[Deck] Nic Fit (GBx Explorer Zenith Control)

[GtF]

Why not memoricide/cranial? All you need is 1 ramp source to play them on t3, which is as soon as pilferer becomes relevant. In addition, they can name something that your opponent doesn't draw (very relevant with tendrils vs ant). They serve a very different role to force. Extraction effects exile wincons but cost a lot of mana, while force is free but can only counter one thing, and can't counter wincons. That's why I was thinking of replacing pilferers with memoricide/extraction.

His pod list specifically runs 8 ramp sources, so I don't think that would be too much of a problem. In addition, the list has so much countermagic that stalling to t4 doesn't seem like a problem either.

It would be great to have cranial in addition to FOW and Pilferer, but as long as you have to make a choice due to SB space considerations I'd rather have FOW and Pilferer. The reason is that many combo decks play multiple win conditions (Sneak attack + Show and tell, Burning wish + Infernal Tutor), so countering the one they have rather than extracting one and having them draw the other seems better. Pilferer also really pressures them to have to go off quickly, it can strip their auxiliary resources (Extra FOWs they may have) which can let the rest of your resistence work. And it is blue for force of will and a creature for Pod so it works well with those.
Same logic applies to surgical, though I have considered wanting one for punishing fire in the punishing jund matchup.

[pfiremc13]

I mean Slaughter Games works for the Jund colored versions right? I'm not insinuating that you are wrong. You should definitely test it out. I think the point of Svknoe is that if you are playing Pod, and you want to be in blue, the best reason to be in blue is giving yourself Force of Will (and brainstorm). If you want to be in pod and you dont want Force, then other colors are generally better options.

I'm not questioning force. I'm questioning pilferer.

It would be great to have cranial in addition to FOW and Pilferer, but as long as you have to make a choice due to SB space considerations I'd rather have FOW and Pilferer. The reason is that many combo decks play multiple win conditions (Sneak attack + Show and tell, Burning wish + Infernal Tutor), so countering the one they have rather than extracting one and having them draw the other seems better. Pilferer also really pressures them to have to go off quickly, it can strip their auxiliary resources (Extra FOWs they may have) which can let the rest of your resistence work. And it is blue for force of will and a creature for Pod so it works well with those.
Same logic applies to surgical, though I have considered wanting one for punishing fire in the punishing jund matchup.

Good point. Though I don't think tes normally splits wincons between main and side, the point about other decks is quite relevant.

(The point of all this questioning was to see if I wanted to add headhunter to thune fit. However, I think that the reasons bug pod wants pilferer (blue for force, good vs. other combo decks) are not really applicable to thune fit, which is mostly worried about storm.)

[Megadeus]

In that cae, not sure if it is worth it in Thune or not. Also fwiw vs TES, Surgicaling their Burning wish generally cuts them off of Tendrils and leaves them on the Empty plan. Assuming they didnt board in Tendrils.

[Svknoe]

I think that the reason that Pilferer is very in BUG Pod is that you can hold up counters while beating with it. The Pilferer gives them incentive to go off right away and not wait for protection, while the counters stop just that. If they then fizzle trying to combo, staring down a pilferer, they are close to dead. The threat of discard every turn is very strong combined with counters. I you do not play counters and cast a Headhunter, you run the risk of dying on one of the two following turns. Targeted discard seems much more suited to buy time if your plan is to make to cast a cranial extraction effect. Headhunter might be playable i Thune, but I suspect that extraction effects are better suited for Thune's path to victory.

[pfiremc13]

And there's that too.

GBW definitely doesn't have as strong of a supplemental hate plan, and what it does have is in the form of 2-drops which compete with the 'hunter.

[Svknoe]

That is true indeed. The very strong white hate bears make the Headhunters seem quite bad. I think that the hate bears synergise well with the extraction effects, creating a prison where they can't play their combo. Headhunter attacks from another angle entirely. I don't think that those different angles synergise too well with each other.

[uncletiggy]

Is there any merit to exploring doubling season in walker heavy rector lists I just imagine dropping and ulting walkers could be really devastating even tho it doesn't help them tick up.

[Megadeus]

BUG Pod on cam for Legion Games right now. Nothing like brainstorming for your clutch Thragtusk to put the game out of reach. I forgot about Fleshbag Marauder. Seems AWESOME in pod.

[Zorker]

link for the stream?

[Svknoe]

http://www.twitch.tv/legiongamesmn/b/488255836

The Pod games start a few minutes before the 2 hour mark.

It's nice to see some games. I don't like playing important cards like explorer and pod into daze. Especially not on the draw. That the opponent started of with Tropical Island into Brainstorm was a strong indication that he was playing RUG.

[Zorker]

thanks svkoe, was he playing canadian?

[Svknoe]

Yes. The opponent was playing canadian thresh or RUG Delver.

[Megadeus]

I'll be on almost fully foiled out BUG Pod tonight. Hopefully it goes well for my first attempt. Unfortunately my LGS doesnt have any Swan Songs so 2 Negates in the board for me!

[Svknoe]

Best of luck with that! What does your list look like? I'd like to hear how Negate works out. I liked that you can easily hold up Envelop while beating with pilferer and doing other things.

[Megadeus]

Best of luck with that! What does your list look like? I'd like to hear how Negate works out. I liked that you can easily hold up Envelop while beating with pilferer and doing other things.

List is...

4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Veteran Explorer
1 Phantasmal Image
3 Baleful Strix
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Fleshbag Marauder
1 Eternal Witness
1 Wood Elves
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 Sower of Temptation
1 Thrun
1 Acidic Slime
1 Shriekmaw
1 Thragtusk
1 Grave Titan

3 Birthing Pod
2 DEED
4 Cabal Therapy
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Brainstorm
2 Green Sun

4 Catacomb
4 Misty
3 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
1 Underground Sea
3 Forest
2 Island
2 Swamp


SB:
4 Force of Will
2 Negate
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 Notion Thief
1 Deed
3 Pilferer
3 Thoughtseize



Its pretty close to you list. I wanted to base my initial list off of something that has had success.

[Megadeus]

Sorry for double post. With the above list I went 2-2. Not too bad. Lost to Shardless due to flood, and D&T due to Bricking on lands off of Brainstorm. I was like 5 for 7 on blind Therapies which was pretty sweet. Sniping bitches. My meta honestly doesnt even need force of will. Ill probably cut it and the pilferers to go up to 3 Swan Songs, a few Golgari Charm, and a few other flex slots. Also probably drop the SB Glen Elendra Archmage. I beat Jund and UR Delver. Basically every game I boarded out Glen Elendra and brought in Deed

[Svknoe]

Interesting. If there is not enough combo for you to want Force of Will I think that I would not play the blue pod deck. Other Nic Fit variants seem stronger against most of those decks. How did Thrun fare? I would have imagined that he would not synergise too well with a pod deck.

[Megadeus]

Interesting. If there is not enough combo for you to want Force of Will I think that I would not play the blue pod deck. Other Nic Fit variants seem stronger against most of those decks. How did Thrun fare? I would have imagined that he would not synergise too well with a pod deck.

I like the blue actually. Baleful Strix is really good in a Delver and Goyf Meta like mine. Notion Thief is sweet vs Shardless. Image, Sower, brainstorm, all were very good for me. The only issue was my SB which is just not that good in my local due to lack of combo. There was a Dredge deck, a rouge hermit, and a sort of elves build with Buried Alive and vengevines. Plus Blue has a certain fun factor. I hate White spells lol.

I never drew Thrun, and I only got to activate Pod like twice so I was never chaining up. I just figured he is solid vs Jace, which I felt was somewhat of an Issue for me. I do agree that he probably doesn't synergize well and maybe he isn't good enough. Unfortunately next week is Christmas so I have 2 weeks until I get to play it again.

Honestly it was a weird night. Like I said, I only got to activate pod twice and I think I cast Green sun (2 of) 1 time and that was for Scavenging Ooze vs UR Delver. So basically it was just me playing EDH vs Legacy decks lol. Pile of 1 ofs.

Also I really liked brainstorm for shuffling away random 6 drops that I would have in my hand when I dont have an explorer hand. That was nice.

[GtF]

I like the blue actually. Baleful Strix is really good in a Delver and Goyf Meta like mine. Notion Thief is sweet vs Shardless. Image, Sower, brainstorm, all were very good for me. The only issue was my SB which is just not that good in my local due to lack of combo. There was a Dredge deck, a rouge hermit, and a sort of elves build with Buried Alive and vengevines. Plus Blue has a certain fun factor. I hate White spells lol.

I never drew Thrun, and I only got to activate Pod like twice so I was never chaining up. I just figured he is solid vs Jace, which I felt was somewhat of an Issue for me. I do agree that he probably doesn't synergize well and maybe he isn't good enough. Unfortunately next week is Christmas so I have 2 weeks until I get to play it again.

Honestly it was a weird night. Like I said, I only got to activate pod twice and I think I cast Green sun (2 of) 1 time and that was for Scavenging Ooze vs UR Delver. So basically it was just me playing EDH vs Legacy decks lol. Pile of 1 ofs.

Also I really liked brainstorm for shuffling away random 6 drops that I would have in my hand when I dont have an explorer hand. That was nice.

I hate to admit it, but it probably is correct to just play 4 brainstorm in this deck (and any deck). It really helps with the flooding/manascrew issues which seem to be the main way you lose in a deck that has a bunch of high mana cost creatures like this. Maybe this means playing 61 cards, I'm not sure. I'm sorry Queerios!

Is it completely crazy to switch to 2 GSZ and 3 Veteran Explorer? The value of vet seems to go down dramatically after the first one (it also doesn't help that I switched to only 5 basics in the 4 color build I'm testing) and topdecking vets later on would be less good than topdecking a GSZ. Theoretically you still have the same number total.

I could see Thrun as a nice SB card vs Jace decks but it doesn't seem like a great maindeck card to me. Depends on the metagame I suppose.

[Megadeus]

3 veteran doesnt seem terrible. Especially when you are also playing DRS as an alternative mana source. I may actually cut down to 3 Vets and 4 BS next week (already on 61 cards). The one issue I see however is that veteran is the best card in the deck for sacrificing to Cabal Therapy. I dont want to sacrifice a DRS to it, and Strix is fine, but against Goyf decks Id usually just rather have him there to be a wall for Goyf.

As for Thrun, I'm not saying you guys are wrong, that is just my reasoning for playing him. Once I get more testing time in with the deck I will be able to give a better opinion.