how about humility + magus of the moon after m10, have it changed somehow? thx
Originally Posted by ykpon
Read the thread please.
Magus of the Moon applies in Layer 4 and Humility applies in Layer 6. All nonbasic lands will be Mountains.
Magic Level 3 Judge
Southern USA Regional Coordinator
So if i'm reading this right, Humility is applied in layer 6 and Layer 7b. My Mishra's Factory is applied in layer 7b, so my 2/2 factory still works because of timestamp correct?
Of course. That would have been the first comment if that interaction changed.
So both Magus and Painter are shut down by Humility? Is this the final ruling? I kinda need to know pretty badly. Particularly about the painter so I can rework my U/W Painter deck. Thanks!
No, Both Magus of the Moon and Painter's Servant take effect even under Humility.
We really need an updated first post so people can get the facts without digging through several pages.
He quoted the answer and then said the opposite, an updated first post isn't going to help much with that.
“It's possible. But it involves... {checks archives} Nature's Revolt, Opalescence, two Unstable Shapeshifters (one of which started as a Doppelganger), a Tide, an animated land, a creature with Fading, a Silver Wyvern, some way to get a creature into play in response to stuff, some way to get a land into play in response to stuff (a different land from the animated land), and one heck of a Rube Goldberg timing diagram.”
-David DeLaney
Now I'm confused... and feel lonely and scared. Please tell me Painter still works with humility in play.
He did do exactly that, but my point is still valid.
....So....yes???
Do you understand what layers are? Do you understand what layers type-changing, color-changing, and ability-removing effects are applied in?
“It's possible. But it involves... {checks archives} Nature's Revolt, Opalescence, two Unstable Shapeshifters (one of which started as a Doppelganger), a Tide, an animated land, a creature with Fading, a Silver Wyvern, some way to get a creature into play in response to stuff, some way to get a land into play in response to stuff (a different land from the animated land), and one heck of a Rube Goldberg timing diagram.”
-David DeLaney
now i am really confused?? 6 layers seriously???? I understand what layers are, but 6+ layers???
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showt...=1#post4738301
To clear things up, Painter's Servant applies in layer 5. Humility applies in Layer 6. First Painter's Servant applies, changing colors. Then Humility applies, removing abilities. So while yes, Humility removes the ability from Painter's Servant, it has already applied. Painter's Servant works under Humility.
Magic Level 3 Judge
Southern USA Regional Coordinator
My iPhone is going kaput on me and its not letting me do the search here so I apologize if this question is already been answered.
The scenario is that I have Humility in the field. I know that Humility does not affect Painter's Servant. Is it because Painter's Servant's ability is an 'enter the battlefield' ability or the priority layers just simply work out for Painter's Servant?
On the same page, does Humility affect 'enter the battlefield' triggers from other creatures? For example, if I have Humility on the field, does Goblin Matron's 'ETB' trigger trigger or does Humility change Goblin Matron as it enters the field?
Same thing with Silvergill Adept. If there is an active Humility on the field, do I have to pay Silvergill Adept's additional cost?
Thanks!
I am convinced that WotC is "dumbing" the game because of all the stupid posts they come across on MTG-related forums
Painter applies in Layer 5.
Humility's first effect applies in Layer 6.
So when Humility removes Painter's ability, the color-changing has already taken place.
All triggered abilities "When XY enters the battlefield..." are removed. The creatures are never on the battlefield with their abilities, so they can't trigger.
It's different with cards like Meddling Mage though (and Servant!), because here it says "As...", which is a static ability and part of the resolution of the spell.
Yes, because Humility does not affect creature-spells on the stack, only creatures on the battlefield.
You don't get to draw a card when Silvergill EtB (see above), though.
Last edited by Taurelin; 01-19-2010 at 12:58 PM. Reason: Typos
"My sky is darker than thine!"
SENTENCED - 1993
does anybody want to be really nice and make a revised description of the layers that shows what common legacy staples apply in what layer. something kind of like this, but with all of them you can think of ? Im sure one of the judges or someone could bang this out in about 5-10 minutes.
layer 1
layer 2
layer 3
layer 4 - magus of the moon,
layer 5 - painter's servant,
layer 6 - humility,
layer 7a
layer 7b - mishra's factory, mutavault
layer 7c
layer 7d
layer 7e
Im thinking it might be easier for some people to understand if the common humility interaction cards were shown visually on a chart like that.
Totally agree with what Odysseus said. It would be MUCH easier to remember during a tournament.
The seven cardinal sins of Legacy:
1. Discuss the unbanning ofLand TaxEarthcraft.
2. Argue that banning Force of Will would make the format healthier.
3. Play Brainstorm without Fetchlands.
4. Stifle Standstill.
5. Think that Gaea's Blessing will make you Solidarity-proof.
6. Pass priority after playing Infernal Tutor.
7. Fail to playtest against Nourishing Lich (coZ iT wIlL gEt U!).
layer 1 - Volrath's Shapeshifter
layer 2 - Sower of Temptation, Vedalken Shackles
layer 3 - Alter Reality
layer 4 - magus of the moon, urborg, tomb of Yawgmoth, Mishra's Factory, Tezzeret, Figure of Destiny
layer 5 - painter's servant, Wild Mongrel
layer 6 - humility, Goblin King
layer 7a - Tarmogoyf, Terravore
layer 7b - mishra's factory, Humility, Opalescence, Tezzeret
layer 7c - Umezawa's Jitte, Giant Growth, Wild Nacatl, Knight of the Reliquary, Wild Mongrel, Engineered Plague, Tireless Tribe, Goblin King, Wake Thrasher
layer 7d - Arcbound Ravager, Countryside Crusher, Golgari Grave Troll
layer 7e - Aquamoeba
Layer 1: Copy effects are applied.
Layer 2: Control-changing effects are applied.
Layer 3: Text-changing effects are applied.
Layer 4: Type-changing effects are applied. This includes effects that change an object’s card type subtype, and/or supertype.
Layer 5: Color-changing effects are applied.
Layer 6: Ability-adding and ability-removing effects are applied.
Layer 7: Power- and/or toughness-changing effects are applied.
Layer 7a: Effects from characteristic-defining abilities are applied.
Layer 7b: Effects that set power and/or toughness to a specific number or value are applied.
Layer 7c: Effects that modify power and/or toughness (but don’t set power and/or toughness to a specific number or value) are applied.
Layer 7d: Power and/or toughness changes from counters are applied.
Layer 7e: Effects that switch a creature’s power and toughness are applied. Such effects take the value of power and apply it to the creature’s toughness, and take the value of toughness and apply it to the creature’s power.
Last edited by dorsch; 01-29-2010 at 05:19 AM. Reason: additional cards, thx to verf
Just a few off the top of my head. I hope all these are correct. Im sure someone will tell me if they are not.1 Copy:
2 Control: Sower of Temptation
3 Text:
4 Type: Magus of the Moon
5 Color: Painters Servant
6 Ability: Lord of Atlantis, Goblin King, Humility
7 Size
7a Char Def: Tarmogoyf, knight of the relliquary,
7b Set P/T: Humility, Figure of Destiny, Mishras Factory, Mutavault, Nantuko Monastery, Treetop Village
7c Mod P/T: Engineered Plague, Tribal Lords, Jitte, Tireless Tribe, Kird Ape, Wild Nacatal, Nimble Mongoose, Putrid Imp, Wake Thrasher
7d Counters: Golgari Grave-Troll, Countryside Crusher
7e Switch P/T:
Thanks for the additional cards, but knight of the Reliquary has no CDA, it belongs to layer 7c. If you think about it, you will recognize the ability works like Wild Nacatl rather than Terravore/TarmogoyfJust a few off the top of my head. I hope all these are correct. Im sure someone will tell me if they are not.
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