it's not my list (and I would not insert Jace in my own), but it's a nice card: cheap, good blocker, gives flashback to cantrip or s&t. Honestly I prefer trinket mage, changing a little the listOriginally Posted by caprino
only 2 main creatures?
as a deck archetype you find it competitive with the destination for now?
I couldn't imagine playing this deck without Crop Rotation or Primeval Titan, but let me know how this list does!
yeah, I agree with you. But there are some things that really worry me recently:
1) growing number of burn deck: at least in my meta, modern is getting abandoned. Thus, a lot of burn player are coming to legacy, since the passage is cheap. Price of Progress is hell: glacial chasm can stop it for some rounds, but actually the ONLY solution to win against burn is S&T into platinum emperion. not enough for me.
2) blood moon/back to basic/magus of the moon MAINDECK: finding a "funny" opponent with this card mainboard (for some reason) means game loss generally.
3) chalice of the void: with new eldrazi this card is becoming more present in the meta. It's not gg if it enters the battlefield, but it's very annoying.....no cantrip, no crop rotation, no candelabra, we have to hope in the topdeck or digging the library with a sensei already in play. Not a wonderful situation.
I will keep playing with no FoW at the moment, but I think putting 3 of them maindeck and build a deck around them is not a crazy idea. Beside all the points above, fow is always good against fast combo decks, quite annoying for a classical 12post list.
Chalice and Blood Moon are both answered by Krosan Grip, which, while sideboard, will give you enough game for 2 and/or 3 if you need them. Chalice is annoying but not absolutely back-breaking, the Eldrazi deck is pretty fast though so it's not a great matchup game 1. I haven't played it since I added Emperion to the list though so it might not be as bad as it was before since they have little in the way of interacting with it once it hits the board.
Blood Moon is annoying, but the only deck that plays it mainboard that is making any sort of waves right now is Painter's Servant, the matchup I don't think is that bad, I lost to it but I really didn't have a good idea of what was going on so I didn't necessarily play optimally enough and my list at the time didn't have Krosan Grips in the 75. Blowing up the entire board with an Ugin is fun though.
Burn, I haven't seen in ages. I feel like Eldrazi is a potentially cheaper deck for people leaving modern anyways, it's certainly a better deck than Burn is, especially in larger tournaments. I haven't given the matchup much thought, but yes Emperion is likely the only solid answer right now. Even with that said I'm not sure if I would actually bring Force of Will in, losing 2 cards seems really bad in that match, even for a price of progress. I'd think Flusterstorm would be good enough for the most part. If you sideboard chalice, a chalice on 2 will work fairly well too - Smash to Smithereens and Ancient Grudge both get countered by it, so it protects itself. And chalice on 1 almost locks them out (I'd prioritize on putting it down on 2 though).
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Have tried the ugw build which was a ton of fun and also the mono green build but wanted to try comething a bit more unique with the mono green build. Here is my current experiment. I call it living posts!!! I didn't want the living wishes to really get the posts but more utility or a vesuva to copy posts. Mirror pool is a test card and has proven useful so far. Veteran explorer has been amazing and couldn't see playing gsz without it. That is why the phyrexian tower is there to sac veteran but as I said still testing.....
3 Living Wish
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
3 Crop Rotation
3 Sensei's Divining Top
3 Pithing Needle
4 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Veteran Explorer
4 Windswept Heath
3 Forest
1 Plains
3 Vesuva
4 Explore
1 Moment's Peace
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
4 Primeval Titan
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
1 Kozilek, the Great Distortion
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Karakas
1 Savannah
2 Candelabra of Tawnos
1 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
1 Dryad Arbor
1 Cavern of Souls
1 Mirrorpool
1 Phyrexian Tower
SB: 1 Peacekeeper
SB: 1 Vesuva
SB: 1 Maze of Ith
SB: 1 Bojuka Bog
SB: 1 Reclamation Sage
SB: 1 Gaddock Teeg
SB: 1 Ethersworn Canonist
SB: 1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
SB: 1 Magus of the Tabernacle
SB: 4 Leyline of Sanctity
SB: 1 Bane of Progress
SB: 1 Platinum Emperion
When I was maindecking FoW x3, in the cruise/dig era, I targeted 17 blue cards.
3x Force of Will
3x Repeal
4x Brainstorm
2x Ponder
1x TrinketMage
3x Show and Tell
1x Fact or Fiction
Against fair decks, I would aggressively FoW cards in Game 1. Usually with the plan to board them out with 3 matchup specific cards. Obviously a FoW build has to be significantly different, no stirrings/warping wails main. One thing from that era I didn't like was having to go shields down on colored sources to cast the ponders. I was contemplating trying impulses in that slot so you could EoT them.
I write the brew corner column, my fiance writes the hope eternal column. I brewed this back when Battle came out for her and she really liked it, then we decided to come back to it after the spoilers of Oath and she is loving this new version. She wrote an article today about the deck in question. It is fun playing around with weird cards and taking old archetypes to new levels.
This list is very interesting. I like it a lot. Let me know how the testing goes
So I ran this last night in an 8 man, 3 rounds. I didn't have the 2nd Emperion because my buddy couldn't come out, so I put a Kozilek (Butcher of Truth) in its place instead - it ended up being a bit more relevant than if it had have been an Emperion just due to the matchups (I sided Emperion out in every single one).
[0-0-1] Round 1 vs Shardless BUG - Draw(1-1-1):
This is a buddy of mine, we always have very grindy matches when we play...I really think it's about as 50/50 a match as anything. Constantly looking to improve my play choices, mull choices etc here. Hymns and Lilianas are hard to beat. I don't recall much of it, just that game 3 we came down to time and there was no way we were getting anywhere...he probably had the game locked up unless I pulled out a miracle though, so in hindsight I should have just conceded because a draw is a loss (prizing based on x-0, x-1).
Sideboarding for this match:
-1 Candle
-1 Platinum Emperion
+2 Relic of Progenitus
Notes: I pulled the Candle because he plays (and sideboards in) a few abrupt decays, and I didn't think I really needed it, where a Relic would be better. Platinum Emperion just dies to Liliana, he's there to shore up aggro matches anyways.
[1-0-1] Round 2 vs Jund - Win (2-0):
This is the match I most remember. Game 1 I had not much going on, built a board with 2 Cloudpost, Tropical Island and a Forest I believe, along with a Candle. Nothing else really going on in hand, had a Crop Rotation in hand as well. Liliana came down on 3 and I'm able to get a needle or anything on board to deal with her, she goes off on turn 6, and he gives me a choice of Tropical Island, Cloudpost, Candle vs Cloudpost, Tropical and one other land (forest I think?). I keep the Candle pile, he wastelands the Cloudpost, which I Crop Rotate away to get another Cloudpost. He lands another Liliana and starts ticking up, I'm playing off the top of my deck but between Warping Wails casting on Liliana +1 to make Scions, holding off Tarmogoyfs while I'm at low life, and drawing the MVP card that is Sea-Gate Wreckage (drew me 3 cards under Liliana!) I manage to cast a Titan to stabilize with a couple glimmerposts (I believe I had picked up a Vesuva before this to copy cloudpost). The titan died to Liliana -2 (she was at 6 so it was a bit of a decision for him). I then proceed to rip a Kozilek off a Top spin, cast him drawing 2 Titans, of which I then cast another one. I was at 1 life at the worst, managed to go up to 20 when he conceded.
Sideboard:
-1 Platinum Emperion
+1 Relic of Progenitus
Notes: Would prefer 2 Relics, and would have sideboarded the same as vs Shardless BUG but Candle was the only reason (well, along with Sea-Gate) that I was able to recover. So I left it in.
Game 2: Show and Tell Titan on Turn 3 and ended up going for Emrakul a couple turns later. It wasn't close.
[1-1-1] Round 3 vs Omnitell - Loss(0-2):
I had glanced at this guys match earlier when I was playing round 1, and I had seen an Emrakul on board but not Omni, so I just figured he was playing Sneak and Show. That made for a very rude surprise when he cast Show and Tell. I crop rotated for Karakas in response, and Warping Wailed the Show and Tell. It got Forced, and I put in a Kozilek off Show and Tell. He flipped over an Omniscience. I then wanted to flip the table.
Sideboard:
-1 Platinum Emperion
-1 Kozilek
-1 Ugin
-3 Show and Tell
-2 Pithing Needle
-1 Ancient Stirrings
-1 Bojuka Bog
-1 Sensei's Divining Top (I think)
+2 Flusterstorm
+2 Mindbreak Trap
+3 Krosan Grip
+3 Thought-Knot Seer
+2 Chalice of the Void
Game 2 I had Candle with Crop rotation available, Primeval Titan and Thought-Knot Seer in hand. He Gitaxian Probed me and saw everything (except Titan wasn't in my hand at that point). He went for Show and Tell, I dropped Thought-Knot Seer and took his Emrakul, but he had Burning Wish to go grab Enter the Infinite. Unfortunately I didn't have Warping Wail, so I died again. Thought-Knot Seer definitely makes this matchup better though. I just need to mulligan better against this deck. (It's still going to be a bad matchup though).
Ultimately, I'm fairly happy with the cards in the list. Emperion got sided out every match, but that's just because I didn't face any of the matchups he'd be in for (DnT, Elves, Storm, Eldrazi, Delver decks). I'd be happy to continue testing him. I think I miss the 3rd needle, I've always been big on them because they're so versatile. They definitely help vs Liliana, in addition to natural mode of Wasteland. I'm unsure about Candelabra, I feel like 2 is better, but I also am unsure if I really have the room - when they're good they're good, but I've also won without them a lot. I know they're much more necessary in the mono-g or R/G versions, since you don't have access to Show and Tell, and that's another thing I'm considering, whether I might be better off switching to R/G to get access to goodies like Kozilek's Return. The only thing really keeping me in blue is Show and Tell (which is a good card and a good reason to be blue), and Brainstorm isn't terrible although frankly not as necessarily powerful as it could be. It smooths out possible hand draws, helps you hide from discard - maybe I'm underrating it just because I'm so used to it I'm not noticing it's effects, and am blinded more by the scenarios where I can't shuffle away and get locked with garbage which happens more often than I'd like.
Testing Tonight against Eldrazi
http://www.twitch.tv/ehhhhhhh
i'll be streaming this weekend with my mono green / white build
write liste in this post thanks
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
4 Sensei's Divining Top
4 Crop Rotation
2 Expedition Map
3 Snow-Covered Forest
2 Savannah
4 Primeval Titan
1 Karakas
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Cloudpost
4 Glimmerpost
1 Dark Depths
2 Vesuva
1 Eye of Ugin
2 Cavern of Souls
1 Thespian's Stage
3 Warping Wail
1 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
1 Veteran Explorer
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
3 Green Sun's Zenith
2 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Snow-Covered Plains
2 Pithing Needle
2 Moment's Peace
4 Windswept Heath
1 The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Glacial Chasm
4 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Rest in Peace
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Gaddock Teeg
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Krosan Grip
2 Circle of Protection: Red
1 Dawnstrider
2 Moat
1 Ethersworn Canonist
I have to agree, or at least concede that recent developments are very interesting. It seems, Colorless Eldrazi has done in short time what cloudpost hasn't been able to do in several years - namely, break into the format. I had to take a respite from post because, quite simply its very frustrating to play when nearly every other deck sans miracles is smaller, cheaper and faster and post just doesn't pay off. Most of the best new tools are represented in this list of yours, and has some overlap with recent successful lists by experienced players, as well as some old favorites of this thread. I need to look at how these colorless matches have been playing out, alas, unsupported format is ...unsupported. Not sure I agree with everything here, crusher could easily be replaced with something more classic post, ostone, ugin, or all is dust maybe.
ahaha nice, i'm testing impulses as we speak. Replacing AS and adding stifles. impulsing into FoW (or surgical post board) is quite nice, but i'm not sure this is the way to go...
Nice list...no candelabra?
So i ran the living wish version which provided a huge amoubt of utility. The card that surpised.me the most was peacekeeper out of board which blanked a infect opponent and won the game. The deck felt extremely powerful but clunky at times. I was considering adding in warping wails but wanna here what people have to say about them. In terms to the living wish version i would shave on the gsz which clogged up my hand alot and i could assemble my posts fast enough. Im not sure what would help with it, i did use explore but is exploration a possible solution? Also the list i posted i did a quick switch for 1 veteran explorer for a knight of the reliquary as a gsz target which definitely diversified my threats and added an additional search engine. Im tempted to go back to ugw posts just for the raw power of show and tell and terminus. I played that version last week and went 3-1 at a local. With the uwg version i beat u/r delver, storm (somehow didnt even have flusterstorms, reanimator and lost to another u/r delver player. I will keep switching between versions and brewing with living wish its really incredible.
I played astral slide in legacy for a while and it ran living wish with peacekeeper in the board. Great for the elves match up as well as infect. I had a lot of fun with it. Peacekeeper can really throw an opponent off and keep you safe while you assemble an engine.
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