One or two pages ago someone asked why the deck doesn't play 4 Deeds and for BUG I had no answer. So I added a fourth Deed and also a 4th Decay and removed the 2 Inquisitions.Originally Posted by Ayotte
With this I think that replacing Liliana with Vendilion Clique could be good. With 4 Decay/ 4 Deed maindeck you still have a lot of Removal. The deck gets weaker against high CC creatures but there aren't many Tombstalkers at the moment. This would give more blue cards for the FoW count. The difference between 17 and 19 is quite noticeable.
I am also still undecided between Engineered Plague and Damnation. Damnation is good against Merfolk, RUG and decks with Tombstalker, Plague is good against Goblins, Elves and Dredge. Both are good against Mother of Runes + Phyrexian Revoker.
Overall I think the deck is almost perfect, just a few little adjustments are needed.
Body (Left) 3BG
Sorcery Rare
Exile target creature from a graveyard, put X +1/+1 counters on target creature. X equal to the power of target card you exiled this way.
Blood(Right) RG
Sorcery Rare
Target creature you control deals damage equal to its power to target creature or target player.
Fuse (You may cast one or both halves of this card from your hand.)
Possible wish target? It doesn't do anything that reanimate or maelstrom pulse can't already do, but they are on the same card. Seems doubtful to me.
Seems incredibly dubious, and I'm more than a tad disappointed that that's our fuse card -- at rare, nonetheless!
I mean, really? One activation of Scavenge for 3BG? =/
Making a really big dude doesn't do anything for me -- I'd rather run Reanimate and get the come-into-play triggers (and the ability to steal from your opponents' graveyard). Soul's Fire doesn't really do anything for me either. Best case you spend 2 cards and 4 mana to do 5-6 damage to something, which doesn't seem worth it.
Vralz would combo really well with Death's Shadow if there was a way to incorporate that into an aggro nic fit.
Does anyone have a recent list of the 4c rector version?
My list hasn't really changed, should be able to find it still :)
Mainboard (60)
22 Lands
2 Bayou
1 Flooded Strand
2 Forest
2 Island
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Plains
1 Polluted Delta
1 Savannah
1 Scrubland
2 Swamp
2 Tropical Island
1 Underground Sea
3 Verdant Catacombs
15 Creatures
3 Academy Rector
3 Baleful Strix
2 Eternal Witness
2 Thragtusk
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Thorn
21 Other spells
4 Brainstorm
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Diabolic Intent
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Moat
1 Omniscience
3 Pernicious Deed
1 Recurring Nightmare
2 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Vindicate
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Planeswalkers
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Sideboard (15)
1 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Memoricide
1 Nether Void
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Thoughtseize
3 Carpet of Flowers
1 Damnation
1 Something - probably anti-Deathrite
Finally sleeved up HoneyT's Punishing Fit (the 60 cards because I forgot the Stronghold D:). Based on a few games, this thing feels odd. My first instinct is that I want more discard and/or card draw. Probably discard, so I can get more information.
Also, I've never played an Explorer deck before - my Highlander is highly similar to Rector Fit but Explorer is just not viable in that format. I'm especially puzzled as to how you're supposed to utilize Explorers G1 vs. things like UW Miracles/Landstill or UR Delver.
@Tao,
I probably wouldn't touch Liliana in a BUG list with Jace because double black is too prohibitive, especialy if you are trying to make FoW work. Clique is a good idea for a replacement, I did play a couple of Cliques in my first attempts to BUG and it works fine.
What do you think of a split between Decay and Far // Away? I think the new card has potential in BUG Fit because it comes down fast enough, offers instant sac ability which can be lacking when Liliana is removed, and fusing the card is a small feat for Nic Fit. It can also act as a double removal spell when you are able to flash a Therapy. I also love how smooth it is to get rid of 2 attackers at the end of an opponent's turn just to slam a Jace during your own. Not only is it good to cripple your opponent, it is also great to generate value and/or save creatures when the Far portion of the spell is applied to Clique/Thragtusk/Witness/Snapcaster and the Away part on your opponent. I am looking forward to see how Far // Away will affect Nic Fit, perhaps it will enable FoW more consistently
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
That card looks pretty sweat. Best thing I think I've seen spoiled. Each half is good, we can afford to pay the combined cost, and each half has synergistic applications for us with death triggers and ETB triggers which means it's not even completely dead vs decks that don't win via combat. Seems like a good addition to push BUG versions forward.
Tao: I spent 8 hours today jamming games vs Stoneblade and ANT with your BUG list (-3 Extraction, +2 Extirpate, +1 Thoughtseize in board) trying to see how good those matchups were compared to Scapewish. People at my LGS don't really play those decks much so I wasn't that experienced.
ANT was obviously a better matchup than with other Nic Fit lists, but the problem was, even with all of the counterspells, he was able to go off almost every game because I lack an early clock. He was boarding in Dark Confidant, which I'm not sure is normal, and it was REALLY good post-board. My clock was basically Ooze, Thrun, or Jace, and if I couldn't stick one early, that was it. I often couldn't stick one early because I needed to keep hands with counterspells and/or discard, which he was still able to fight through with his own discard and good play. Boarding for this, I was taking out the fat creatures, Deeds, and 3 Veteran Explorers for the blue cards, leaving in Abrupt Decay for the Carpet of Flowers/Bobs that he was bringing in. I don't like Explorer in this matchup because it basically just gives him a free ritual for the rest of the game, and since I was boarding out the big creatures, there wasn't really anything to ramp to.
Stoneblade seemed close to 50-50, with them favored post board. He brought in geists, and since I didn't really have much to bring in, his deck was the much better Jace deck with geist, lingering souls, and mystic. How would you board for this matchup? I always brought in 2 Extirpate and 1 Thoughtseize for 3 Abrupt Decays. I also tried boarding out Liliana or Explorers for negates. Even though it sucks to give him mana to batterskull/snapcaster/jace early, I think we need to keep in explorers because the games I won were those with Therapy/Explorer/Thrun or Thragtusk hands.
I have a feeling that my sideboard plans might have been pretty far from optimal. If they weren't, I think I'll just play Scapeshift at Milwaukee tomorrow.
Edit: Anyone at Milwaukee, I'll be in the crowd of people with the Mox Mania shirts. Come say hi.
Here is my latest attempt at BUG Nic Fit with Far // Away:
Creatures (8)
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Eternal Witness
1 Thragtusk
1 Primeval Titan
Spells (30)
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Brainstorm
2 Counterspell
2 Far // Away
3 Force of Will
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Pernicious Deed
Lands (22)
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Phyrexian Tower
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Tropical Island
2 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Island
2 Forest
1 Swamp
Sideboard (15)
3 Thoughtseize
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Abrupt Decay
2 Negate
1 Force of Will
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Selkie Hedge-Mage
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
Do you know what assuming does? It makes an ass out of you and me.
Get it...? Ass, u, me?
... ffs I was trying to be funny...
So I ran the following Rector list in a local 32 man today and went 2-3 so attached is a short report and the list. Any advice would be much appreciated!
The Deck
[U]Creatures[U]
4x Veteran Explorer
3x Academy Rector
2x Baneslayer Angel
2x Eternal Witness
1x Sigarda
1x Thragtusk
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Sun Titan
1x Fierce Empath
1x Starved Rusalka
1x Yosei, the Morning Star
Spells
4x Cabal Therapy
3x Green Sun's Zenith
3x Sensei's Divining Top
3x Pernicious Deed
2x Maelstrom Pulse
1x Garruk Relentless
1x Recurring Nightmare
1x Recycle
1x Faith's Fetters
1x Moat
[U]Lands[U]
3x Forest
3x Verdant Catacombs
3x Marsh Flats
2x Plains
2x Swamp
2x Windswept Heath
2x Phyrexian Tower
1x Dryad Arbor
1x Volrath's Stronghold
1x Bayou
1x Savannah
1x Scrubland
Sideboard
3x Mindbreak Trap
3x Extripate
1x Humility
1x Nethervoid
1x Curse of Death's Hold
1x Ifh-Biff Efreet
1x Angel of Despair
1x Gaddock Teeg
1x Memoricide
1xCranial Extraction
1x Divine Intervention (this is an attempt at a super troll for some people and could be a potential emergy eject button)
Round 1 Rug Delver (0-2)
G1: On the draw I don't know what I'm up against blind therapy a brainstorm off of a bayou. Promptly draw phyrexian tower and dryad arbor and have the bayou wasted. I'm presented with a tough situation to either flashback therapy hitting his double daze and taking me to 2 lands with a pulse and rector and deed in hand to his flipped delver and mongoose. I pass up the chance and proceed to get crushed.
G2: On the play I keep a decent 7 and proceed to set of an explorer with no top end. I quickly die to triple lighting bolt and double mongeese.
Round 2: Combo Elves (Craterhoof/Natural Order variant) (2-0)
G1: The rust falls off as he opens with fetch to basic to drs. I slam top when I have both therapy and explorer in hand. His second turn he fetchs another forest and right as it dawns on me that hes playing elves, he drops glimpse. He only draws like 2 cards and I imeadietly follow with a therapy naming glimpse (hit) and see craterhoof. I then flashback on the explorer taking it. Rector shenaningans happen shortley after resulting in a moat staring down a single deathrite shaman. About 6 shuffle effects later I finally find the Garruk to grab a flyer and cause him to scoop.
G2: I keep a therpy 7 and wiff naming glimpse and see his 2 symbiotes a crop rotation and a quiron ranger. I proceed to memoricide his glimpes (hitting all 4 in his deck) and then drop moat. I find a sigarda much more quickly this game and he scoops.
Round 3 Goblins (2-0) (aka the reason why rusalka isn't getting the axe upon dragon's maze)
G1: I win the die roll and proceed to see a piledriver dropped on my face. Fortunately my hand contains all three pernicious deed. The first couple of deeds buy me enough time to finally dig for the moat staving him off with me at 6. He then matrons for siege-gang commander to my sigarda. I spin a top at the end of his turn find a fetch and not much else, however he only has 2 mountains in play so I have a turn to not die, however he is at 9 at this point and I can't push the damage through as the eternal witness is in play is grounded. So I cracked the fetch and re-spun the top finding Green Sun's Zenith. This in turn leaves me with enough mana to search for rusalka and leave 2 green up. I get it swing with sigarda, and take him to 4. He draws a card and passes. On my next attack step he attempts to kill me with me at 5 and him able to do 6 damage. Ruslaka then eats eternal witness and itself leaving me at 1 and him at -1 with the sigarda swing.
G2: I keep a solid hand of explorer, lands, deed maelstrom pulse, and empath. He doesnt have lacky so I drop explorer, which promptley gets path to exiled. Next turn I drop empath finding Sun Titan. He drops more goblins (including double piledriver) some attack happen and i drop to 12. Pernicious Deed drops and explodes. There is little backlash to the deed, which is quickly followed by Sun Titan recursion.
Round 4: Elves (0-2) (Emrakul Classic Style)
G1: He starts with an agressive hand and I immeadietly pick up on the elves plan. This time I therapy on glimpse and wiff seeing summoners pact. I then proceed to miss a couple land drops until eventually I drop a rector and sac it finding moat. This then stalls him out for a while, but eventually he finds the glimpse and I'm dead to a giant tentacle monster
G2: I use the appropriate therapy names and wiff. He ended up keeping a slow hand to which i eventually cast a nethervoid. His board state is fairly large at this time so I deploy a deed to attempt to not die, this in turn dies to his one of two abrupt decays while I'm tapped out. Eventually a Green Sun's Zenith with a total cost of 12 is dropped which leaves me a craterlike position.
Round 5: Jund (0-2)
G1: I mull to 5 as the first hand was a 1 lander and the second a no lander. I quickly die to some combination of goyf, deathrite, and bloodbraid elf.
G2: I keep a decent hand containing both moat and sigarda. Sigarda got discarded by a hymn and moat then happens. Eventually I find a deed and drop it to his double deathrite shamans and bloodbraid elf. I then drop Sun Titan with the intention of reccuring deed only to have my dreams promptly crushed by a Liliana. To put some salt in the wound, the next turn I drew Memoricide. Eventually I die to a combination of punishing fires and deathrite.
All in all it was a fine tournament and the deck handled pretty well. The main deck I've noticed I'm having trouble with is jund. The meta were several Delver decks, several Elves decks, 4 Dredge decks, and primarily Stoneblade. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Spoiler from Dragon's Maze Varolz, the Scar-Striped in combination with Phyrexian Dreadnought
I am seeing this in some kind of BUG fit list with Stifles and other stuff. Owh man how i love to see Full English Breakfast back on its feet in Legacy.
@Ayotte:
- Against Stoneforge always side out Wurmcoils first. They will just get Sworded for a giant Tempo loss. Bring in Negates, too.
- When I made the SB Stoneblade was not a thing. This has changed a lot recently. So I would play with 3 Carpet of Flowers in the SB now. They are great against RUG and BUG, too. SB slots are an issue.
This would be what I would play today:
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Misty Rainforest
2 Polluted Delta
2 Forest
2 Swamp
2 Island
2 Tropical Island
1 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Phyrexian Tower
2 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Green Sun's Zenith
4 Veteran Explorer
2 Eternal Witness
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Thragtusk
1 Primeval Titan
2 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Cabal Therapy
4 Abrupt Decay
3 Pernicious Deed
2 Damnation
4 Brainstorm
4 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Carpet of Flowers
SB: 4 Force of Will
SB: 3 Negate
SB: 2 Mindbreak Trap
Esper Stoneblade:
- 3 Veteran Explorer
- 2 Damnation
- 2 Abrupt Decay
- 2 Wurmcoil Engine
+ 3 Surgical Extraction
+ 3 Negate
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
TES / ANT / Sneak and Tell / High Tide:
- 4 Abrupt Decay
- 4 Pernicious Deed
- 2 Damnation
- 2 Wurmcoil Engine
- 1 Thragtusk
- 1 Thrun
- 1 Swamp
+ 4 Force of Will
+ 2 Negate
+ 2 Mindbreak Trap
+ 2 Surgical Extraction
+ 0-3 Carpet of Flowers (Depending on deck. Also you might want to keep Deeds in the deck for Empty the Warrens or like you said Decay for Confidants.)
RUG:
- 1 Primeval Titan
- 2 Jace TMS
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
BUG Delver:
- 1 Primeval Titan
- 2 Vendilion Clique
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
BUG Control / Shardless BUG:
- it really depends on how Aggro they are; maybe side out Explorers, maybe keep them
+ 3 Carpet of Flowers
+ maybe Negate
So far, 1-1 in milwaukee. Beat punishing jund and lost to sneak/show. Somebody is play eggs here. I hate them.
1-2. Lost to trinsphere/tezz/smokestack. Very ew.
2-2 with scapewish. beat ant and stoneblade. lost to a uw standstill/counterbalance/mystic brew and combo elves. also, yeah, the eggs player doesnt only hate himself, he hates everyone in the room.
Heh. 3-2 now. Beast esperblade twice
BUG Nic Fit on camera right now at SCG Milwaukee!
Anybody know if he's one of ours?
I disagree with most of his technical plays. Make him have the 2nd snapcaster g1 and if not he gets to eat the ponder and another card. Failing to get 2 lands off the 2nd titan activation. G2 his clique play, can let him use up both fetches and clique in response to activation instead of in front of the first fetch. Glad hes done well enough to get the feature match though.
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