[Deck] Fetchland Tendrils

[emidln]

I had an interesting situation when I was just messing around last night. I was a little off my game (a few beers and no sleep, i misbuilt a ponder stack...) but I ended up with a hand of like:

2 land in play
(in hand)
2 LED
2 D. Rit
1 bargain
1 Land
1 Mystical Tutor

Is there any way to win this turn (turn 2) with this? I thought there was by tutoring for DDay and the going draw4, but that only works if you pull a cantrip in the top 4 along with DDay, which I didn't.

Rit, Rit, LED, LED, Mystical Tutor (BBBBB) for IGG, Bargain (BB) breaking LEDs for UUU and BBB (UUUBBBBB, 6 storm), drawing IGG and 3 other cards. Play IGG floating UBBB returning mystical tutor, bargain, led. Play LED, Mystical Tutor for Tendrils, Bargain breaking LED for BBB and hope that somewhere in the other 6 cards you drew you hit either Dark Ritual, Cabal Ritual, or Lotus Petal (or a Brainstorm/Ponder/Tendrils/etc).

You would think that Landstill doesn't put any pressure on you (and this is correct), but if your life total is suddenly 7-10, that Mishra's Factory is a lot more pressure than you want. While you do get additional cards, generally spending BBB for a Duress effect or to put yourself on a clock against a deck that wouldn't normally have a clock isn't the best (considering you probably burn a ritual effect to do it or you're opening yourself up to Wasteland (and in the process, likely just Duressing away Counterspell if they don't have a threat on board).

[deadlock]

EDIT: Didnt thought of the Igg route.

Depending on the opponent it might be a good idea to try Drit + Bargain turn two and Mystical for the missing piece with second land to aim at a turn 3 combo.

[emidln]

Against MWC (I think Torgar was piloting one of IBA's more recent builds), I found that I was far more successful when I would side out pretty much all of my combo (leaving in Mystical Tutors) for something like this:

+3 Krosan Grip
+1 Wipe Away
+2 Ancient Grudge
+2 Rushing River
+1 Echoing Truth
+1 Slaughter Pact
+1 Grapeshot
+1 Helm of Awakening
+1 Pyroclasm
+1 Extirpate

-2 Doomsday
-4 Dark Ritual
-1 Cabal Ritual
-1 Cruel Bargain
-3 Lion's Eye Diamond
-1 Ill-Gotten Gains
-1 Mystical Tutor
-1 Ponder

The basic idea is that the only ways they have to beat us involve artifact creatures (Painter Beats or Mill combo or Belcher Kill), Eternal Dragon, or Decree of Justice. We have all the time in the world to setup 2x Top + Helm + Grapeshot/Tendrils and we can do it off actual lands. I just brought in all of my removal and decided to out-control MWC. It worked. As it turns out, 5c Control-Combo beats Mono White Control-Combo in the Control-Combo mirror.

[surly]

Rit, Rit, LED, LED, Mystical Tutor (BBBBB) for IGG, Bargain (BB) breaking LEDs for UUU and BBB (UUUBBBBB, 6 storm), drawing IGG and 3 other cards. Play IGG floating UBBB returning mystical tutor, bargain, led. Play LED, Mystical Tutor for Tendrils, Bargain breaking LED for BBB and hope that somewhere in the other 6 cards you drew you hit either Dark Ritual, Cabal Ritual, or Lotus Petal (or a Brainstorm/Ponder/Tendrils/etc).

In case you're running IT you could also go this way:

Mystical Tutor for IT, Rit, Rit, LED, LED (BBBBB), cast Bargain breaking 1x LED for BBB (BBBBB), draw into IT. Play IT for IGG breaking LED (BBBBBB), play IGG, return IT and 2x Dark Ritual (BB). Rit, Rit (BBBBBB), cast IT for Tendrils for 24.

The Reason for breaking one LED while casting bargain is that you could draw into IGG - this way you can cast it, break the second LED, discard IT+other, return IT, LED, LED.

Also: if you draw into Tendrils, simply discard it for the second LED and return it instead of IT.

The only way you can fizzle this way would be drawing into Tendrils AND IGG through Bargain, but that's a risk I would take

[rsaunder]

Okay, another situation: The game has gone longer than expected, and I have lands in play, 1 island, 1 swamp, 1 scrubland, 1 plains. My hand is D. Rit, brainstorm, LED, Doomsday. The best I can make this do is 9 storm with a standard cantrip stack (meditate, petal, d. rit, d. rit, tendrils). I don't think there is any way to work a double sensei's in there, because you're deck deathing yourself and i can't think of a good way (other than waiting till next turn and hoping you draw a useful spell) to add one more storm.

EDIT: Also, my current list that I've been having a lot of success with:

4 M. Tutor
4 DDay
4 Chant
4 Duress
1 Wipe away
4 SDT
4 Brainstorm
4 ponder
4 D. Rit
4 LED
3 Petal
1 C. Rit
2 Draw4
1 IGG
1 Tendrils
4 Delta
4 Strand
2 island
1 swamp
1 plains
1 scrub
1 sea
1 tundra

SB:
3 Serenity
1 IT
1 IGG
1 HOA
1 GS
1 slaughter pact
2 Extirpate
3 R. River
1 Wipe away
1 E. Truth

If you guys are looking for something with a little more strength against DS and a little faster goldfish, give this a try. Lotus petals really help round everything out and being able to fetch a basic of each color is really nice. I miss k.grip a little against control, but wipe away is doing well enough at getting rid of counterbalance.

[Brehn]

Meditate, Dark Ritual, Lion's Eye Diamond/Dark Ritual, Ill-Gotten Gains, Tendrils of Agony = 22 life.

[BreathWeapon]

Just curious, do you guys ever wish you had a second removal spell MD? I've been running Wipe Away and Slaughter Pact and just straight up love being able to kill Mage or Teeg with out breaking stride.

As far as SBs go, against aggro I find boarding in a set of ITs is pretty good, especially when you want to board out the excess disruption.

[rsaunder]

Meditate, Dark Ritual, Lion's Eye Diamond/Dark Ritual, Ill-Gotten Gains, Tendrils of Agony = 22 life.

Dammit, I didn't think of an IGG trick. I definitely need more practice with this deck before october.


@Breathweapon: What does your board look like? I don't know how you could fit a whole set of tutors. Also, how much accell do you play? It wouldnt be worth it to board them in without 14 accell or more.

[Jaiminho]

I had an interesting situation when I was just messing around last night. I was a little off my game (a few beers and no sleep, i misbuilt a ponder stack...) but I ended up with a hand of like:

2 land in play
(in hand)
2 LED
2 D. Rit
1 bargain
1 Land
1 Mystical Tutor

Is there any way to win this turn (turn 2) with this? I thought there was by tutoring for DDay and the going draw4, but that only works if you pull a cantrip in the top 4 along with DDay, which I didn't.

If you got IT, Mystical into it, then rituals and LEDs, followed by Bargain, cracking one of the LEDs in response. You will draw into IT + 3 stuffs, having already achieved a storm of 6, with UUUBB in pool. Play whatever, then IT, cracking the last LED in response and then IGG, getting IT + 2 stuffs back for lots of Tendrils copies.

EDIT - So fucking late. I kinda skipped 10 posts after the quoted one.

[BreathWeapon]

Dammit, I didn't think of an IGG trick. I definitely need more practice with this deck before october.


@Breathweapon: What does your board look like? I don't know how you could fit a whole set of tutors. Also, how much accell do you play? It wouldnt be worth it to board them in without 14 accell or more.

I'm using Emidln's list more or less, the SB is just bounce and IT, I was finding the ITs useful vs aggro despite their loss of speed relative to the loss of acceleration because they circumvented randomness like burn and Pithing Needle.

It's kind of like a Storm transformational SB.

[Espenhein]

Will Ad Nauseum have a place in FT?

[Brehn]

It won't (read pages 38-39).

[rsaunder]

I'm using Emidln's list more or less, the SB is just bounce and IT, I was finding the ITs useful vs aggro despite their loss of speed relative to the loss of acceleration because they circumvented randomness like burn and Pithing Needle.

It's kind of like a Storm transformational SB.

Oh, I absolutely run one and another IGG, I was just curious about running 4x.

[BreathWeapon]

Oh, I absolutely run one and another IGG, I was just curious about running 4x.

Is the second IGG how you guys are making up for the loss of Storm count from the lack of acceleration?

[Brehn]

Sort of. With 2 IGGs the IGG-Loop becomes an alternative kill route, it doesn't function well with only one IGG.

[rsaunder]

Sort of. With 2 IGGs the IGG-Loop becomes an alternative kill route, it doesn't function well with only one IGG.

One play I find myself frequently doing is laying 2xLED as soon as possible against discard and then m. tutoring for IT so the entire kill is invulnerable to discard. To do this, you only need 1 IT but you need 2 IGGs as well. (this also works nicely hiding things with brainstorm)

(2 land, 2 LED in play, IT on top of deck) draw, play IT (storm 1) pop both LED for BBBBBB, fetch IGG, play IGG (II, BB) return IT, 2LED, play 2 LED (IV, BB) Play IT on the stack pop leds for BBBBBB (V, BBBBBB) Fetch IGG, IGG returning LEDx2, IT (VI, BB) play 2x LED (VIII, BB) Play IT, pop 2x LED on the stack for BBBBBB, (IX, BBBBBB) fetch tendrils, tendrils for 20 with BB floating.

EDIT: You all knew that kill route, otherwise you wouldn't be playing this deck. Sorry for restating the obvious.

[emidln]

So the Top + Cantrip stack is incredibly cool. I don't think I can explain exactly how dope winning with 5 mana but not using the graveyard/leaving things to chance is without stealing dopness factors from Ray Robillard. Winning with 4 mana is even better. So much so that I really want to fit in Street Wraiths in addition to Top, Brainstorm, and Ponder. Thoughts on how best to achieve this? I have some ideas I've been testing, but nothing has panned out quite well enough to post yet.

[TeKo]

-1 Cabal
-1 DD/Bargain
-1 Ponder
+3 SW

I don't like Bargain, there are not that many situations where you cant get U after DD.
I had it once with the standard SDT into Meditate stack, but normally when I use that Stack I have LED in play.

EDIT: 6 life to combo of seems ok

[Dark_Cynic87]

Has the lifeloss from street wraith been a factor at all when playtesting? Just curious. It's the same amount of lifeloss as Thoughtseize, and that is too much loss for me, is it different when it's a cantrip instead of a protection spell? Maybe this is what's holding SW up. IDK.

Pce,

--DC

[deadlock]

The idea to reinclude SW has its merits, i thought about about some variations and how to create more efficient stacks, this is what i came up with so far:

Needed:
SDT in play, SW in hand

[Top]
LED
Ideas Unbound
Petal/LED
LED
Tendrils
[Bottom]

Gain:
5 Storm + Tendrils

How To: I suppose you know that.

The big advantage here is that no mana is needed after Doomsday, downside is that it needs a otherwise dead card (Ideas Unbound). I couldnt make it work with a Draw4, because there you would have drawn the Tendrils and a Petal + Dark Rit isnt enought to power it out Thoughts?

EDIT:

If you dont have SDT, but a cantrip it could also be done, but you need the mana to play the cantrip. Result is again 5 Storm + Tendrils