[Deck] Burn

[tsabo_tavoc]

Today is the Burn Day!

[jpg]http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=123931&stc=1&d=1315824159[/jpg]

We get the 5th Bolt. It is not much stressful to fit in 2 Badland, and black has also nice SB options.

12 Fetches
2 Badland
6 Mountain
4 Goblin Guide
4 Grim Lavamancer
20 Bolt
4 Fireblast
4 Price of Progress / Searing Blaze
4 Flamerift

[jpg]http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=123920&d=1315800071[/jpg]

This can certainly find places in builds with Keldon Marauder.

[tsabo_tavoc]

Today is the Burn Day!



We get the 5th Bolt. It is not much stressful to fit in 2 Badland, and black has also nice SB options.

12 Fetches
2 Badland
6 Mountain
4 Goblin Guide
4 Grim Lavamancer
20 Bolt
4 Fireblast
4 Price of Progress / Searing Blaze
4 Flamerift



This can certainly find places in builds with Keldon Marauder.

[Lancer]

I'm a little thrilled about Brimstone Valley, since the card can replace Browbeat, infact placing the final nail in the Browbeat coffin. [I know there are many burn players that dont like browbeat] It does make sense to combo with Keldon Marauder, though I believe there's a need for a mogg fanatic 2.0 with the Marauder or we are looking at a 3 damage spell for 3cc.

Bump in the Night is exciting! I was a big black/red necro player so it's nice to find a use for those badlands once again.

I'm slightly debating on adding Bob to a burn deck. Fireblast, riftbolt and whatever 3cc spells sucks ass!

On there otherhand I've been looking for a use for [card]Kederekt Parasite[/card] for sometime.

[ThoSha]

Burn with Bob makes sense. I thought of that a while ago either and came to the conclusion splashing black just for bob sucks. But now theres another good reason to do it.

Brimstone Valley sucks ass, its not nearly as efficient as Browbeat. The bad thing on browbeat was the drawback that it mostly just does 5 for cmc3. I would play Vortex in this slot anyway. Much better card than a "big" bolt.

[bowvamp]

Bump in the Night isn't even slightly comparable to bolt. It's lava spike for black. When lava spike was introduced, it was a debatable conclusion. This card does not make it a good idea to splash black. Also, I'm sure that this has been asked at one point or another, but what does everyone think of Shrine of Burning Rage? I think it's better than Vortex, that's for sure.

[Curby]

If it were better than Vortex, people would use it. No one uses it.

[bowvamp]

Haha kirby. I know it's not life loss, but redirect and stifle effects aren't exactly running all over the place. Every red spell you play gets you a turn ahead of Vortex. It's also only a 2 mana investment up front.

EDIT: I feel like such a tool now. Lol, I didn't know that it was 2 damage a turn effectively. That makes vortex much better (but still not cutting it for my md).

[Curby]

Ok, I'll be more specific.

1) One of Burn's worst enemies is life gain. This card does nothing to negate life gain.

2) Sulfuric vortex can be very roughly equated to two damage per turn for a single investment of 3 mana, and starts taking effect as soon as turn three. This card takes a total of five mana, only does damage once, needs time to ramp up, and in my estimation will do less overall damage than the Vortex. It will certainly do less damage per mana invested, which ends up slowing you down.

By all means, test it out and tell us what you think. Make sure you test against decks running Rhox War Monk, Jitte, and/or Batterskull. I love to be proven wrong, but think you'll have an uphill battle attempting to do so in this case.

[keys]

What's better in Sullivan style burn, Figure of Destiny or Kargan Dragonlord? With MM out of the picture, I am leaning towards Figure, but the flying on the Dragon is pretty good.

[RogueMTG]

What's better in Sullivan style burn, Figure of Destiny or Kargan Dragonlord? With MM out of the picture, I am leaning towards Figure, but the flying on the Dragon is pretty good.

After some testing, I came to the conclusion that they both kind of suck. Horrible top decks lategame and too slow early on, I really never wanted to see either. What does the rest of your list look like?

[Curby]

That said, I like FoD. Imagine pumping 5 mana into Dragonlord, and just when you're about to get him to a 4/4, they remove him. Starting small is good, and pumping at instant speed is good. That said, I don't think I'd run them either. Lavamancers, Hellspark Elementals, etc. will likely do more for you than these.

[Gollus]

I think instant speed pump is way better, but as already said, they are both suboptimal.

After the banning of Mental Misstep, will counterbalance rise again?
Fast combo will definitely try get in the lead of the meta. And Burn is a little bit too slow against it.

Has anyone already tested a list with black?

[Curby]

There's some discussion of Bump in the Night over at MTGS. But really, the best reason to splash black is for the sideboard (Perish against Goyf/Knight, etc.), and it's not clear that there's a net benefit.

[Lancer]

There's some discussion of Bump in the Night over at MTGS. But really, the best reason to splash black is for the sideboard (Perish against Goyf/Knight, etc.), and it's not clear that there's a net benefit.

I've been testing bump and it's best in those builds that are using fetchlands.

Although I might omit bump for Dr Vincent Price (The Fly) [The 3/2 blue flying transformer] it seems like a good card with Goblin Guide and he offer evasion.

[zmattk]

Hey guys, I haven't played too much burn but I figured I'd make the deck since I have all the cards and MM is banned now. I've been looking at some of the mono R lists and I see a lot of people playing Shard Volley instead of Magma Jet. Is Magma Jet just too outdated now and the 2 cc and 2 damage just not good enough even with scry?

Also I do not plan on playing black since if I wanted to buy confidants and badlands I'd just make a different deck.

[Lancer]

Hey guys, I haven't played too much burn but I figured I'd make the deck since I have all the cards and MM is banned now. I've been looking at some of the mono R lists and I see a lot of people playing Shard Volley instead of Magma Jet. Is Magma Jet just too outdated now and the 2 cc and 2 damage just not good enough even with scry?

Also I do not plan on playing black since if I wanted to buy confidants and badlands I'd just make a different deck.

wow... Social influence...

Sorry you have been mistaken, burn was really strong when Mental Misstep was legal because combo was really put into check due to fear, now we must battle combo.

anyway...

Shard Volley sucks because the card requires a mountain and we play fireblast.

I'm not really a fan of Magma Jet because a good build dont need to scry, although players that play with 20 to 22 mountains may find Magma Jet helpful... then again 22 lands is too much IMHO

Bob sucks, for starters we play fireblast (a 6 damage hit) but what makes the card worse is that we are skipping turn 2 for a draw at turn 3.

[sligh16]

Haha kirby. I know it's not life loss, but redirect and stifle effects aren't exactly running all over the place. Every red spell you play gets you a turn ahead of Vortex. It's also only a 2 mana investment up front.

EDIT: I feel like such a tool now. Lol, I didn't know that it was 2 damage a turn effectively. That makes vortex much better (but still not cutting it for my md).

I play 3 shrines in Sligh and has been totally awesome. It almost reads: "your red cards deal 1 more damage to target player" It fixes the problem of losing gas in the lategame that almost all mono red burn heavy decks have, and can easily deal 8 damage by it's own. 3 copies seem fine to me, and I wouldn't compare it to Vortex. Each one has it's advantages, and playing both in the deck seems totally fine for me.

[Kanadell~]

IMO, Bump in the night is not worth to splash only for it, cause it makes our manabase weaker. And brimstone volley is not so god 'cause it costs 3 and does 5 in the best case, so it's not worth it.

[ryaneriggs]

Artifacts
4x Great Furnace
4x Mishra's Bauble
4x Ankh of Mishra
4x Urza's Bauble
4x Lodestone Bauble

Creatures
4x Keldon Marauders
4x Simian Spirit Guide

Land
12x Mountain

Spells
4x Fireblast
4x Lava Spike
4x Rite of Flame
4x Rift Bolt
4x Lightning Bolt

Sideboard
3x Smash to Smithereens/Shattering Spree
3x Scald
3x Shrapnel Blast
3x Goblin Arsonist
3x Red Elemental Blast/Guttural Response

My take on Ankh Burn...also with Baubles for ultimate drawing potential and some ramp...what do you think?

[DragoFireheart]

Burn loses to a resolved Batterskull. Burn loses to Storm or Reanimator getting Iona. This are issues that need to be resolved before Burn can compete.