I might have missed it on the previous pages but how does an updated D7 list look like?
E-bay that shit man. I got my playset for an average of 6 USD each just because literally no one else is looking for them.Originally Posted by ryl417
Portal was a non US release I believe making it harder to find those cards int he US, and making them more expensive.
Oddly enough...I bought my Cruel Bargains from a well-known retailer for like 8 bucks each...And I bought Infernal Contracts from my local card store for 4 bucks each. I guess these numbers are just way off--but I did this in like July, so you might be lucky and find them cheap somewhere.
From what I heard, the D7 idea just wouldn't work.
This is only true for Portal: Three Kingdoms. Furthermore, it is only true for the English Edition. I've run into so many P3K cards here in Japan that I'm buying crap like Zodiac Dragons and the ilk that I'm hoping to turn into good profit when I get home.
Another Legacy Tournament is being held in Osaka on the 14th of March, I believe; We'll see how I do.
Thank you for the correction I was unsure of if it was outside US for all of them or not. And you might turn a nice price off of the people who do not look up prices, but apparently non-english printings of PTK cards sell much lower because of higher print runs.
Actually on topic, I am currently proxying this deck up to test and determine if I want to play this or my Counterstill deck. I dont know which build I want to run though, so I am testing them all ^^
It's more that I'm finding expensive Japanese P3K cards at 40% of their value, even if they aren't the English print run. A Japanese Burning of Xinye is ten dollars less than an English one, but I don't have a problem with that when the card I bought was 80% off.
I would advise that you become very familiar with the Land Grant version of this deck before you try out the other ones. At the least, I would recommend not starting out with the Pact Deck. I got laughed out of my local game store when I first started playing this deck because I didn't know what I was doing. It might be that I had never played Storm before, but there are a lot of interactions that only became apparent to me after an almost religious level of goldfishing. LGSI gets your foot into the door without making you feel completely stupid because you can't figure out how on earth someone could consistently not lose to Pact or drawing 3 Culling the Weak with no creatures.
Thanks for the Advice, will definitely consider running the less hard-core version for starters.
I'm going to a local tourney tomorrow, taking my SI - Tallmen build. Just reread some of this thread, I quite miss discussion on the tallmen-version, seems its all Pact-discussions over here. Maybe to give the tallmen version a new boost, here is my decklist for tomorrow, maybe Ill post a small report afterwards:
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Tomb of Urami
1 Bayou
1 Taiga
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
4 Shield Sphere
2 Phyrexian Walker
1 Empty the Warrens
4 Dark Ritual
3 Cabal Ritual
4 Chrome Mox
4 Lion’s Eye Diamond
4 Culling the Weak
4 Infernal Contract
1 Goblin Charbelcher
4 Cruel Bargain
1 Tendrils of Agony
4 Land Grant
2 Mox Opal
4 Lotus Petal
4 Burning Wish
4 Infernal Tutor
sideboard
2 Thoughtseize
4 Xantid Swarm
1 Deathmark
1 Shattering Spree
1 Reverent Silence
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Diminishing Returns
1 Pyroclasm
1 Hull Breach
1 Ill-Gotten Gains
If you're playing Burning Wish/Red, is the number of times that you've blocked a 2/x with Phyrexian Walker higher than the number of times where you've wished that Phyrexian Walker could pitch to Mox? I'd suggest playing Kobolds over Walker. They pitch to Mox, which was part of the biggest issue I had with this version of the deck--that Tallmen don't help you win unless you're sacrificing them to Culling the Weak. Shield Sphere is so good at blocking things that I wouldn't be too adamant to cut it for Kobolds, but it's still understandable that one might care more about being proactive and cut them for more Kobolds. I feel like being able to block Dark Confidant for multiple turns isn't as important as being able to make mana in clutch situations.
All of the reports I have read have been about Pact, too, so I I'd like to read a report about other lists. If you can, could you try to note if you run into any situations where having Tallmen put the game in your favor, and any situations where you would've been better off with something like Summoner's Pact?
Robots were replaced with Kobolds more or less, I wouldn't use robots unless you plan on using Vault of Whispers and Mox Opal in a mono-black, disruptionless SI deck that's built to gold fish ASAP
Went 2-3 in a 33 man tourney couple of weeks ago with the list above. This was mainly because I met a lot of blue decks on the way.
I started off nice against a guy that played a deck I still dont get, with orims chant, academy ruins, SoFI, brainstorm, ponder etc.
Game 1 I made 26 goblin tokens turn 1. That was kinda nice...
Game 2 I went for lethal Tendrils somewhere around turn 2 or 3 using IGG, dont quite remember.
Second match was against a guy playing Dredge. This was very close and great fun! I knew what he was playing and he knew my deck, because during match 1 he was sitting next to me.
Game 1 I made 20 Goblin tokens. He had Putrid Imp on the table, but couldnt go off.
Game 2, I didnt have a turn 1 kill and he went off turn 2 killing me with lethal zombies...
Game 3 I kept a hand with a D4 but otherwise light in business. The D4 turned out magnificent, resulting in a turn 1 kill via IGG loop...
After that, it all went downhill.
Third match was against Merfolk. Pfff
I won the first game making 18 Goblins. He had no answer...
Game 2 and 3 I lost. He was playing a strange build with Stifle and Dreadnought. It sucked.
Fourth game against Dreadstill, another blue deck. Game 1 lost by Bob-beatdown and Jace fatesealing me out.
Game 2 I got Xantid Swarm turn 1. Kept a hand with Belcher and 1 mana short of casting it. Drew like about 6 or 7 cards, not 1 freakin mana! He managed to get EE, then dreadnought and stifle ended the job.
Fifth game against ANT.
Game 1 another turn 1 kill. I only saw him play Island and ponder so I didnt know his deck.
Game 2 He went off pretty soon, now I knew he was playing ANT.
Game 3 I had to mull 2 times, kept a hand with Tomb of Urami. I got in 1 hit, bringing his life down to 10. He then had to go off, and managed to get a Tendrils off AN while he was at 5, so with just 1 life he killed me. One more swing with my flyer would have sealed the deal. Alas.
I didnt play round 6 because I was disappointed and wanted to be home for dinner. Some conclusions
- decent number of T1 kills
- lots of blue in the meta
- IGG won me some games
- Kobolds would have never been better than this build
- I never used utility cards in the sideboard via Burning Wish other than killcards like Tendrils or EtW or IGG
- Xantid Swarm is great T1
- Put this deck on a shelve untill blue isnt the most played colour in legacy!
Im signing off and will develop some blue decks like NO Show and Spiral Tide...
I went 2-3 with the Pact List in a tournament in Osaka today, but that was almost in its entirety because I lost to myself a few times. Let me explain.
This is the deck I played.
1 Bayou
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Summoner's Pact
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
1 Odious Trow
4 Land Grant
2 Manamorphose
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
1 Eternal Witness
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
1 Slithermuse
2 Goblin Charbelcher
3 Tendrils of Agony
SB
2 Goblin Charbelcher
2 Tomb of Urami
3 Duress
4 Carpet of Flowers
4 Xantid Swarm
Round 1-Burn
Game 1-I go for broke on turn one, draw a lot of cards. Sadly, none of those cards win the game for me, and I end the turn at 2 life. My opponent untaps and Lava Spikes me. Burn it is!
Game 2-Turn 2 Charbelcher activation with no lands in my deck.
Game 3-He mulls to four. There is almost no way his hand could ever be bad, so he's obviously mulling for Leyline of Sanctity or Mindbreak Trap. I pray to every deity that he's playing Trap, because my deck has no answer to Leyline in the side or main, and my hand is perfect for playing around a Trap. He doesn't slam a Leyline down, so I play two spells a turn until I'm able to kill him on Turn 3 with a Charbelcher activation with no land in my deck.
1-0
Round 2-Infect
Game 1-He Thoughtseizes me Turn 1, and takes an Infernal Tutor. I proceed to draw another one, evoke Slithermuse, and draw so many cards that I could not lose.
Game 2-I go down to 4 life from D4s. He plays Invigorate on his Dark Confidant to let me know that he's playing Infect, then swings in with it. I might have been able to kill him when I untapped, but he flashed the Invigorate like it killed me outright, so I scooped without double checking. I just looked the card up right now, and I would've been at one, barring any more pump spells that he could have had. This isn't even the worse mistake I made--See below.
Game 3-I make the biggest mistake I have ever made. I manage to play out a really long chain to cast Charbelcher on turn 2 or so with no land in my deck. I have three mana sources in play. All I have to do is activate the damned thing and I win. My previous turn was so convoluted and long that I had forgotten that I played Summoner's Pact mid combo. I draw the card for my turn, and my opponent's hand literally flies into the air. No one around me seemed to know that losing the game is a completely legal choice for me to have made, but they eventually figured out that I lost. I definitely deserved the loss for being sloppy--all I had to do was activate Charbelcher in my upkeep. Well, I guess the experience taught me to never fuck that up again.
1-1
Round 3-Infect (again)
Same shit, different person.
Game 1-He puts me on Charbelcher when I cast Land Grant for my turn. I really wanted to kill him with Tendrils after that, but Charbelcher was more convenient.
Game 2-Time to explain another mistake! I play too conservatively, basically. I literally cast a Turn 1 Charbelcher and have LED to activate it. I still have two lands in my deck though, so I choose to wait until I can dig one out. I also drew a second LED, which makes this really bad. I needed to pull the trigger before he played his third land, and I didn't because Krosan Grip's existence slipped my mind until right after he makes his third land drop. And of course, he's got it. Belcher meets Grip, and I meet my demise via poison.
Game 3-I get my revenge when my opponent seems to think that Elvish Spirit Guide is the most important card in my hand as he casts Thoughtseize. I untap, evoke Slithermuse, and Tendrils kills him.
Round 4-Aggro Loam
Game 1-My opponent plays Turn 1 Chalice for 0. My hand is filled with cards that cost 0. I sit there and watch him kill me so I can figure out what else he's playing.
Game 2-Turn 0 Leyline. I have no card that can deal with this Leyline. I T1 Infernal Tutor with mana floating, so I almost consider getting Charbelcher and just activating it to kill his creatures so he can't kill me, but at the last second I make a good decision and cast Slithermuse instead. Hey guys, did you know that Slithermuse is a 3/3? I kill my opponent with Slithermuse, Dryad Arbor, and Elvish Spirit Guide. He reveals that he has Krosan Grip in his deck from dredging, so I realize that forcing a draw would also be difficult.
Game 3-I take a risk here. I've never used my sideboard other than against blue, so I make some something up on the fly. I know he's going to be mulliganning for the Leyline, so I side out all of my Tendrils, and I leave a Charbelcher in just for killing creatures (or him if I get lucky). I side in Duress and Tomb of Urami, because Urami is the biggest creature in my deck. My opponent Turn 0's a Leyline again. I'm pretty business light, so even after a few D4's, I have nothing to attack with. He casts Elspeth, and I'm at 5 so I'm basically dead barring a miracle. I've drawn a crowd at this point, and I think it's hilarious because I'm basically playing a deck that sits there and does nothing at all. Anyway, I don't give up hope, but I basically have to do a lot of convoluted shit with Eternal Witness so I can draw a whole lot of cards to finally be able to draw and activate Tomb of Urami to block. My opponent untaps and plays Maze of Ith. I literally cannot win this game. Next turn, my opponent plays Ajani Vengeant and Helixes me dead. This round was so ridiculous though, that I'm not even upset about it. I mean...I killed a guy when he had Leyline of Sanctity in play, when my main win conditions were definitely Charbelcher and Tendrils.
2-2
Round 5-Merfolk.
You already know what happened.
Game 1-Turn 1 FOW on my Culling the Weak when I played Pact to get Dryad Arbor. That's how it goes.
Game 2-Spell Pierce. Actually, it's a bit more complicated than that. I of course put the whole sideboard in, and there was a point in the game when I knew that my opponent's hand contained no counterspells, and was about five creatures. I went off, and I could either search for Charbelcher and pray that I draw a third permanent mana source so I could kill my opponent's creatures and then him, or go for Urami, even though I knew he might be able to race me. I chose Urami, and got outraced by a pair of Coralhelm Commanders. What would you have done, if you had to make that choice?
2-3
The biggest thing that always stands out to me with this deck is that I often lose to inexperience. I'm apparently fortunate enough to not be paired against blue often or see a lot of combo hate or something, but I scrub out a lot. I guess it's back to work now!
I can't stress this enough. Almost everyone of my losses in a tournament I can pin on myself, just some small misplay like not cracking my second LED to IT chain, so in response to tendrils for lethal he activates Mishra's Factory and STP's it ]=. This deck is not easy to play, and it isn't the least bit forgiving. That all being said, I would not play this in the current meta. As much as I love the deck, bringing it into a field of blue is never good times.
I'm currently testing this list:
1 Ill-gotten Gains
1 Goblin Charbelcher
2 Tendrils of Agony
4 Infernal Tutor
4 Infernal Contract
4 Cruel Bargain
1 Eternal Witness
1 Odious Trow
1 Wild Cantor
3 Manamorphose
4 Summoner's Pact
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Chrome Mox
4 Dark Ritual
4 Cabal Ritual
4 Culling the Weak
4 Land Grant
1 Bayou
1 Dryad Arbor
I'm not shure about the Witness. Everytime I draw her, it's not very helpfull in most of the situations.
WantToPonder
former: Team SpasticalAction & Team RugStar Berlin
Team MTG Berlin
The Dragonstorm
http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/s...he-Dragonstorm
My list is just -1Trow, -1 IGG, +1 Blecher, +1 Manamorphose.
Witness has been hit and miss for me too, but whenver I gget to use her, it's always a kill right there.
The Source: Your Source for "The Source: Your Source for..." cliche.
My list is just -1Trow, -1 IGG, +1 Belcher, +1 Manamorphose.
Witness has been hit and miss for me too, but whenver I get to use her, it's always a kill right there.
The Source: Your Source for "The Source: Your Source for..." cliche.
Honestly, I equate Eternal Witness to IGG/Slithermuse in this deck. You rarely want to draw it, but its functions as a card in your deck that you are able to search for are good enough to warrant its inclusion if you're comfortable enough with the deck to properly utilize it. I have cast the card in my hand for a multitude of reasons, but the main thing I do with it is Summoner's Pact, sac LED in response, and find it to continue going off if I ran out of cards. In this deck particularly, you can function off of such a low number of cards that a potentially dead draw like the aforementioned is more easily mitigated than in other combo decks. It has saved me countless times. If you're not comfortable with having the card in the deck, I would suggest you keep practicing with the card and see if it gets you anywhere.
So I'm back home, and I played in a GPT. I'm not going to the GP, but there aren't a lot of Legacy Tournaments in my area.
Round 1-Bye. There are only eight other players here, so I get to see what everyone else is playing. Four of the other players are packing Force of Will. Great.
Round 2-MUD.
Game 1-My opponent plays a turn one Ancient Tomb. On my turn, I spend about five minutes looking at my hand, and go off. I go all the way down to one life, and the *last* card I draw is a Charbelcher, so I kill him.
Game 2-Turn one Chalice, X is 1. My hand is all things that cost zero, so I manage to get a D4 off to draw into basically nothing. My opponent untaps, and casts Trinisphere. I concede.
Game 3-I mull to six, and my opponent does the same. I fear that my opponent will completely stop me again like he did in the last game, so I decide to go for it before my opponent gets his first turn. I keep a risky hand that will kill me if I don't draw perfectly off of my D4. I almost throw this game away because I almost didn't recognize the Tutor Chain line of play, since I have *never* done it before. My opponent shows me his hand--he had no disruption, and I pushed the T1 for basically nothing--but I did it.
Round 3-Team America.
Game 1-Slithermuse is a hero. I kill my opponent on turn one.
Game 2-I kill him on turn three or so because I draw a lot of Carpets against him.
Round 4-Merfolk.
Game 1-I kill my opponent in short order because Cursecatcher was his only disruption, and Cursecatcher isn't too strong against a hand with about a billion mana in it.
Game 2-My opponent mulls. I mull, too. I Duress him turn one, and take Force of Will (This is the only Force of Will I see all day). His hand is Vial, Land, Crypt, and two Reejereys, so I have three turns before he can do much of anything. I kill him with Charbelcher.
My opponent signs the matchslip wrong, and I sign it too, so I accidentally concede this match 0-2 for my opponent. But that's okay.
The top four turns out to be two people planning on attending the GP against the two people who don't intend to go, so we drop the tournament so they can play it out. Sadly, we didn't get word of the Prize Structure beforehand, because only first and second were supposed to get prize. Thanks to the judge we were able to at least argue our way to getting our entry fees back. But I don't care as much because this is the best I've performed with this deck.
I've learned a few things.
-You need a strong heart and gigantic balls to play this deck. My opponents knew what I was playing, but didn't work too hard to find Force of Will, so I 2-0'd all of my opponents packing blue. The Team America opponent definitely let me know that I was actually SOL if I let him play. His hand was double Thoughtseize and Hymn to Tourach.
-I need to keep track of my storm and mana better. My opponents helped me count my mana and storm, but it is something I need to work on doing in a tournament setting.
-I saw a Goblins player side in Leyline of the Void and kill an ANT player who could no longer IGG Loop for the kill. My last two opponents sided in Graveyard hate against me. It was wonderful, because it didn't do anything to me.
-I have no idea what to say when offering the post-match handshake to an opponent that didn't get to interact at all.
And one last question.
Against Merfolk, my opponent had a Vial at three and Vialed in a Kira. I considered killing one of his creatures, saying something along the lines of Kira being on the stack. My opponent corrected me, and told me that Kira went directly into play. If my opponent just taps Vial and throws a creature onto the field, I didn't get a chance to let my opponent know that I might want to respond, and I should be able to do something about this, right? In reality, I didn't consider Kira at all, but if I were more aware of what Merfolk decks play and needed to kill a creature, I'd definitely want to kill that creature before Vial's ability resolves.
Just tell your opponent that you wanted to react to his Vial activation, and call a judge if he doesn't take it back. Even though (if Im not mistaken) there's no such thing as Kira being on the stack once its vialed in, the fact that you said Kira is on the stack might imply that you agreed to have the vial trigger resolved so that makes it harder to plead your case with a judge. But you can still argue that you didn't have time to react to his Vial activation.
Quit playing Legacy but could still play Goblins (Rgw, Rg, Rw, Rb)
ジェームス・ブラウン
I'm staring in the mirror looking at my biggest rival.
Played in an 82 man tourney in Vestal yesterday. Finished 3-4 due to some big mistakes (see below), some crap draw4s, and some times I should've mulliganed or boarded differently. Only one really bad matchup.
R1- Not sure what to call his deck as I didn't see any Smokestacks, but this was the worst matchup I had all day. MD Chalices, Trinisphere, Sol lands, Tangle Wire. It was painful for the entire table to watch my slow demise. Karn, Silver Golem threatened to destroy my entire board at one point. 0-2
0-1
R2- Hypergenesis combo
After this match he tells me he's giving up on Hypergenesis, and I don't blame him. Anyway, my turn 1 Belcher meets Force, and it's the only one I see all day. So I drop Swarm. Yes, I ran them main. Next turn I go to attack with Swarm, and he has spells to play before combat. I say Ok, and he cascades into Hypergenesis dropping Emrakul and Sakashima the Impostor copying Emrakul. Pretty impressive. Then I draw4 a couple times into Tendrils for well over lethal. Most epic game of the day. Game 2 Swarm ensures my Belcher doesn't get countered after a Land Grant. 2-0
1-1
R3- Belcher
I should've mulliganed into faster hands, I played against him last time I was in Vestal and he had Belcher. As soon as he dropped Chrome Mox I regretted keeping a hand with two Swarms. Both games Warrens gets him there. 0-2
1-2
R4- Elves
I didn't see much of his deck, but turn 1 Fyndhorn Elf says a lot off a basic forest. I drop Belcher without enough to activate, and my EOT he Summoner's Pacts for Viridian Zealot to destroy it. By the time he's attacking for lethal, I'm one mana short of playing another with activation. G2 My turn 1 draw4, cracking LED to float 4 mana, gets me 3x Dark Ritual and a Land Grant. I only have one Bayou, and it's in play. Then he drops Thorn. The next card was Tendrils. 0-2
1-3
R5- WG stuff
I play Trevor a lot at the weeklies in Syracuse, so I didn't mind losing. G1 Pridemage destroys my Belcher, and Knight was more than big enough to kill. I know he likes Teeg, so I board in 3 Slaughter Pact and nothing else. I also have 3 Claim and two Echoing Truth on the board. He turn 0 drops Leyline of Sanctity. I slap myself. 0-2
1-4
R6- WB Bears
Before we start he tells me about how he went 2-0 the first two rounds then loses to ANT, Dredge, and High Tide the last three rounds. Realizing I'm not going to improve his mood much, G1 I get a nuts hand with a turn 1 Belcher off two Chrome on black, an Opal, and Bayou off LG. He scooped. G2 he won, and I should've mulliganed. I also didn't board because I didn't know what kind of hate he would bring in. G3 I won with Infernal Tutor -> Belcher plus activation through Canonist. 2-1
2-4
R7- Infect with artifact dudes
Turn 1 Belcher, Turn 2 activate. I have no idea how to board, so I bring in Claims. He drops Chalice@0 turn 1. I LG for my Bayou, and he sees the ridiculousness that is my opening seven. Double Claim with mana for a first turn Belcher, second turn activate.
3-4
There's lessons to be had here that I figured someone could learn from.
I believe broader anti-hate is necessary. Boarding in hate for critters vs art/ench led to a couple losses, along with Belcher's known weaknesses. The rest of my losses are of my own design.
I'll be testing Dream Salvage pretty soon as well, alongside MD Therapy. Probaly Unmask out of the side.
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