[Deck] Suicide Black

[Shtriga]

I've been playing with scrolls in my red death build, but it doesn't run confidants on the other hand, having tombstalker instead. (which is something I have debated heavily in my head, confidant vs stalker, but stalker just wins me games)

bob + scroll might not be so great, but Pikula also ran them both on deadguy ale debut. it's going to be a lot more situational in that case

black knight for me is kinda meh, but not bad. In my RL deck I play rakdos guildmage (yes, that one) in his place. it allows for some nifty combat tricks, kills weenies all day long, and can even "pump" himself in damage races. not a lot of swords around here to warrant pro white

[technogeek5000]

This deck could probably play the new sygg very easily. Hippie swigns for two and if your running a creature heavy build it shouldnt be too hard to lay 3 points of damage a turn. This plus confidant could give this deck a very neat draw engine.

Thoughts,

[Jaiminho]

As much as I would like to play the new Sygg in this deck, I don't know what to take out for it. Any ideas?

[yawg07]

*raises eyebrow* Hmmm ...

[Arsenal]

^
Personally, I've moved away from land destruction in Suicide Black. I don't run Sinkholes, and don't run Wastelands. This guy doesn't look appealing to me.

This guy could, however, find a nice home in Pox decks (VERY heavy land destruction elements).

[xsockmonkeyx]

*raises eyebrow* Hmmm ...

[overseer1234]

How about this guy?
Ashenmoor Gouger

Creature - Elemental Warrior Uncommon

Ashenmoor Gouger can't block.

4/4

Could it find a spot in this deck?
How i see it is that it's a smaller negator, but with a drawback that's less painful...

[yawg07]

Well, over on MTGS, Imps Mischief is saying that there is a ...

- 2/2
When it connects with your opponent, you reveal top card, put it in hand, and gain life for its casting cost.


He seems really good.

[lolosoon]

- 2/2
When it connects with your opponent, you reveal top card, put it in hand, and gain life for its casting cost.

Hmmm.... There could indeed be a cycle of 3cc split colored critter (like the Wasteland on legs previously revealed : Fulminator Mage)...

But if Wotc is printing a similar critter as the one you described, black being involved, you should sure lose life instead of gaining it.

Aslo, with Sygg, the 1/3 Merfolk for already taking the "card drawing critter" slot in B/U, I don't think this card's for real.

[EDIT]The Card Yawg07 was talking about is finally [/EDIT]

[umbowta]

This deck could probably play the new sygg very easily. Hippie swigns for two and if your running a creature heavy build it shouldnt be too hard to lay 3 points of damage a turn. This plus confidant could give this deck a very neat draw engine.

Thoughts,

People are still playing hippie in this deck? I cut them a while ago 'cause they felt too slow.

I dont really like Sygg in a sui black shell. Maybe one thats more suited to trigger the ability. Like maybe "This plus confidant could give Red Death a very neat draw engine." The prospect of that makes me want to jump up on my chair with my shirt on my head like Beavis chanting "Fire. Yeah, fire. Heh heh, fire".

[Arsenal]

I still rock the Hippy. 1st turn Ritualed Hippy is one of the strongest plays you can make in Magic. Admittedly, turn 3-6 Hippy isn't amazing, but he still carries Jitte and flies over your opponent's Goyf's, Mongeese, etc. And he's CMC3, which helps your curve a lot. Also, in Sui builds running 12 discard spells (mine), Hippy is invaluable in ensuring that your opponent's hand is gone.

[umbowta]

I still rock the Hippy. 1st turn Ritualed Hippy is one of the strongest plays you can make in Magic. Admittedly, turn 3-6 Hippy isn't amazing, but he still carries Jitte and flies over your opponent's Goyf's, Mongeese, etc. And he's CMC3, which helps your curve a lot. Also, in Sui builds running 12 discard spells (mine), Hippy is invaluable in ensuring that your opponent's hand is gone.

Hmmmm. I guess I don't mind whether or not my opponents hand is "gone". I'm cool with it just being raped and pillaged by Thoughseize/Duress/Hymn while I put my foot on their neck with Sarcomancy, Carnophage, Shade, Crusader, and Tombstalker. ROAR!

[Arsenal]

1-2cc spells aren't always enough sometimes, especially with Counterbalance, CotV, and 3Sphere ruling the format. I like having a 3cc creature that flies/carries Jitte, can be Ritualed out 1st turn, and randomly discards; there no better creature that has that much upside.

Also, if you run Tombstalker, I assume that you do not run Confidant. Non-Confidant builds are entirely different beasts than Confidant-builds.

[Jaiminho]

I'm running Hippie mainly for being a 3cc (jumps over chalices and CBs), but also for the ability to keep combo hands low on cards after some discard, giving me more turns to hit with Shade.

[Arsenal]

This is what I'm currently running.

18 Swamp
4 Dark Ritual
4 Duress
4 Thoughtseize
4 Hymn to Tourach
4 Hypnotic Specter
4 Phyrexian Negator
4 Nantuko Shade
4 Dark Confidant
2 Stromgald Crusader
4 Smother
2 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Diabolic Edict

I was thinking of -2 Stromgald Crusader and +2 Pithing Needle maindeck. There's just soooooooooooooooo many relevant targets, in almost every meta, for Needle, it's rediculous. That would free up some SB space with maindecked Needle.

[umbowta]

1-2cc spells aren't always enough sometimes, especially with Counterbalance, CotV, and 3Sphere ruling the format. I like having a 3cc creature that flies/carries Jitte, can be Ritualed out 1st turn, and randomly discards; there no better creature that has that much upside.

Also, if you run Tombstalker, I assume that you do not run Confidant. Non-Confidant builds are entirely different beasts than Confidant-builds.

That's correct. The list you posted is at least 12 cards away from what I'm running. I don't run Bob, Gator, or Hippie. I like the early speed of Sarcomancy and Carnophage combined with the power bomb, Tombstalker. I've never liked Gator all that much because of how many bolts I see in my meta. Meanwhile Bob and Hippie just seem unaggressive. I like the ROAR factor of the lower curve with faster beats. Basically I feel that if I can get in there quickly while stalling with hand disruption, I've got it made in the shade.

[Arsenal]

That's correct. The list you posted is at least 12 cards away from what I'm running. I don't run Bob, Gator, or Hippie. I like the early speed of Sarcomancy and Carnophage combined with the power bomb, Tombstalker. I've never liked Gator all that much because of how many bolts I see in my meta. Meanwhile Bob and Hippie just seem unaggressive. I like the ROAR factor of the lower curve with faster beats. Basically I feel that if I can get in there quickly while stalling with hand disruption, I've got it made in the shade.

Negator is actually best suited in the aggro-Zombie build you're running. Sarcomancy counts as two permanents to sac to a Negator. Negator is entirely a meta call and can be replaced with anything you want though.

You are really taking a chance at (a.) winning the roll, and (b.) having a Ritual in hand to power out 2-3 1cc spells. This is risky, imo, as your opponent can very easily drop a 3Sphere or CotV @ 1, play or draw. That essentially ruins your deck. How has your testing gone versus Chalice-aggro decks (Dragon Stompy) or Stax decks?

[FoolofaTook]

Hypnotic Specter is an amazing creature if you think about it. He flies, he's 2/2 and he can fairly easily land turn 1. The fact that he makes the opponent start discarding randomly on turn 2 if they happen not to have a way to remove him is just silly.

He's not a game-winner in most cases but he certainly moves you up the path significantly and even when he goes away he has usually pulled a Swords to Plowshares (good play) or Force of Will (bad play usually) out of your opponent's hand.

[umbowta]

Negator is actually best suited in the aggro-Zombie build you're running. Sarcomancy counts as two permanents to sac to a Negator. Negator is entirely a meta call and can be replaced with anything you want though.

You are really taking a chance at (a.) winning the roll, and (b.) having a Ritual in hand to power out 2-3 1cc spells. This is risky, imo, as your opponent can very easily drop a 3Sphere or CotV @ 1, play or draw. That essentially ruins your deck. How has your testing gone versus Chalice-aggro decks (Dragon Stompy) or Stax decks?

There is exactly one player in my area, emidln, who actually casts T-sphere. There are even less, i.e., none who play D.Stompy or Stax. I'm jammed into a severely thresh heavy meta with a good variety of combo and then goblins tossed in here and there. So the risk is mitigated by the reward...and the thrill. Ritualing out a Hippie was thrilling...in 1994. I'm not saying it's fucking awful or anything. I know damned well that a 1st turn hippie can win games but I also know how fragile it is. You can't just go up against random opponents and go rit into hippie on the play in game one without the risk of walking into removal. I see a lot less risk in opening up with rit, duress/thoughtseize, two drop...or two one drops.

[raharu]

What is the proper amount of Discard to play in a less LD-centric build? I initially thought 12, i.e. 4 thoughtseize/ 4 Cabal Therapy/ 4 Hymn, but in retrospect this seems like too much.