I believe it's Day 1 undefeated.Originally Posted by Gui
HokusSchmokus already wrote a report and it didn't go well for him apparently. That's another german player with the new german dredge list.
edit: if he is, congrats to him on that!
He did well in Trials, aparently
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
Yes I did. The problem with the UB list is: it sucks. That is the most precise criticism one can give to that. That's what I'm raging about after all: the level of randomness in Ichorid is soooo fricking high.Less so in manaless, though.
Edit: WTF wizards? since when am I a Kaiser? That's my fucking last name, not my title.
Srsly what the f is up with coverage in this company?
Fabian Görtzgen made 5th, not 4th AND 5th place, His player profile is all messed up too...way to diss the germans.-.-
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Cmon man, you're not that mad! The GP experience it's not that bad, even if it goes bad you can take something positive from it.
Besides badluck, what did go wrong that you can correct? Can you talk about the SB, did you use it all?
Last edited by Godmode; 10-24-2011 at 11:20 AM.
@HokusSchmokus: Congratz on your day 1 results, it's good to see Firestorm working.
Day 2 was just lack of luck, or you think you could improve your list?
Particularly, I wouldn't cut the single DR main deck, although I understand your point.
In SB, if we cut Nature's Claim for Chain of Vapor, it should help in the Reanimator matchup, maybe even allowing to cut Faerie Macabre (because we can't side into 7).
Last edited by Mojeh; 10-24-2011 at 11:09 AM. Reason: Game 2 -> Day 2
@Godmode: That's not my point, I had a great time playing such a big event, I did my best and that's all one can do. Neither am I mad at any of my opponents for having more luck than me.It's the decks randomness that pisses me off. In my GPT I made a lot of play mistakes. Still crushed everything. On Saturday, I was very focused because I knew I could not afford to make any. Fun fact: I didn't. I made a couple of suboptimal choices with Therapy but, and I am very sure of that I did not make any mistake that had influence on the gamestate.Game 2 Sideevents: Crushed 2 Bad matchups in 3 Lucky Dips, then lost the semis to Threshold / Merfolk / CB-Top(without creatures)and all 3 without ANY hate. And all are good matchups.Very good. The deck just shit on me HARDCORE two days in a row. The mistake I DID make was suboptimal deckbuilding. The DR just sucked. It will get cut though, probably for 13th dredger (darkblast).
What do you mean with: Did I use my SB at all? Of course I did. Faerie Macabres were not used though. Didn't face Reanimator. I did a lot of testing against it between the rounds though, and they don't do anything. Better run 2 Coffin Purge or nothing at all I think.Nothing might be best though because 2 Purges won't help.
BTW Chain of Vapor does not help, too. Non-permanent solutions kind of suck if you cannot kill your opponent outright.(this was also @mojeh)
Finally, I think a lot of you guys have to get over the old stereotype of having to use DR. It weakens the deck's consistency and is a dead hand card. If you run less then 2 of them, they are not reliable to find either.Just put two in the side and call it quits. We are not Manaless Dredge, where they indeed are needed.Please do me a favour and test it for a few games(not too few) without. Maybe just go to your local tournament without it. The only reason I can really understand for DR main is playstyle. But that's nothing I can do anything about.
Edit: I realised I just sound like a spoiled child that didn't get his favourite food once. The thing is I played really quite a bit of Dredge in my time and it really is one of the most random decks out there. It's in the mechanic. And although I did dredge bad before quite often, it was never this bad.
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In my view, DR is a sac outlet for game 1. You can go without sac outlets, specially when relying on Ichorids more heavily. But every once in a while, you will stall with only one therapy on the grave, and some number of moebas and bridges waiting to be put to use.
I'll try less than 2 DRs, but I think 4 therapies, specially since they only sac 1 guy each time, will be less than I want to have. And I say that because I use DR every time to sac my moebas. Reviving a huge troll in the process is just a bonus that is often not necessary, but he ends up eating some guy on the other side, or netting lots of life by StP.
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
The best way to deal with GW is Tribe/Firestorm turn 1, followed by Cephalid Coliseum/Breakthrough turn 2, simple as that. If they can't ramp turn 1 (via GSZ, Noble), you're way ahead in board position. Just Therapy for Enlightned Tutor/KotR/Teeg and you'll be fine.
Second thoughts in Firestorm: That card makes poor keeping choices sometimes. For example: You have no dredgers or draw spells (in a fast matchup), and keep them because you can disrupt your foe a bit, and lose because of it.
@HokusSchmokus I lol'd hard at Elesh ZORN, Grand Genocide, HAHA.
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
@Gui Don't forget that firestorm is a sac outlet, and a discard outlet at the same time.
@ Vandalize: that's just what she is :P
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Granted. But this is a 30ish percent chance, that with mull to 4 doesn't get much better than 60ish percent. This is a terrible % chance, in my view, specially when you want to keep playable hands without draw spells, etc. Firestorm helps buying time, but that won't help if you can't keep dredging.
This is less relevant when you need to use it as a discard, and can't use it from graveyard when dredged.
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
I 100% agree that we should at any cost try to achieve the best consistency. But still I'd never cut DR entirely from my main board. It doesn't just take away the gigantic Trolls. It also makes Bridge and Narcomoebas (the 2 most important cards in the deck) much much worse. Gui is right here, your Narcs will often just sit there with nothing to do, waiting for your opponent to find a way to remove your Bridges. 1/1 Flyers are a bad joke in Legacy. They're only good if they always turn into 2-3 2/2 Zombies. And you can not guarantee that 'Always' without DR.
There will be scenarios where you'd wish that DR in your hand was a Dredger. And those hands would be way better if it was. I've tested it, because I found that idea interesting. But while I lost a totally irrelevant amount of games (if any) when I had DR in my opener instead of a Dredger or whatever, I lost a lot more games because my graveyard just didn't get there after Breakthrough. And at that point, I think we're going overboard with consistency.
I totally agree. You can use a draw spell/coliseum on turn 2 and simply get stuck, with no sac outlets and leaving your graveyard vulnerable. Furthermore, speed IS relevant... and come on, we are talking about 1 DR, not 3-4 slots (DR + targets).
Agreed for the most part, although I think a strict UB list does have some latent potential in theory. The Manaless list was also pretty suspect in that they were only running one draw target with three specialty targets, as opposed to, what I've found to be correct, three draw targets (Sphinx of Lost Truths, for example) and one-two specialty target(s).
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Is Sun Titan a viable card to use in order to enable us dead cards in the GY like Firestorm or even a breakthrough?
And what about Jin-Gitaxias? I know he can blow our deck but I think it's game when it hits the board, and we can easily sac it with therapy or DR...
How do you guys feel about these two?
When Firestorm and Breakthrough become permanents, Sun Titan will be pretty good.
Jin is good in reanimator because they can protect him. We can't protect Jin, and for that reason, he's not a viable option.
Let your Dredge 6 be: Narco, Narco, Narco, Bridge, Bridge, Dread Return
Also , they won't be Md which makes them less useful
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Sun Titan would be awesome if Bazaar was legal.
Dude.
If Bazaar was legal I would win every big tournament in Europe.Period.
Sun Titan or not, who cares?
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What do you guys think are the best DR targets against Maverick? How do you guys proceed siding?
@ Hokus
What are the matches in which you side Elesh, and what do you side out for it?
If you fail to explain the reason behind your choice, technically, it's the wrong choice.
Zerk Thread -- Really, fun deck! ^^
I think that Elesh should be the best DR Target. When I still ran Iona main, Therapying for Swords and dropping Iona on green also shuts down pretty much everything they can do.
That being said, I usually don't board any DR target against them. I usually board all Firestorms in and hope that I can beat them with a consistent start. The only thing I might actually board in is Elesh. And often, I feel that she's either not needed or doesn't help you out against Ooze or KotR for Bojuka Bog.
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