The bad thing about that Flash deck is that it has so many ways of being built that there's really no way of preparing for it. Keeping the deck as it is might be the best way to go, and relying on countermagic with Mages out of the SB as we always do for combo is still pretty solid, IMHO.
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Last edited by Volt; 10-12-2008 at 12:45 AM.
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True. I'm pretty wary about dropping MD Counterspells though, as well as SB Essence Slivers (Burn and Sligh will be there at the GP, you can count on that). Are the Spell Snares really needed? Do you board them in against anything that's not Hulk Flash? I think 3 Stifles MD are enough, too.
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Last edited by Volt; 10-12-2008 at 12:45 AM.
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Wow this thread has died down a bit
They're all obsessed with Hulk Flash right now.
I'm still playtesting MeatHooks against every deck imaginable, and so far, I'm still pleased with the results I'm getting, so nothing much to discuss.
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Yo I have been testing this deck since its first appearance well first I saw anyways. Have you guys seen the last decklist from magic league that Quantemdemon played? I beleive that Volt made some mention of it I was just wanting to get your opinions especially with the rise of hulk flash and possibly iggypop. Adding black for the SB leyline of the voids might not be that bad not to mention have hibernation sliver main against landstill and the rock(which happen to be a terrible matchups). Possibly even other black cards out of the board.
You don't need black for SB Leyline of the Voids. You won't get to Turn 4 to hardcast it anyway if you're up against Flash.
I don't like quantomdemon's build because it lacks removal MD, and 3 Hibernation Slivers aren't really enough to make the Landstill and Rock MU's a lot better (it actually is negated a lot by your increase of chance of losing to a well-timed Wasteland). Relying a lot on Vial to drop your threats isn't really a good thing when there's no Sliver Lackey, or Sliver Piledriver, or Sliver Ringleader.
(off topic: can you belive they're reprinting Goblin Piledriver in 10E? it would just mean that Goblin decks would be easier to build now... Good for us...
Quantumdemon also says that it has a better mirror match-up. Well, all I can say about that is Ensnare in the SB is cool.
I've never had an alarming problem against Landstill (in all forms) as well as Rock. It's tough, yes - but winnable, especially ater boarding.
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Last edited by Volt; 10-12-2008 at 12:46 AM.
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Ironically, Predict might want to be considered for the deck again. I know it's been dismissed in the past, but it can be used to interfere with Mystical Tutors and the like.
Portent does more to screw up Mystical Tutor than Predict does. It draws you the same card, but it also shuffles away what Tutor put to the top.Originally Posted by Nydaeli
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Last edited by Volt; 10-12-2008 at 12:46 AM.
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Ah yes, a sorcery. Missed that. :(
Is Green the right color in the GPFlash environment? Black has Hibernation Sliver, Engineered Plague, Duress, Extirpate and Dark Confidant at its disposal, and all of that seems to be a little worse against Goblins, a little better against Landstill and awesome against Flash.
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Last edited by Volt; 10-12-2008 at 12:46 AM.
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Green gives harmonic sliver, and muscles 5-8. Harmonic sliver is a house in matchups such as stax, affinity, enchantress ect. Muscles 5-8 give us the edge in just about every matchup that involves creatures, as well as a faster clock against combo and control. I think green is the right call for GP columbus, as it gives the best chance against goblins, while not being horrible against hulk flash. Although since gobs is expected to make less of a showing, 4 color slivers might be a consideration as well. Maindeck duress, extirpate, and shrieking sliver could be amazing, while still having access to 8 muscles and harmonic sliver.
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Harmonic is nice, but can be replaced not too painfully by Necrotic in the UWb build, if you choose to go that way. The real kicker for still running green is having Muscle Sliver. Having 8 2/2 crusades is what really gives this deck it's clock. Might we (*gasp*) have to move into 4 colors?
Probably not, but hey, it could happen.
Without 8 Muscle, it's a whole lot slower. That might not be such a bad thing if we move to a slower, more controlling version of the deck, but it remains to be seen if that's any better. Plus, you can probably skate by with 12-14 creatures in a more controlling Fish build, but with Slivers I would be wary of dropping anywhere below 16 (preferably 18) guys. This leaves less room for strict control.
Also, I did some testing with Screeching, and found out that usually in any event where I could be milling cards, I usually just wanted to attack. Unfortunately, the vigilance sliver is way to slow. Screeching is still useful however, and it might just take an adjustment of the playstyle of the deck. It's certainly good with Extirpate, at any rate. And it can be sort of techy to mill yourself to avoid bad draws.
I think it certainly warrants more testing, but whether or not it could replace Plated Sliver remains to be seen. And it will probably be a while before the UWb list is anywhere near as tuned as the UWg, simply because it's still in it's infancy.
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I'm not certain that UWB is slower than UWG, because UWB can use Hibernating Sliver in order to cast all of its creatures against control and then return them to its hand in case of Pernicious Deed or Engineered Explosives.
Despite being 2/2, Hibernating Sliver can still block/be blocked and then return to the hand against Goblins, and Engineered Plague is a lot stronger than another +1/1 Sliver against Goblins.
Besides, there are other approaches against aggro, increasing the Engineered Explosives or adding Umezawa's Jitte for example, and about the worst I've come across is the 3/3 and 4/4s of Threshold, but no one is going to be using Threshold in a Flash environment with Leyline of the Void if they're sane.
Well, first off, you cant ever use Jitte in MeatHooks because of Crystalline.
Sure. But with the deck as it is, the Goblins MU is already pretty good, so that shouldn't be a basis for splashing black.
Hiebrnation Sliver is pretty juicy, especially against control. However, I think it's better to have a quicker clock against combo and a better game against aggro than being able to save your SLivers from mass removal, when Meddling Mage or Needles out of the board can handle that.
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That's not true, despite Shroud and Equipment conflicting with one another, Umezawa's Jitte can be equipped before Crystaline Sliver is played, or you can kill your Crystaline Sliver in the combat phase or return it to your hand with a Hibernation Sliver. It can be annoying sometimes, but you can usually get your Umezawa's Jittes equipped if you need to.
Black isn't about Hibernation Sliver or Engineered Plague, altho' they're both really good, it's about Duress and Extirpate against Flash.
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