[BFZ]Battle for Zendikar spoilers thread

[Tylert]

I think they're interesting as 1-ofs in certain control builds, where having a land come into play untapped off a fetch can be relevant on turns 3+, but they don't want to make Burn/Aggro's job easier. It's almost certain they won't supplant the shocks, but they might complement them well in certain decks. The fact that they have basic land types makes them much more of a contender than most other dual-land cycles.

***

Not too enthused about the "Expeditions". I know I sound like the archetypal Magic player that would "complain if Wizard put $100 bills in packs", but it's hard not to see Wizards as taking advantage of the gambling aspect of pack-cracking more and more. First Mythics, then Modern Masters with the Goyf lottery, and now these. I don't think we'll be seeing Yu-Gi-Oh-style Super Ultra Secret Special Space Ghost Godzilla Rares that are mandatory for competitive constructed play, but it's another step towards Wizards selling scratch-off tickets that don't have an age restriction and preying upon people with low understanding of probability. Kinda shady, not too cool.

Just don't open packs.
I mean, why should we complain about this???
We are going to get extra 100$ bills in the packs for nothing. I won't open more packs than usual (3 a week for my draft plus the bonus packs when i win... ) and i'll be happy to get a chance to get these :)
Man, just stop complaining.
You'd better waste time upon lottery things :)

[Echelon]

The duals might be fine as a budget option in Nic Fit. I tend to fetch a basic Forest to cast my Dora the Explorer as often as I can. As soon as Dora dies that's all the basics one needs to have them enter the battlefield untapped.

[bruizar]

Battle of Wits approves of additional dual lands with basic land types

[Dice_Box]

They are a good card for EDH as well for people to fetch out and not having to spend 300 ish dollars on duals.

These things are going to hold value.

[jrsthethird]

The arts don't seem to fit the cards really well (I'm not saying that they aren't nice)

Shock lands all originated on Ravnica, a city plane, and the lands mostly represented manmade locations (a Fountain, Vents in what looks like a factory basement, a Shrine, a Garden, a Foundry, etc.). The new lands all seem to be situated on Zendikar, so they look more "natural." Not really sure what else to call the art theme, but that explains the difference.

[Kathal]

Battle of Wits approves of additional dual lands with basic land types

By far the most relevant adaptation of the new duals

Greetings,
Kathal

[Cire]

From a user known as Jhawk94 on artofmtg.com who correctly spoiled Gideon on the same date:

Ob Nixilis 3BB
+1 draw a card, lose a life
-3 destroy target creature
-8 target opponent gets an emblem that say "when you draw a card lose 2 life"
Jhawk94 cannot remember if he starts at 4 or 5

[Barook]

From a user known as Jhawk94 on artofmtg.com who correctly spoiled Gideon on the same date:

Ob Nixilis 3BB
+1 draw a card, lose a life
-3 destroy target creature
-8 target opponent gets an emblem that say "when you draw a card lose 2 life"
Jhawk94 cannot remember if he starts at 4 or 5

5 mana is really step for Legacy. It also depends on how high his starting loyality turns out (and whether or not his first ability says "target player" for synergy with his nonrelevant ultimate).

His first two abilities are pretty strong. But what deck would want to run him at that cost? Nic Fit already has the 5 mana Garruk.

[iamajellydonut]

Just don't open packs.
I mean, why should we complain about this???

Because printing money shouldn't become an acceptable substitute for printing a set that doesn't suck. Battle for Zendikar already looks like it's a confirmed set of set of hairy old balls and we still have four week of spoilers to go. But, oh, no, I can't complain because "they reprinted Shocklands!" or "they reprinted Fetchlands!" or "they reprinted Shocklands and Fetchlands!".

Eat shit.

I want to play Standard. I want to play Draft. But hell if I'm willing to suffer through these miserable cop-outs.

[Ace/Homebrew]

Eat shit.

I think it's a bit early to start recommending exotic cuisine. My understanding is WotC has really figured out how to make a good limited environment the last few sets. If they learned the lessons from the original Zendikar, then this should also be a fun limited block.

Plus it looks like Allies might be good. You like allies right?


I also think Tylert made a decent point. If you don't play the lottery in real life, don't feel obligated to play it in your hobby just because random packs contain uber rare money cards.

[HSCK]

Because printing money shouldn't become an acceptable substitute for printing a set that doesn't suck. Battle for Zendikar already looks like it's a confirmed set of set of hairy old balls and we still have four week of spoilers to go. But, oh, no, I can't complain because "they reprinted Shocklands!" or "they reprinted Fetchlands!" or "they reprinted Shocklands and Fetchlands!".

Eat shit.

I want to play Standard. I want to play Draft. But hell if I'm willing to suffer through these miserable cop-outs.

So when exactly have they made a good set?

[bruizar]

I want to play Standard. I want to play Draft. But hell if I'm willing to suffer through these miserable cop-outs.

People in Syria suffer. You need a reality check.

[Teveshszat]

Mornining

since people are cool and fast with saying set x is bad I want to ask what exactly are charactaristica of a good set?

I mean it can´t be that it has useful legacy cards in it cause to be honest Legacy is not the target format for Wotc and never was.
The Format they support with most sets is Standard, Modern and Limited. Yes sometimes a card is useful in Legacy but this is
nothing you should count on.

So when try to answer the question please resrtict youself and look for things which are relevant like playability in modern / standard
etc.

To be the first I don´t think the set is bad. Yes it is not the best set ever but it is not bad and big point for a plus are the new duels
which even can be played in Legacy.

[iamajellydonut]

I also think Tylert made a decent point. If you don't play the lottery in real life, don't feel obligated to play it in your hobby just because random packs contain uber rare money cards.

But I'm not upset that they're printing money in packs. I'm upset that they're using said money-infused packs to skimp on the overall quality of the set. I look forward to new sets. I look forward to seeing what new life is being breathed into the game. Only, for the past four years, I've remained disappointed. Origins had the potential to be a great bit of fresh air, but it seems to be immediately stifled by the hunk of garbage that is Battle for Zendikar.

[Jamaican Zombie Legend]

Just don't open packs.
I mean, why should we complain about this???
We are going to get extra 100$ bills in the packs for nothing. I won't open more packs than usual (3 a week for my draft plus the bonus packs when i win... ) and i'll be happy to get a chance to get these :)

It's mostly a "moral" thing, but there are some significant consequences.

Just seems shady to sell sets not based on them being fun to draft/play with but on the possibility of a "big score". Like I said, lottery sans government regulations. Packs have always been a gamble, but it seems like Wizards is really selling this aspect of them and making the payouts a lot bigger. Just doesn't sit well with me.

There's also the sharkiness and saltiness amplifying that happens when packs have $100 bills in them. Weekly drafts become a lot less friendly and social as grinder-types pour in to get value. It happened with Worldwake and Jace the Wallet-Sculptor. That's the only time I remember someone ever stealing from a (rare-back)draft, and Jace was only ~$60 at the time, if I recall (Bloodbraid keeping the big, blue dude down in Standard). I can't imagine the shadiness that might go on with ~$150 shocks/fetches, where there is serious incentive to pull some sleight of hand (especially easy given how the Zen basics they replace are probably going to be collected or kept by most folks rather than tossed in the middle of the table like typical draft basics).

Not a fun environment to play in.

I think it's a bit early to start recommending exotic cuisine. My understanding is WotC has really figured out how to make a good limited environment the last few sets.

I dunno. Tarkir block as a whole was really fun, yes, but the preceding blocks (RTR and Theros) were complete crap and Origins, while fun to draft, isn't so much fun to play because of Wizard's insistence that removal be dogshit for vague, unspecified reasons, leading to extremely, fast, swingy, beatdown-centric games.

[MGB]

It's mostly a "moral" thing, but there are some significant consequences.

Just seems shady to sell sets not based on them being fun to draft/play with but on the possibility of a "big score". Like I said, lottery sans government regulations. Packs have always been a gamble, but it seems like Wizards is really selling this aspect of them and making the payouts a lot bigger. Just doesn't sit well with me.

There's also the sharkiness and saltiness amplifying that happens when packs have $100 bills in them. Weekly drafts become a lot less friendly and social as grinder-types pour in to get value. It happened with Worldwake and Jace the Wallet-Sculptor. That's the only time I remember someone ever stealing from a (rare-back)draft, and Jace was only ~$60 at the time, if I recall (Bloodbraid keeping the big, blue dude down in Standard). I can't imagine the shadiness that might go on with ~$150 shocks/fetches, where there is serious incentive to pull some sleight of hand (especially easy given how the Zen basics they replace are probably going to be collected or kept by most folks rather than tossed in the middle of the table like typical draft basics).

Not a fun environment to play in.

"Grinder-types"? Can we get a taxonomic description of such a species? Does it usually feature a things like a "neckbeard"?

[Barook]

GSZ-able creature removal. Probably too expensive for Legacy, but who knows what Elves and Nic Fit could come up with.

[Teknique]

GSZ-able creature removal. Probably too expensive for Legacy, but who knows what Elves and Nic Fit could come up with.

I feel like you missed the Devoid part.

[Barook]

I feel like you missed the Devoid part.

Yeah, I was just looking at the manacost. Nevermind then.

[firebadmattgood]

GSZ cannot grab colorless cards.

edit, derp.