT, LED, Shelldock Isle, play Shelldock Isle hiding Emrkaul and putting Cloud of Faeries on top, play LED, play SDT, break LED and use SDT to draw Cloud of Faeries, play it floating U to untap blue land + shelldock isle and now profit.
BS in hand + 2 cards, 1U post-Doomsday
Shelldock Isle
Lotus Petal
Cloud of Faeries
Emrakul
BLANK
You Brainstorm into Shelldock Isle, Lotus Petal, Cloud of Faeries throwing away 2 chaff cards. Play Shelldock Isle hiding emrakul, then Lotus Petal and use your 1 floating + petal to play Cloud of Faeries untapping a land + isle. Proceed to profit phase.
Cloud of Faeries is better than Twiddle effects or Amulet because it helps you avoid Edicts and it can be a draw spell into a Tendrils DD pile if you're not looking to Emrakul.
Extra LDV are arguable. 3 is probably the right number, but to accomodate my 16 card sideboard, there is a Bayou in the maindeck as the 17th land (16 real lands + shelldock).
Rain of Filth might be better than a Cabal Ritual #3, possibly better than Cabal Ritual #2 with 16 real lands. I haven't tested this yet.
I've tested this vs black tempo thresh, new horizons, zoo w/teeg maindeck, jacestill, bant survival, bgw confidant, merfolk, and blue lands.
UGB Tempo Thresh
Depending on the sideboard plan that black tempo thresh has (I played against Extirpate + Spell Pierces + Needles as well as Spell Pierces + Needles + Hydroblasts), your match is positive to even with good play (not even perfect play as I was making several mistakes that I caught after a turn or two). You want to side out Wipe Away, Emrakul plan, and 2cc stuff that isn't Burning Wish for TS + green cards. If they have hydroblast, you probably want to consider taking out Wishes and leaving IT+LDV plan to bring in ETW, Tendrils, Doomsday and maybe keep a Cabal Rit. If they have removal in g2, you probably want to take out Xantid Swarm in g3 rather than gambling that they might not have it. If t
New Horizons
This is really similar to UGB Tempo Thresh except they usually don't have Spell Snare and Spell Pierce, but they will probably have Pierce main. They might have MM in the sb, their clock is slightly faster, but they don't have Dark Confidant to draw a ton of cards either. I found that this was roughly even (I won more than I lost, but i only played about 20 games) and that in g1, Emrakul plan wasn't even that bad if I had a Duress to clear the way and saw no Waste/Stifle. Sideboard should be similar to New Horizons, possibly with Deathmark brought in for Mage or just to kill something if you draw it. ETW isn't the stone cold nuts due to some number of EE in the main, but it's still decent since you tend to have resolved Duress/TS before going for it.
Zoo w/Maindeck Teeg
This was a cakewalk. I went 8-0 preboard and stopped counting postboard. If zoo doesn't respect us with Mindbreak Traps or Chants, you should 2-0 them in every match you don't mull into oblivion. Teeg resolved a few turn 2s and it did approximately nothing for my opponent. I did lose a postboard game to double bolt+ fireblast, although I'm unsure that Zoo should be playing Teeg and Fireblast. Anyway, outside of the where I lost of of my life and then was 10'd, I didn't drop a game.
Jacestill
This was really positive game 1 and didn't seem to be signficantly harder games 2 and 3. You can't slow roll them quite as well, but their deck is a lumbering pile and they tend to fold to well-timed Duresses. As always vs blue, turn 1 Duress is almost unilaterally wrong unless followed by Petal + bomb. You probably shouldn't side in Xantid Swarm and ETW isn't as bombalicious as it vs New Horizons and Tempo Thresh. Carpet is still fine, even if they have EE+Deed as it can be played as a Ritual effect on your combo turn and doesn't get Spell Snared.
Bant Survival
I've tested this about 30 games and had mixed luck. I had some awful hands early on and a lot of mulls to 5. In the next session, I didn't mull to 5 every game and seemed to do very well game 1. DD, go isn't as strong against them as it is normal CB decks since they'll sometimes blow you out with Survival into Meddling Mage stopping Emrkaul. If they aren't playing CB, the matchup seems slightly better. Postboard, they can bring in a wide range of stuff, Deathmark and Wipe Away are good here and your green cards can be okay as well. You don't want to side out too much business as they can have a quick clock. I can't see this being any worse than even.
BGW Confidant
Emrakul is an awful plan vs 15ish LD spells (Waste, Sinkhole, Smallpox, Vindicate) unless you have Cloud of Faeries. The discard isn't that great vs them. The green sideboard is worthless. ETW sometimes works, but this list had some number of Deed and those were very bad for me. On the upside, if they don't have turn 1-2 Hymn, they didn't win a game. On the downside, turn 1-2 hymn generally loses you the game. SDT is very good against them and the standard Tendrils plan of dropping artifacts into some sort of tutor into IGG is still strong. It was less strong vs this build packing Deed, but it was still better than nothing. At least once I was able to bait a Deed with LED to win via ETW. It's worth siding in IGG #2 in this matchup. Deathmark is okay if you suspect some sort of hatebear, or just want to buy time by killing Goyf. The more suicid-esque, the worse your matchup is.
Ug Merfolk
Merfolk wasn't the best game 1. I tested vs Ug and it's signficantly stronger if you have Cloud of Faeries to Emrakul this turn. Ug doesn't usually have Stifle, so if they don't have active wasteland on the table, Cloud of Faeries+Emrakul plan is generally gg. Duress effects are good vs them, Xantid Swarm is outstanding, and Carpet is randomly amazing or awful, but generally good enough to be a counter to 1-2 tax effects. Postboard, I was winning most of my games. Preboard I was losing to the double cursecatcher draws mostly, and it doesn't seem that difficult if you have a good hand.
Blue Lands
It's really difficult to lose this matchup. They have sideboard hate, but they have no clock. You have enough ability to avoid Chalice via Burning Wish and fetches that this isn't really too hard. You autowin game 1.
Metalworker/Grim Monolotith/Trinisphere decks
We lose these most of the time. The best bet is quick DD for Emrakul and hope they don't have Wasteland. It gets progressively worse after their turn one so you don't really want to keep playing. If you want a good solution, side some lands and Serenity. I haven't been impressed with their ability to do anything other than crush combo, so I wouldn't worry about them making it into the winners bracket in a major event. Maybe a list will surface that makes this a more relevant matchup, but I haven't seen one so far.
All in all, I'll be playing this deck for the foreseeable future.
BZK! - Storm Boards
Been there, tried that, still casting Doomsday.
Drawing my deck for 0 mana since 2013.
Here you are, here's my list, crafted to include AN, and still have access to a good number of DDs.
// Lands
1 [7E] Island (2)
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [U] Scrubland
2 [U] Underground Sea
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [A] Tundra
1 [U] Volcanic Island
1 [B] Badlands
// Spells
1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
2 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
1 [ALA] Ad Nauseam
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
3 [PS] Orim's Chant
2 [TO] Cabal Ritual
4 [MM] Brainstorm
4 [R] Dark Ritual
1 [TE] Meditate
1 [WL] Doomsday
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
2 [LRW] Ponder
2 [MR] Chrome Mox
2 [AL] Lim-Dul's Vault
4 [JU] Burning Wish
3 [FNM] Duress
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
SB: 1 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
SB: 1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
SB: 1 [WL] Doomsday
SB: 1 [LRW] Ponder
SB: 1 [FNM] Duress
SB: 1 [ON] Chain of Vapor
SB: 1 [VI] Helm of Awakening
SB: 1 [TSP] Grapeshot
SB: 1 [TSP] Wipe Away
SB: 1 [JGC] Vindicate
SB: 1 [TSP] Empty the Warrens
SB: 1 [GP] Shattering Spree
SB: 1 [10E] Deathmark
SB: 1 [ROE] Recurring Insight
You could probably play a more stable manabase, but I'm a big fan of Chants.
I like the way you can side in just the helm of awakening (that is not that bad on its own for storm combo) and still have the infinite grapeshot kill thanks to burning wish piles.
This is probably a faster and less DD-centric version compared to the deck emidln wrote just up there, but it alsolacks the Emrakul kill (to accomodate AN).
Overall I'm quite happy with the deck, in the few tests I've done.
Currently Playing: Nourishing Lich.Deck
Current Record: 1-83-2
Here you are, here's my list, crafted to include AN, and still have access to a good number of DDs.
// Lands
1 [7E] Island (2)
4 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [U] Scrubland
2 [U] Underground Sea
4 [ON] Flooded Strand
1 [A] Tundra
1 [U] Volcanic Island
1 [B] Badlands
// Spells
1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
4 [MI] Lion's Eye Diamond
2 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
1 [ALA] Ad Nauseam
4 [TE] Lotus Petal
3 [PS] Orim's Chant
2 [TO] Cabal Ritual
4 [MM] Brainstorm
4 [R] Dark Ritual
1 [TE] Meditate
1 [WL] Doomsday
4 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
2 [LRW] Ponder
2 [MR] Chrome Mox
2 [AL] Lim-Dul's Vault
4 [JU] Burning Wish
3 [FNM] Duress
// Sideboard
SB: 1 [SC] Tendrils of Agony
SB: 1 [DIS] Infernal Tutor
SB: 1 [US] Ill-Gotten Gains
SB: 1 [WL] Doomsday
SB: 1 [LRW] Ponder
SB: 1 [FNM] Duress
SB: 1 [ON] Chain of Vapor
SB: 1 [VI] Helm of Awakening
SB: 1 [TSP] Grapeshot
SB: 1 [TSP] Wipe Away
SB: 1 [JGC] Vindicate
SB: 1 [TSP] Empty the Warrens
SB: 1 [GP] Shattering Spree
SB: 1 [10E] Deathmark
SB: 1 [ROE] Recurring Insight
You could probably play a more stable manabase, but I'm a big fan of Chants.
I like the way you can side in just the helm of awakening (that is not that bad on its own for storm combo) and still have the infinite grapeshot kill thanks to burning wish piles.
This is probably a faster and less DD-centric version compared to the deck emidln wrote just up there, but it alsolacks the Emrakul kill (to accomodate AN).
Overall I'm quite happy with the deck, in the few tests I've done.
Currently Playing: Nourishing Lich.Deck
Current Record: 1-83-2
Emidln, I was very taken with the Show and Tell variants pre-bannings, and have been having some luck with them even now. Do you feel like the tempo.dec matchup is any worse with your current build? I know the chalice aggro matchup can't be anywhere near as good without the package and FOW.
I guess I'm just thinking out loud about the pros and cons of bastardizing my SB to pull the transformation. I'll be running it this sunday and we'll see how it plays.
EDIT:
BS in hand + 2 cards, 1U post-Doomsday
Shelldock Isle
Lotus Petal
Cloud of Faeries
Emrakul
BLANK
BS in hand + 2 cards and 1U post DDay just wins with tendrils anyway... I'm having trouble thinking of when this would be better, since they can still counter spells post DDay. Maybe if you were expecting a counter, since you have the pass the turn stack after anyway? Meddling Mage on Tendrils out? Mindbreak trap in opponent's hand? It doesn't seem strong enough to warrant the inclusion imo.
Last edited by rsaunder; 06-30-2010 at 03:06 PM.
I'm here to kick ass and play card games.
BZK
I have few thoughts on the list.
It's pretty much what I would come up by myself but I'm a little concerned about all the blue lands, 4 of them seem like a lot when trying to hardcast DD.
Another thing, do we really need 4 Lotus Petal. We probably do, to get that extra speed, but moving out of Ad Nauseam territory 0 mana artifcats not named LED don't look so hot.
Can you teach me how is the draw 4 useful? Looks clunky too me.
No Krosan Grip? And all those 1 mana green cards take a lot of space, sometimes I wish I had some different wish-target options instant of that. I do realise that the Merfolk/New Horizons match must be ugly without them.
The Faerie really intrigued me. It's probably too clunky to MD, but insta Emrakul would surely give us an edge against Zoo and the sorts. It does double duty as a cantrip into DD pile, can't we just pretend it's good enough? LOL!
Other than that the list looks pretty good. But the question remains, is it fast/resilient enough to face the new metagame?
I actually really like the Cloud of Faeries idea. I was thinking it makes an Emrakul Pile that avoids Mindbreak Trap after a pass the turn pile so you avoid Mindbreak Trap/any additional hate AND it is just as effective as winning with IGG. Which is just sick. It also might avoid Wasteland if your opponent is dumb and is slow-rolling the Wasteland cause they know it comes into play tapped. It cycles so it isn't a horrid topdeck either. I think LDV may be the way too go. I still like PTutor but I have to playtest more.
"I just shot Marvin in the face!"
"Why the fuck'd you do that??"
Cloud of Faeries is good where IGG isn't. You'll notice that the two cost the same (1U + 2 cards + SDT/BS). Cloud of Faeries might even be better than IGG is against aggro if they have relevant cards (such as burn spells) in the yard and mana up.
Cloud of Faeries doesn't ignore Mindbreak Trap unless you already have SDT in play and untap with land drop + 1U available. If you Brainstorm into CoF into Shelldock cheating Emrakul, they can just RFG your Emrakul unless they are awful and/or like losing.
Blue lands cast Brainstorm and LDV and I like this. Not being able to go turn 2 Brainstorm + fetch angers me enough with Badlands, Bayou, and Swamp in the deck.
The tempo matchup with Xantid + Carpet of Flowers is outstanding. I was making mistakes and still winning and the games I lost were extremely close. You might have to build a lot of off the cuff Doomsday piles to exploit temporary gaps in their protection due to your Duress effects, but assuming you can do this, you can steal wins out of nowhere (in addition the normal beating of Xantid/Carpet/SDT).
Re: Draw4
I assume you mean Infernal Contract. I like making my Burning Wish draw into Doomsday piles. Nobody else seems to like this card, but I use it constantly.
Lotus Petal and Dark Ritual are the two most common ways of casting Doomsday by turn 2. Further, Lotus Petal helps you against Wasteland aggro decks, Blood Moon decks, and is helpful for casting you Burning Wishes, Xantid Swarms, and Carpet of Flowers.
Re: Speed
I've been convinced for a long time that any speed issues with Doomsday are caused by the pilot, not by the deck. I can very consistently kill by turn 3 with this deck with a high frequency of turn 2 storm kills as well.
BZK! - Storm Boards
Been there, tried that, still casting Doomsday.
Drawing my deck for 0 mana since 2013.
I can't say I have the best ratio of turn two storm finishes and turn three is hard on me these days, but when I played DD more often than I do now, turn 3 was quite possible. Just keep practising.
@emidln: did you test Ponder in the SB draw4 slot?
Currently Playing: Nourishing Lich.Deck
Current Record: 1-83-2
No, paying 9 to go Wish->Ponder->Meditate into Rit, Rit, Tendrils, is a lot worse than paying 5 into Petal, SDT, LED, LED (Wish->Tendrils).
BZK! - Storm Boards
Been there, tried that, still casting Doomsday.
Drawing my deck for 0 mana since 2013.
How good is the IGG in the SB if Tutors are scarce? I don't think it should be replaced by anything, but more often than not I see myself no being able to Wish for it because I only have mana and cantrips in my grave.
Hmmmmm, Mindbreak Trap can counter Emrakul? I guess Emrakul says "can't be countered" and Mindbreak Trap says "Exhile" so ... yeah, damn, I totally lost some faith in it now. Didn't even make that connection till I looked at both cards. CoF is still good, better than IGG .... not at all, but unlike IGG it is never a dead draw since it either adds free storm, cycles, or beats face. I really like it in the board for aggro matches but I can't think of a single reason to put it in the main. I guess if you want to totally nerf IGG and not rely on the graveyard at all but I personally think thats terrible and you would be limiting the capabilities of the deck by doing so. I would say play both or just play IGG.
Also, it seems like everyone I talk too has had serious hate for IGG and I have no idea why. Its so good and gives so many free wins. Why has there been so much dislike for this card, is it really because of Mindbreak Trap?
"I just shot Marvin in the face!"
"Why the fuck'd you do that??"
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