[DTB] Blade Control

[blablub]

Sounds good, but i think you don't need Geist in the Board anymore :P
Maybe change them for Meddling Mages
I dont understand the Darkblast, do you think its a good choice atm? against Death/Taxes it might be good. Otherwise i think you can swap the Perish for another Supreme Verdict to fight other Nemesiis.
Therapy is not good enough without Souls, so another TS might be right

So we are on this:

3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Vendilion Clique
3 True-Name Nemesis
Creatures [8]

3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
Planeswalkers [3]

1 Batterskull
4 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
1 Engineered Explosives
3 Force of Will
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Ponder
2 Spell Pierce
1 Supreme Verdict
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Thoughtseize
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Vindicate

Spells [27]
1 Academy Ruins
4 Flooded Strand
2 Island
1 Karakas
2 Marsh Flats
1 Plains
3 Polluted Delta
1 Scrubland
1 Swamp
3 Tundra
3 Underground Sea

SB:
1 Thoughtseize
1 Darkblast
1 Disenchant
1 Force of Will
3 Meddling Mage
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Spell Pierce
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Zealous Persecution


I'm just brainstorming, what do you think? :)

[Arsenal]

Sideboard is whatever you want it to be for your expected meta. But the maindeck/manabase is pretty much set, imo. You'll see lists tinker with the numbers on certain cards slightly, but the GP Denver list is still the core to work from.

[HSCK]

You might want something that doesn't die to Abrupt Decay or Bolt and that TNN can't block profitably. Something like Cockatrice perhaps?

Right now I'm at 2 Snapcaster and 2 Lingering Souls and 3 mass removal spells in 2 Verdict and 1 EE. I've moved away from Inquisition to 3 TS only and 2 Counterspell to supplement the Forces in my disruption package.

[blablub]

So you've cutted the Spell Pierces?
the Idea of Souls sounds great because they fight Lilianas which can be an issue. otherwise they are bonkers against Miracles. I like the Idea.

Can you share your list plz? :)

[Arsenal]

You might want something that doesn't die to Abrupt Decay or Bolt and that TNN can't block profitably. Something like Cockatrice perhaps?

My eyes are watery from all the smoke from your burning strawman.

[HSCK]

So you've cutted the Spell Pierces?
the Idea of Souls sounds great because they fight Lilianas which can be an issue. otherwise they are bonkers against Miracles. I like the Idea.

Can you share your list plz? :)

Sure:

Esper Stoneblade

Planeswalkers:
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Artifacts:
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Batterskull

Spells:
1 Ponder
1 Vindicate
2 Counterspell
2 Supreme Verdict
2 Lingering Souls
3 Thoughtseize
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Swords to Plowshares

Creatures:
2 Snapcaster Mage
3 True-Name Nemesis
4 Stoneforge Mystic

Lands:
1 Swamp
1 Plains
2 Island
1 Karakas
3 Wasteland
1 Scrubland
3 Underground Sea
3 Tundra
4 Flooded Strand
4 Marsh Flats

Sideboard:
1 Path to Exile
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Humility
1 Thoughtseize
1 Supreme Verdict
1 Toxic Deluge
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Flusterstorm
2 Swan Song
3 Meddling Mage

[Arsenal]

@blabub

Darkblast is personal preference choice, imo. It's great versus Lingering Souls, Elves (a major meta player right now), decent versus Delver (hits a 1/1 Delver and you can still kill a flipped Delver with the upkeep -> Darkblast + Dredge -> Darkblast play), great versus the aforementioned Death and Taxes, and good-ish versus lots of random tier 2 stuff like Goblins, Maverick, etc. Admittedly, it's better if you're running Lingering Souls, but even without, it seems worth it (to me) to keep it in.

Also, Verdict seems better than Perish in a TNN meta, although Perish has it's place versus Elves, Jund, RUG Delver (assuming no TNN out of the SB) and Maverick. Although let's be real, Maverick isn't a deck anymore.

[Koby]

I think Josh Ravitz' build from SCG Invitational looks quite strong and eschews TNN because the card is just a fad.

For reference:

1 Batterskull
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Feast and Famine

3 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Vendilion Clique

3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Liliana of the Veil

4 Brainstorm
3 Force of Will
1 Spell Pierce
4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Lingering Souls
1 Ponder
1 Supreme Verdict
2 Thoughtseize

2 Island
1 Plains
1 Swamp
1 Creeping Tar Pit
4 Flooded Strand
1 Marsh Flats
4 Polluted Delta
1 Scrubland
3 Tundra
3 Underground Sea
1 Academy Ruins
1 Karakas

Sideboard:
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Meddling Mage
1 Notion Thief
1 Humility
2 Rest in Peace
1 Disenchant
1 Force of Will
1 Zealous Persecution
1 Supreme Verdict
2 Thoughtseize
1 Vindicate

[Arsenal]

Notion Thief, god that card is a blowout when it hits. I like him as a 1-of in every deck that can support him.

[Myelectronicdays]

Notion Thief, god that card is a blowout when it hits. I like him as a 1-of in every deck that can support him.

yeah i am always suprised he doesn't see more play.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

[...] and eschews TNN because the card is just a fad.

Probably sigging that. I mean, the only way this card is a fad is if it gets banned, and then that's a forced fad. He has changed things.

I've been able to appreciate Clique in the board as a 3-of, so that when I face decks that are good against TNN, I just board swap. It's so clean. I normally drop my 4th TNN for another sb card if I'm running the full set, but the idea that I still have a 3/1 evasive beater for an equip target that is still relevant against my matchup, honestly feels like home. Honestly, it makes that Karakas feel better too.

-ABC

[Koby]

I mean sure, it's a bigger Invisible Stalker, but it has no disruption against the decks that you want to disrupt - namely combo and control mirrors. It's not vulnerable to most removal. Neat. we aren't playing Standard format where you need to run 8-14 removals.

I call it a fad because we're likely to fade back to Clique/Lingering Souls within months.

[HSCK]

My eyes are watery from all the smoke from your burning strawman.

Aren't those good for this super warped TNN meta?

I don't think TNN is a fad, I think it'll vary between 2-3 as the meta flips and flops, but definitely here to stay.

[Arsenal]

Listen kiddo, if you read what I actually posted instead of what you think I posted, this wouldn't even be a thing. Why are you still on this? Did I hurt your feelings? Do you want a hug from Liliana?

[Secretly.A.Bee]

So I would like a small discussion on why exactly we don't play or even consider delver. He is just the tits. Turn one delver into turn 3 tnn is so strong with any kind of Counterspell backup it's hard for me to imagine not wanting it. Is there something I am just missing? I can't imagine what it might be.

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[trollking21]

So I would like a small discussion on why exactly we don't play or even consider delver. He is just the tits. Turn one delver into turn 3 tnn is so strong with any kind of Counterspell backup it's hard for me to imagine not wanting it. Is there something I am just missing? I can't imagine what it might be.

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19-20 instant/sorc and delver is not a good combo. Also what do you take out

[Secretly.A.Bee]

I'm not saying it's a card-for-card fix, I understand it would take some tinkering. I suppose it's most feasible in a UW build, so for the discussions sake let's use that.

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[luckme10]

This is why:

+ 4delver
+ 25 spells
+ 2/3 Jace
+ 3/4 TNN
+ 4 Stoneforge Mystic
+ 2 equipment
+ >= 22 lands

Can you get down to 60 cards with this setup?

So what do you want to cut? Jace? Since you're cutting jace you might as well be playing less lands. Now you've cut less lands but you may not have as good as a long game so you add daze and wasteland to slow down your opponent. Look you're playing UW Tempo, which I believe there's an infamous thread for that.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

Where does the magical number 25 come from? I don't disagree that is solid, I just would like something more solid than someone's word on the matter. Doesn't the amount of cantrips you run make a difference, or is 25 including a certain number of cantrips already? Any actual math to back it up?

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[Tormod]

Pretty much what luckme said.

There's nothing wrong with going down that road but be aware you don't want to be playing a strictly worse version of 2 decks.

25 is still too less. I've done it with 25 and its too inconsistent and that's with 4 Brainstorm and 4 Ponder.

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