Miracle Control

[decan]

Entreat is the worst card in the deck. I've been doing fairly successfully without it, and I would've attended Lille with 0 copies in my 75 if I would've been able to go.

you said it. fairly successful. at your local game store. werent you the guy who said miracles was an unfair deck?

[goblinsplayer]

I went 10-5 at SCG Worcester for 32nd place with this list.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=85191

My matchups were:
UWR Stoneblade 2-0
Maverick 2-0
UW Vial w/Standstill 2-1
Burn 2-1
Shardless BUG 2-0
Goblins 2-1
BUG Delver 1-2
Lands 0-2
MUD 1-2
Merfolk 2-1
Grixis Control 1-2
Omnitell 0-2
BG Depths 2-0
Elves 2-1
Painter 2-0

Overall, I think there were at least 2 matches that I could have won if I had played better, especially the match against BUG Delver in round 7. Going forward, I would add some amount of Monastery Mentors in the board, as well as try to fit the 4th FOW in the main somewhere.

[twndomn]

My bad for trying to get some feedback in this arrogant forum

What~!? I'm confused.

What do u guys think about the 4daze/4mentor list? Thanks!

The deck is closer toward SFM blade list than Miracles. Post your question on the Stoneblode thread instead.

Worst card
I'm sure Ein would say that Plains is the worst card in Miracles and he would run 20 lands if he could.

The real focus is that cards are competing for slots. As a result, they create cascading effect on other slots, on land count as well.

Clique and Snapcaster are competing for the same slots. Based on what you value more, your land count and ponder count will be adjusted accordingly.

Swords, Red Blast, and Councils are also competing for the same slots.

Now for the most important and most obvious,
JtMS, Ponder, Snapcaster, and dTT arre all competing for the same slots.


Conclusion, just find a combination that would work for you, 0 for certain card is acceptable.

[YamiJoey]

you said it. fairly successful. at your local game store. werent you the guy who said miracles was an unfair deck?

I started playing Mentor before Joe put it in his deck. I started playing an increased number of Snapcasters before Philipp. Brad and Joe have both cut down to one Entreat. There was a time when people were playing three.

Things change, and I believe I'm moving in the right direction.

[Poron]

I also think 1 Entreat is fine, due to how much it is clunky without Brainstorm. 0 never.

I see Mentor as a great wall, but hardly as a WC. Just win more may be.

Karakas + Clique, instead is always always stellar

[YamiJoey]

People underestimate just how quickly a Mentor can take over the game. It allows you to kill combo decks so much faster than Entreat.

[Secretly.A.Bee]

I started playing Mentor before Joe put it in his deck. I started playing an increased number of Snapcasters before Philipp. Brad and Joe have both cut down to one Entreat. There was a time when people were playing three.

Things change, and I believe I'm moving in the right direction.

And I said it was going to be fantastic (in this thread) in Miracles before anyone started playing it .

Hooray for me!

From my phone. I do my best, dammit!

[fluuu]

What~!? I'm confused.



The deck is closer toward SFM blade list than Miracles. Post your question on the Stoneblode thread instead.

Worst card
I'm sure Ein would say that Plains is the worst card in Miracles and he would run 20 lands if he could.

The real focus is that cards are competing for slots. As a result, they create cascading effect on other slots, on land count as well.

Clique and Snapcaster are competing for the same slots. Based on what you value more, your land count and ponder count will be adjusted accordingly.

Swords, Red Blast, and Councils are also competing for the same slots.

Now for the most important and most obvious,
JtMS, Ponder, Snapcaster, and dTT arre all competing for the same slots.


Conclusion, just find a combination that would work for you, 0 for certain card is acceptable.

Why? The deck still has counterbalance and sensei. It has the miracle core

[YamiJoey]

Because this is at core a control deck. Quad Mentor and Daze is not a control core. I was brewing a deck with Countertop and then 6 Pyromancer/Mentor, that played Daze, Gitaxian Probe, and all that good stuff. It's definitely not the same deck, but does seem viable.

[Poron]

it doesn't.. it would just suffer everything

Eng Explosives
Terminus
Pyroclasm
Staticaster
Toxic Deluge
Golgari Charm
Massacre

Mentor is very good against deck that require chump blocker imho.
It covers the same spot that Elspeth does but in a better way. it's faster and doges Pierces.

[mort-]

it doesn't.. it would just suffer everything

Eng Explosives
Terminus
Pyroclasm
Staticaster
Toxic Deluge
Golgari Charm
Massacre

Mentor is very good against deck that require chump blocker imho.
It covers the same spot that Elspeth does but in a better way. it's faster and doges Pierces.

I'll have to agree here. The best thing mentor does is win the mirror imho, and there are other ways to do that. against everything else, I think there are better cards - namely Stoneforge Mystic - which do a lot more on the matchups they matter. But maybe I'll have to see it for myself first bevor I'll dismiss Mentor completely.
On the matter of DTT, I don't actually think that it's that good. I've been playing 2 copies main and it just doesn't seem placed so well in this deck. Most people are cutting the 3rd Jace for the second copy, but almost everytime you're playing DTT, you're looking for high impact cards. And DTT can't provide them everytime, so you have to take a cantrip to go on. Honestly the best thing DTT does is clear the top 3 cards for another SDT activation. Most of the time I wished it was a Jace, so I've gone back to 3 Jace, 1 DTT and am quite happy.
For reverence, I'm currently testing this list. I'm not completely happy right now - and it certainly does need more testing / a bit of tuning - but at the same time it works pretty well, getting me a 3rd place at a GPT and 3-1 in 3 out of 6 dailies (the other being me playing.. badle ;) ):

1 Cavern of Souls
4 Flooded Strand
4 Island
1 Karakas
1 Mountain
2 Plains
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Tundra
1 Volcanic Island
[21 Lands]
3 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
[03 Planeswalkers]
4 Sensei’s Divining Top
[04 Artifacts]
3 Counterbalance
[03 Enchantments]
2 Snapcaster Mage
2 Vendilion Clique
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
[05 Creatures]
4 Brainstorm
1 Counterspell
1 Dig Through Time
4 Force of Will
2 Spell Pierce
3 Swords to Plowshares
[15 Instants]
1 Entreat the Angels
4 Ponder
4 Terminus
[09 Sorceries]
[60 cards maindeck]

Sideboard:

1 Blood Moon
1 Batterskull
1 Containment Priest
1 Disenchant
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Flusterstorm
1 Izzet Staticaster
3 Red Elemental Blast
1 Rest in Peace
2 Stoneforge Mystic
[15 cards sideboard]
[75 cards total]

[Poron]

Cavern of Soul is really required?

I mean you don't want to play a creature here unless you can protect it here (via Karakas or CounterTop) so.. you're not playing Mentor or SFM unless you set CT and you don't play Clique if you don't have Karakas (sure, that'only the theory).

do you name Humans I suppose? overall for Priests in SB also no Meddling Mage in the sb?

How do you deal with Sultai?

[mort-]

I don't think Cavern is required, but it has really been a house everytime I played it. Naming Wizard while playing G1 is correct as it makes all your creatures uncounterable, after sideboarding it's depending on which creature you have in your hand or want to resolve.
Also, protecting creatures isn't absolutely necessary because against the decks you want your utility creatures not being countered (like Miracles, Omnitell, Combo) you don't have to be afraid of removal.
BUG.. yeah, I'm not 100% sure what to do against them right now as the matchup feels harder than it is. Stoneforger does help a lot, Blood Moon outright wins, but there's the problem of getting to a point where you can safely deploy all the key cards, which is a bit hard. Actually, this is the matchup I feel most uncomfortable with.

Edit: I don't think you need MM in the SB, as it stands, the SB is too tight. There's lots of cards I want to pack in there, but don't find the room between main / SB.

[jarvisyu]

I also played miracles, went 5-1 0-3 (losing 3 matches to competent people, but also felt close).

Monastery Mentor is absurdly good as a sideboard card.

I then lost playing for t8 of the modern premier IQ to literal hooting mandrills. /wrist

[cartothemax]

I went 10-5 at SCG Worcester for 32nd place with this list.
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deck...p?DeckID=85191

My matchups were:
UWR Stoneblade 2-0
Maverick 2-0
UW Vial w/Standstill 2-1
Burn 2-1
Shardless BUG 2-0
Goblins 2-1
BUG Delver 1-2
Lands 0-2
MUD 1-2
Merfolk 2-1
Grixis Control 1-2
Omnitell 0-2
BG Depths 2-0
Elves 2-1
Painter 2-0

Overall, I think there were at least 2 matches that I could have won if I had played better, especially the match against BUG Delver in round 7. Going forward, I would add some amount of Monastery Mentors in the board, as well as try to fit the 4th FOW in the main somewhere.

Congrats on your finish. Would the 2nd Counterspell be worth cutting in your mind for the 4th FOW? Also, how were the Meddling Mages in your SB? Do you remember which matches you brought them in for and what you named or were hoping to name?

Thanks in advance for insights.

[Ticalstal]

I also played miracles, went 5-1 0-3 (losing 3 matches to competent people, but also felt close).

Monastery Mentor is absurdly good as a sideboard card.

I then lost playing for t8 of the modern premier IQ to literal hooting mandrills. /wrist

I tested a mentor back during SCG Houston (ended up placing 19th at that event) when no one was prepared and it was insane in certain matchups. Now its a little more commonplace and more people are prepared but it can still run away with a game if they don't have removal in time for him.

[jarvisyu]

I tested a mentor back during SCG Houston (ended up placing 19th at that event) when no one was prepared and it was insane in certain matchups. Now its a little more commonplace and more people are prepared but it can still run away with a game if they don't have removal in time for him.

at the very least, it makes it much more difficult for people to sideboard versus you.

[Cipher]

Do you only bring Mentor in for the mirror and combo?

I'm tempted to just run Sulfur Elemental like Joe. Mentor seems like the kind of card you'd actually want to cut if you had enough slots against combo, and I'm not sure "The Cheese" is so strong that it's better than the elemental with flash.

[Lormador]

That makes a lot of sense.

I was really into the Mentor idea (and I'll still try him, of course)... but if it's true that he's coming in only for the mirror and combo, the Elemental has wider applicability (and looks pretty good head-to-head vs. a Mentor).

[owerbart]

Is Esper Miracles still a thing? I kinda want to play Miracles IRL (I play it from time to time in Cocka) but I only have Tundras and U. Seas, only one Volcanic. I do have a Moat tho.

I've heard that there's like 4 variations of Miracles, anyone can give a brief outlook on each one?

Or should I just build Deathblade